Beretta 92 billennium

[Supah 0]

heheheh i dont have a criminal record (that i am aware of) I have the money. I have the inclination. I am a responsible adult ( do NOT listen to my girlfriend ) yet i am not allowed to own a firearm in the netherlands. But i dont need one either

[Warin 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Renagade @ Nov. 28 2002,01:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">and heres what to do in the UK to get one not that i`d actually want one at the moment other than out of prinicple.

1. find shady guy in shady place

2. gain money from underhand dealings

3. use money to buy gun from local drug barons

4. fire gun as many times before being caught and sent off to jail

5. goto 1<span id='postcolor'>

LOL

The UK is an example of how stupid knee jerk legislation makes things impossible for rational law abiding folks..but nothing to stop criminals!

These are some good writings on gun control and the UK.

[Renagade 0]

There should be legislation passed to prevent knee jerk reactions being made or p[olititions jumping on the bandwagon to earn some cheap votes.

Take pistols being banned in the aftermath of dunblane there wasn`t a fully legitimate case for banning handguns even though it was a terrible tradegy.

Without being disrespectful to the victims i think the reason that they wanted handguns banned was more to do with a psychological mourning strategy and u can`t blame them for being irrational after it but u can blame everyone and their goat for capitalising on it.

[Warin 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Renagade @ Nov. 28 2002,06:45)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">There should be legislation passed to prevent knee jerk reactions being made or p[olititions jumping on the bandwagon to earn some cheap votes.

Take pistols being banned in the aftermath of dunblane there wasn`t a fully legitimate case for banning handguns even though it was a terrible tradegy.

Without being disrespectful to the victims i think the reason that they wanted handguns banned was more to do with a psychological mourning strategy and u can`t blame them for being irrational after it but u can blame everyone and their goat for capitalising on it.<span id='postcolor'>

Exactly. The people of Dunblaine had a legitimate right to have a great deal of grief and also a lot of anger at guns. Sadly the folks that make the laws had a great lack of sense in taking that justifiable grief and using it to perpetrate a rather unjust set of restrictions on everyone in the UK.

[shadow 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Mister Frag @ Nov. 28 2002,01:26)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (RalphWiggum @ Nov. 27 2002,15:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">personally, i see no difference in performance btw the 2. however, looks better though <span id='postcolor'>

The Billenium has a micro-adjustable rear sight and a trigger with adjustable over-travel. It also has additional serrations and stipling on the frame and slide to improve the grip and handling.

These features would be quite desireable in a gun used for tactical shooting, either in competitions (IPSC or similar) or defensive situations.<span id='postcolor'>

That's also one of the reasons I want it.

I'm going to take a practical-shooting-course next spring.

As I've always loved Beretta's design and look, that Billennium should be the perfect handgun for me considering the extra features it has over the standard version.

Warin: We got the same procedures/laws/requirements over here too. I think its pretty common. I have no problem with it either (took me 2 days to receive the approved forms for buying a .22 and a 9).

Only difference over here is that you have to buy a safe before you request a license for a caliber. It's backwards but understandable.

[madmedic 0]

What country are you in Shadow ?

Assault(CAN)... Move on down here to Florida, we'll get you fixed up with what you want,...and then go do some serious shootin.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (madmedic @ Nov. 29 2002,07:21)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What country are you in Shadow ?<span id='postcolor'>

Look at the flag in his sig, it might give you a hint

Shadow: Why don't you buy a modern gun instead of that all metal relic

But seriously, if you want a good gun for practical shooting take a look at polymer guns like the Walther P99 or a Glock. I would never go back to steel framed guns.

[shadow 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Nov. 29 2002,07:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">But seriously, if you want a good gun for practical shooting take a look at polymer guns like the Walther P99 or a Glock. I would never go back to steel framed guns.<span id='postcolor'>

I don't like Glock.

I'm looking at a P22 w/Silencer -so a P99 would be a waste of money for me...................when my economy allows it :see below

Polymer in all its glory eh

But I know, a SOCOM is not suited for practical-shooting, that's why I want that sweet Billennium. And if you have'nt noticed by now, I am a Beretta-maniac.

