aleksadragutin 9 Posted January 16, 2015 Off course Serbs and Croats had to fight each other in the interests of the empires they were under, but there was no hatred, just business (Serbs fought on both sides). After WW1 the ideal option for Serbia was just to add territories inhabited by Serbs and thus expand. No one forced either Croatia or Slovenia to enter Yugoslavia, and there certainly was no hatred from the Serbian side since in WW1 Serbs in Austro-Hungary were also forced to fight Serbia. Without going anymore offtopic, I'm going to say that that hatred is relatively new (hatred of Albanians in Serbia has only started after 1998). So it isn't really any older than the hatred between Ukraine and Russia, if anything it's newer, because communist Yugoslavia was much more liberal than the rest of the communist world. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 16, 2015 Off course Serbs and Croats had to fight each other in the interests of the empires they were under, but there was no hatred, just business (Serbs fought on both sides). After WW1 the ideal option for Serbia was just to add territories inhabited by Serbs and thus expand. No one forced either Croatia or Slovenia to enter Yugoslavia, and there certainly was no hatred from the Serbian side since in WW1 Serbs in Austro-Hungary were also forced to fight Serbia. Without going anymore offtopic, I'm going to say that that hatred is relatively new (hatred of Albanians in Serbia has only started after 1998). So it isn't really any older than the hatred between Ukraine and Russia, if anything it's newer, because communist Yugoslavia was much more liberal than the rest of the communist world. Nobody asked Croatia and Slovenia if they want to be under Serbian rule after WW1. There were a few pan slavists, people who thought that it would be best for all south slavs to live in one nation, the most popular among them the Croatian Ante Trumbic. He advocated a state of all south slavs to put aside past differences. However the Serbian Prime Minister Nikola Pasic prefered an enlarged Serbia instead of a unified Yugoslavia. They both agreed on a compromise. Yugoslavia was to be the Kingdom of the nations of Serbians, Croats and Slovenes, ruled by the Serbian Karadordevic dynasty. This was manifested in the Corfu declaration of 1917. However Trumbic was betrayed. The new constitution from 1921 put Serbs as the primary nation inside a new unitary monarchy of Yugoslavia. They abolished the old traditional regions and made up new districts. The government was centralized under Serb rule. Croatian politicians like Stjepan Radic, the leader of the Croatian party, were frequently arrested. Police preassure was used to rig elections in favour of the Serbian radical party. During an assembly in 1928 a member of the Serbian government party PuniÅ¡a RaÄić shot five members of the Croatian peasant party, including Stjepan Radic who died together with two others. After this event the opposition in the parliament withdrew from it. The Serbian King then abolished the constitution and formed a dictatorship. Many Croatian politicians had to leave the country, including Ante Pavelic, who later formed the Ustasa movement and became dictator of Croatia after Nazi Germany conquered Yugoslavia. In 1932 the Croatians issued the Zagreb Manifesto which sought to end Serbian hegemony and dictatorship in Yugoslavia. This led to many Croatians beeing arrested. Tensions continued to rise until it all collapsed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted January 16, 2015 Let's just end the discussion here, in order not to spam the thread any more. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 16, 2015 Sure, jus don´t try to argue with anyone who had history as his primary subject ;) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted January 16, 2015 Sure, jus don´t try to argue with anyone who had history as his primary subject ;) Oh, don't worry, I know history alright, this is just not the place for that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maio 293 Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) DPR takes control over Donetsk airport after Kiev troops withdrawal — DPR defense ministryDONETSK, January 16. /TASS/. All Ukrainian troops have withdrawn from the territory of the Donetsk international airport, the Donetsk News Agency said on Friday, citing the defense ministry of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic (DPR). http://itar-tass.com/en/world/771616 Edited January 16, 2015 by Maio Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 16, 2015 This time for real or is it propaganda again? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maio 293 Posted January 16, 2015 This time for real or is it propaganda again? No idea, but there is this, which BTW needs a translation :D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) He's saying that people would die for that flag, and that they are peaceful people and that they don't want war. From the title it looks like it's the flag from the cyborgs. Edited January 16, 2015 by aleksadragutin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 16, 2015 Well, If this time they really captured the airport, then maybe the control tower was strategically more significant than I thoght. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spooky lynx 73 Posted January 16, 2015 No idea, but there is this, which BTW needs a translation :D Zaharchenko says they captured this flag in new airport terminal and asks Poroshenko to come and take the flag back. View from captured new airport terminal, 4th floor: And... Fresh tombs of mainly unknown UA soldiers near Dnepropetrovsk. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted January 16, 2015 There is definitely still fighting going on. Screencap from a few minutes ago: Heres a drone video from yesterday: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mistyronin 1181 Posted January 16, 2015 Well, If this time they really captured the airport, then maybe the control tower was strategically more significant than I thoght. It was really important, it was the point the Ukraine's Army used for spotting and guiding their ops, also for sniping those who dared to advance. It was an important point, psychologically, strategically and and tactically. So this time I think it's more probable that they have captured it or will soon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted January 16, 2015 Oh and heres a video made in the new terminal by the army from today. So yeah, no idea who is holding it right now, but it wouldn't be the first time the separatists came so far. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 16, 2015 Yeah they have been advancing into the new terminal a few times by now but never managed to advance further than that. I think it is the same this time. The area is huge and by now full of fortified positions and trenchlines, I doubt that they cold capture it all so soon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spooky lynx 73 Posted January 17, 2015 Oh and heres a video made in the new terminal by the army from today. So yeah, no idea who is holding it right now, but it wouldn't be the first time the separatists came so far. That's old video renamed to 16.01.15. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) That's old video renamed to 16.01.15. Can you provide the original video? Oh and according to Interfax the separatists have completely captured the airport again after completely capturing the airport yesterday, while the Ukrainian side reports (citing volunteers) that the separatists are asking for a temporary ceasefire so they can collect the killed. Also heres a facebook post from today (translated) WCT. Situation as at 17.01.2015 09.30Fight at the terminal yesterday lasted until 23.00. Our artillery worked well, the goals were destroyed. Around 22.30 our reaktivschiki successfully posted two full package "hail". Terrorists are significant losses. Our guys stayed at previous positions. On our side, two dead and 23 seriously wounded. Currently, negotiations are underway with the 23.00 to the field command of the separatists to skip the ambulance to the terminal through a checkpoint separatists. This is exactly the scenario that we have to use in order to save our wounded. And cries about it can not be. Information about the movement of armored columns from Gorlovki towards the airport is not confirmed. Yesterday afternoon Subdivisions sectors, are "cleansing" holiday village fun that puts pressure on the flank of the enemy, busy airport. The volunteers there are wounded, but not irretrievable losses. At the separatists have been killed. For information on the use by terrorists of chemical gases. This issue must be taken very carefully and make the necessary expertise. If the information is confirmed by documents, we get serious pretsident to refer to all international bodies: this is related to the field of war crimes. The Convention on the Prohibition of the Development, Production, Stockpiling and Use of Chemical Weapons and on Their Destruction entered into force on 29 April 1997. Russia joined the Convention from 5 December 1997, being armed with 40,000 tons of chemical weapons. To date, destroyed about 80% of initial stock. Personally, I do not think that it is about the use of these reserves. If fact took place, in this rather involved local "craftsmen" and the responsibility rests with the DNR automatically as a terrorist organization. Kind regards. "Askold". Edited January 17, 2015 by beastcat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spooky lynx 73 Posted January 17, 2015 Longer video with Zaharchenko and a group of journalists in new terminal. And some photos with Graham Philips. https://pp.vk.me/c621126/v621126630/beda/GqWW6ptYnm4.jpg (156 kB) https://pp.vk.me/c621126/v621126630/be76/hY4B-3nTZu0.jpg (108 kB) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 17, 2015 Can you provide the original video?Oh and according to Interfax the separatists have completely captured the airport again after completely capturing the airport yesterday, while the Ukrainian side reports (citing volunteers) that the separatists are asking for a temporary ceasefire so they can collect the killed. Also heres a facebook post from today (translated) OK, I can´t even count how often they claimed to "have completely captured the airport" by now. So much unclear information from both sides.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted January 17, 2015 Also heres some info about the alledged chemical attack: 15:30 yesterdayUnderstood information "gas." Firstly, a lot of smoke grenades - the separatists threw a lot, pulled their dead carcasses. Secondly, caught fire inside the plastic casing of the 1st floor, which added hysterical stink. Information on gas warfare - not true. ---------- Post added at 11:24 ---------- Previous post was at 11:21 ---------- Longer video with Zaharchenko and a group of journalists in new terminal. And some photos with Graham Philips. https://pp.vk.me/c621126/v621126630/bec8/ALdbwivYJQ4.jpg https://pp.vk.me/c621126/v621126630/beda/GqWW6ptYnm4.jpg (156 kB) https://pp.vk.me/c621126/v621126630/be76/hY4B-3nTZu0.jpg (108 kB) I thought they threw Giwi out a while ago. All of this is like a big Deja-vu. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sudayev 27 Posted January 17, 2015 Ruins of Donetsk airport filmed by drone Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oxmox 73 Posted January 17, 2015 Ruins of Donetsk airport filmed by drone Looks like any military mission there could be called "meatgrinder"...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted January 17, 2015 Videos from the airport from today(?) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonci87 163 Posted January 17, 2015 Yeah well that could be filmed anywhere..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) http://youtu.be/mI9uSvVypLs Reinforcements driving to airport. Edited January 17, 2015 by beastcat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