Just love'em, though I have'nt started taking mine to bed ...yet

[madmedic 0]

Theres nothing wrong with a SOCOM for practical shooting (aside from it being a bit bulky for concealed carry)

they are very accurate, and reliable. And not so big as to hinder fast target aquisition/transition.

I have a USP45 full size in my collection (basically the same as a SOCOM, but without the threaded, "o-ring" barrel)

It is one of the most accurate handguns I have ever owned (and I have owned quite a few)

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Wow. The Canadian Government sucks!  They want to make sure I am competent to own a gun before giving me one!  How dare they try to ensure that it will be handled properly and be accounted for!

You know..before putting your mouth in gear, you might want to engage your brain.

<span id='postcolor'>

Whatever.

So when you buy a handgun you need transfer permits just to move it around, you can't use it for self-defence (that's a crime here )  Then you have to register it, because registering it will somehow make it safer for the public, law abiding gun owners are pretty dangerous people you know

Stupid laws apply to rifles too. They moved the AR-15 series rifle from the 'non-restricted' class to 'restricted' simply because it is an 'assault rifle', even though other types of semi-autos are still considered 'non-restricted'.

Besides, the CFC doesn't know its ass from a hole in the ground. On thier approved 'safety course', part of the process that involves making sure the gun is clear requires you to look down the muzzle!

I can't believe that the government has spent almost $1 billion dollars on a registration drive that will only lead to the confiscation of firearms in the future. It hasn't even reduced the crime rate.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Assault(CAN)... Move on down here to Florida, we'll get you fixed up with what you want,...and then go do some serious shootin.<span id='postcolor'>

Hmmm.

Warm weather, nice people, hot chicks, and guns. Sign me up!  

I probably wouldn't move to Florida though, I wouldn't want my house flooded when the polar ice caps melt.   I think Texas is a good option though.

Tyler

[Tex -USMC- 0]

You'd like Texas- I'd steer clear of anything west of Abilene though

[ralphwiggum 6]

i held(not fired) HK USP .40 compact and .45 full size, and gotta say that full size fits my hands better. Compact just isn't big enough (duh).

I think P22 looks great. it's relatively new, so i haven't fired one, but seems ok. i wonder if Shaodw meant barrel extender, not suppressor.

speaking of plastic, i kinda understand what denoir is referring to. plastic frames feel better in your hands. we are used to the feeling of plastic in our hands, so maybe that's why we prefer it.(aside from oiling and cleaning).

[shadow 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (RalphWiggum @ Nov. 29 2002,18:46)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i held(not fired) HK USP .40 compact and .45 full size, and gotta say that full size fits my hands better. Compact just isn't big enough (duh).

I think P22 looks great. it's relatively new, so i haven't fired one, but seems ok. i wonder if Shaodw meant barrel extender, not suppressor.

speaking of plastic, i kinda understand what denoir is referring to. plastic frames feel better in your hands. we are used to the feeling of plastic in our hands, so maybe that's why we prefer it.(aside from oiling and cleaning).<span id='postcolor'>

I did mean a supressor, not a barrel-extender. The P22 is ready for a supressor right out of the box

I have tried the USP9 with and without a supressor. I liked it alot except I feel more comfy with my own Beretta with a Hogue rubber-grip with fingergrooves.

I've tried the P22 with and without a supressor aswell. I figured I can only afford a supressor for one or two handguns so I want one with a P22 (cheap supressor) and one for a larger caliber. A Socom is ready for a supressor out of the box so I might buy one for the Socom. Over here all (good) supressors costs the same regardless of the caliber except .22's

The brand everybody is recomending is "Brugger&Thomet" (the same brand that makes the "official supressor for the Socom)  <--Expensive

Regarding the Socom and practical shooting. There is no real holsters for it to be used effectively

I already got a CRSpeed for my Beretta. I did'nt dish out 300$ for it and then not use it (A Socom does'nt fit).

[Mister Frag 0]

I've got both a full-size and a compact USP, and I definitely like the feel and handling of the full-size better. The full-size is easier to hold, and has the double recoil springs that the compact versions lack.

These two differences and the increased mass reduce the felt recoil impulse and muzzle climb and make follow-up shots faster.

[madmedic 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Assault (CAN) @ Nov. 29 2002,18:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Stupid laws apply to rifles too. They moved the AR-15 series rifle from the 'non-restricted' class to 'restricted' simply because it is an 'assault rifle', even though other types of semi-autos are still considered 'non-restricted'.<span id='postcolor'>

Yea,...In the U.S. the stupidest (is that a word?) laws are directed at rifles.

Ladies and Gentlemen,....I present to you the 1994 Crime Bill...brought to you by The Brady Campaign,.. The Violence Policy Center,.. and un-informed Left Wing Liberals accross the nation...

First, they came up with an EVIL catch phrase: (ASSAULT WEAPONS) to demonize the guns they were going after.  Then they came up with their OWN definition of the word "ASSAULT RIFLE".

(Their definition is: "A semi automatic firearm having more than two of the following features: 1) a flash suppressor (oh my!...how incredibly dangerous) 2) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously below the action (THAT is a direct quote) 3) a bayonett lug (no doubt a response to that little known rash of drive-by bayonettings that never made the evening news 4) a collapsing, or folding buttstock (because everybody knows that if you fold down the buttstock of an AK47,...you can easily hide the whole rifle in the front pocket of your blue jeans, and sneak into a bank with it) 5) a detachable magazine capable of holding more that ten rounds.

The ACTUAL definition of "ASSAULT RIFLE by the military has more to do with specific standards for weight, accuracy, and the ability to fire FULL AUTO, or BURST as well as semi auto.

The next step was to win over the members of the public who didnt happen to know anything about firearms, or just had no interest in them by making the following absurd statements (among others), and repeating them until anyone who reads a newspaper could recite them by verbatim:

1.."Assault rifles are the weapon of choice for criminals"

(FACT=LESS than ONE PECENT of crime in the U.S. is or was committed using an assault weapon)

2.."ALL ASSAULT WEAPONS are designed to be FIRED FROM THE HIP, and SPRAY bullets at crowds of people"

(FACT= ANY properly trained soldier would certainly find THAT amusing)

3.."ASSAULT WEAPONS are VERY INACCURATE, and therefore serve NO SPORTING PURPOSE"

(Hmmm)

4.."The AR15, and SIMILAR RIFLES are capable of hitting targets SIX THOUSAND !!!! yards away...and therefore highly attractive to snipers

(Ummm....number "3", and number "4" sorta have a "ying and yang" thing goin on dont they?)

Many other ludicrous statements like that have been made throughout recent history.

The 1994 Crime bill did nothing but change the COSMETIC FEATURES allowed on "sport utility rifles" built after 1994....you can still have a pistol grip, and a detachable magazine if you dont have a bayonett lug or flash suppressor, (and vise versa)....AND rifles built BEFORE 1994 are not subject to this stupid law.

It did NOT take any rifles off the street, and had NO effect on crime.

so-called ASSAULT WEAPONS are almost NEVER used to commit crimes,...but when one IS...the media jumps right on it, and gets the whole world thinking the U.S. is a war zone

That is a FEDERAL LAW...some states (like California, and New Jersey)...have made their own, more restrictive versions, all but outlawing ownership of "so-called ASSAULT RIFLES" totally

(And they continue to be two of the most crime infested states in some areas)

Im glad to live in Florida,...it is a very gun owner friendly state.  We have "shall issue" concealed carry permits, no "ASSAULT WEAPON" laws other than the Federal ones,

and you can own a legally registered machinegun with the proper approval/paperwork.

Most of the states are like this (I believe there are 35 states that allow machineguns...I could be wrong, but the number is somewhere around there)

[madmedic 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Shadow @ Nov. 29 2002,21:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I've tried the P22 with and without a supressor aswell. I figured I can only afford a supressor for one or two handguns so I want one with a P22 (cheap supressor) and one for a larger caliber. A Socom is ready for a supressor out of the box so I might buy one for the Socom. Over here all (good) supressors costs the same regardless of the caliber except .22's<span id='postcolor'>

What are the laws regarding suppressors like in your country?

Here (Florida) and many of the other states, they are regulated the same way machineguns are (You can own one after filling out the proper paperwork with the ATF, and jumping through all of their hoops)

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (madmedic @ Nov. 29 2002,22:24)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What are the laws regarding suppressors like in your country?<span id='postcolor'>

In Sweden you can get a suppressor very easily if there is a reason for it (if the noise could bother other people).

Also, please keep the gun politics out of this thread, ok?

[shadow 6]

Over here you just go to a weapon-store , show your license and buy a silencer/supressor (you can only buy a silencer for a caliber you have a license for ofcourse). No paperwork needed.

I believe the government here thinks its nice that people use silencers (less noise).

When it comes to gun-control the government really dont know what they are talking about. They got it all backwards.

For starters: legal weapons are'nt ones that comit the most crimes. It's the unregistered ones.

Second: Pistols already got the strictest laws. You are allowed to only carry it and use it on designated firing-ranges. Keep it in the trunk when you are driving to and from the range. Yet still, most crimes are committed by unregistered rifles like the G3 or old mausers.

Third: A weapons-safe is required to get a pistol-license. Not required for shotguns and rifles. Still, most crimes are again comitted with a rifle.

Fourth: You only have one pistol of each caliber. This to minimize thr amount of wepons for each citizen. Again, most crimes are comitted with rifles. No such law for rifles and shotguns.

Fifth: You get a license for a pistol only if you're a member of a registered club.

This was added a few months ago: You will also have to take part in competitions to prove that you actually need a pistol today. So if you're not competing, you're not shooting.  ERRRR can everybody say the word "hobby" ?

Ofcourse there are ways to "bend" these laws. Like explain to the authorities that you need a backup-weapon for competition-use (This is what I'll have to do if I want another .22 without getting rid of the old one).

The effect of these laws that some stupid politics made, is this:

When you see a person with a rifle in the woods, you think "aaah, a hunter".

When you see a person with a pistol in the woods, you think "oooh shi**. A criminal".

But these stupid politicians will not understand that the reason for all weapon-crimes are

unregistered rifles, NOT PISTOLS!!!  

edit: Saw your post, Den ....after I wrote this

[madmedic 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Nov. 29 2002,22:41)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also, please keep the gun politics out of this thread, ok? <span id='postcolor'>

Sorry,...my post on the previous page started out as a short comment on rediculous gun laws...but before I knew it...I had written a whole thesis

[STS_SolidSnake 0]

what are the pistols law in switzerland?

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (STS_SolidSnake @ Nov. 29 2002,23:32)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">what are the pistols law in switzerland?<span id='postcolor'>

you need to be able to

1) hold a chocolate along with in the grip

2)must be usable in case your pondue fork is lost.

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Still, most crimes are again comitted with a rifle.

<span id='postcolor'>

In Norway?

Obviously not in the U.S., it's the other way around.

[Aaron Kane 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (RalphWiggum @ Nov. 30 2002,00:18)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (STS_SolidSnake @ Nov. 29 2002,23:32)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">what are the pistols law in switzerland?<span id='postcolor'>

you need to be able to

1) hold a chocolate along with in the grip

2)must be usable in case your pondue fork is lost.

<span id='postcolor'>

LOL!

[shadow 6]

9--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Assault (CAN) @ Nov. 30 2002,069)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Still, most crimes are again comitted with a rifle.

<span id='postcolor'>

In Norway?

Obviously not in the U.S., it's the other way around.<span id='postcolor'>

Yes, in Norway rifles are mostly used in criminal happenings.

Usually it's stolen G3's from a military divission called "Hjemme-vernet". This is a division made up of people with a military-training but they keep all military effects including their personal weapon at home.

I must say that it's embarrasing that Norway's most effective defence lies in the hands of some redneck weekend-warriors

Wish we could just terminate that division and build a professional military.

No longer than 2 months back one man of this unit killed his wife, 2 kids and himself.   And this is'nt the first time n incident like that has happend

[STS_SolidSnake 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (RalphWiggum @ Nov. 30 2002,00:18)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (STS_SolidSnake @ Nov. 29 2002,23:32)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">what are the pistols law in switzerland?<span id='postcolor'>

you need to be able to

1) hold a chocolate along with in the grip

2)must be usable in case your pondue fork is lost.

<span id='postcolor'>

The best rifle was made in switzerland

http://www.wmsa.net/news/SwissNews/sn-020928_swiss_gun_laws.htm

swiss made

swiss ration