oxmox 73 Posted August 30, 2014 (edited) If that video was from the CNN why not directly link to their website? We already seen some nice fakes with logos.On the other hand, if the 50 T72s were brought from the pro-Russian zone in Donetsk, how has he brought them without anyone noticing. Crossing the siege line, checkpoints etc. I mean, are tanks, are easy to see it and are damn noisy... That story doesn't add up in any sense. Well if you find the original link please post it....i found this on liveleak. edit: the cnn report itself without the lead (updated 8 hours, 5 minutes ago) http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/world/2014/08/30/pkg-magnay-ukraine-separatists-new-front.cnn.html posted video with lead CNN - Reporter is searching the Invasion Ukrainian military leader´s remark dont match situation found by CNN ---> By the way, the statement by the ukrainian president about an Invasion was corrected and the german state TV did twitter that it was a translation error from the REUTERS news agency.. :confused: Edited August 30, 2014 by oxmox Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ProfTournesol 956 Posted August 31, 2014 Interesting article of Vice News, particularly an Ukrainian volunteer confirming the presence of 30 "Russian" tanks but feeling betrayed by Kiev seeing no reinforcements whatsoever : https://news.vice.com/article/ukraine-announces-that-the-russian-invasion-has-begun Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted August 31, 2014 The Star - Russia and Ukraine trade soldiers at border - Russian news agencies Ukraine has handed over a group of captured Russian paratroops and Russia has returned 63 Ukrainian soldiers who crossed into its territory last week, Russian news agencies quoted a paratroop commander as saying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vilas 477 Posted August 31, 2014 (edited) when Ukraine will give those Russian soldiers, next day Russian officials will say "there were no Russian soldiers, it is lie and propaganda of Ukraine, look they do not have any Russian POW" Edited August 31, 2014 by vilas Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
surpher 1 Posted August 31, 2014 (BBC) Putin 'urges talks on statehood for east Ukraine' (Time) Garry Kasparov: It’s a War, Stupid! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vilas 477 Posted August 31, 2014 (edited) Ursula von der Leyen , MOD of Germany said, she is against help to Ukraine and no NATO membership even to talk - so dear Ukrainians , you now feel what Poles felt in 1939 (and still feel many of us), Rheinmetal must be very sad, so much profits, lets wait month so they again can sell hightech to Russia and modernize Russian army, how many dozens thousands Euros Schroeder earned this week in Russian gas pipe company ? some Polish right wing politicians say that Russia will take all industrial and oil-rich areas of Ukraine and west will not move finger and later again France and Germany will be selling weapons technology to Russia Edited August 31, 2014 by vilas Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ProfTournesol 956 Posted August 31, 2014 It's sad that such a powerful country is still unable to play an international role. I understand the need to remain moderate, but Germany isn't playing its leading role in European diplomacy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vilas 477 Posted August 31, 2014 not moderate - it is money and business "pecunia non olet", bandit always have more money than his victim , dealers of jewelry prefer mafia members than old poor retired street cleaners, right? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 Ursula von der Leyen , MOD of Germany said, she is against help to Ukraine and no NATO membership even to talk - so dear Ukrainians , you now feel what Poles felt in 1939 (and still feel many of us), Rheinmetal must be very sad, so much profits, lets wait month so they again can sell hightech to Russia and modernize Russian army, how many dozens thousands Euros Schroeder earned this week in Russian gas pipe company ? some Polish right wing politicians say that Russia will take all industrial and oil-rich areas of Ukraine and west will not move finger and later again France and Germany will be selling weapons technology to Russia I don't think the situation is comparable to that in 1939. It is very unlikely for Russia to mount a full scale invasion, and even if the rebels win it is also unlikely that they will join RF (they would also only control a small part of Ukraine which is ruined by the war). After all things can't be done today as they could back then. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vilas 477 Posted August 31, 2014 (edited) i had read similar things before Crimea anexation "it is unlikely" "noone's gonna annect Crimea" "there are no Russian soldiers" "bandera fascist will murder Russians" half year ago (i do not have short memory), half year have passed and all what was written here by pro-Russian side not met reality, because Putin is imperialist and is always hungry for what belongs to others Edited August 31, 2014 by vilas Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted August 31, 2014 (edited) i had read similar things before Crimea anexation "it is unlikely" "noone's gonna annect Crimea" "there are no Russian soldiers" "bandera fascist will murder Russians" half year ago (i do not have short memory), half year have passed and all what was written here by pro-Russian side not met reality, because Putin is imperialist and is always hungry for what belongs to others I remember very well how they were saying "We just want federalisation". Then it slowly turned into "We want to be a seperate country" and before you know it they were suddenly part of Russia. Edited August 31, 2014 by beastcat Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 i had read similar things before Crimea anexation "it is unlikely" "noone's gonna annect Crimea" "there are no Russian soldiers" "bandera fascist will murder Russians" half year ago (i do not have short memory), half year have passed and all what was written here by pro-Russian side not met reality, because Putin is imperialist and is always hungry for what belongs to others This doesn't have much to do with Putin or his ideas, as someone already said, there is a web of interests around every ruler. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dwarden 1125 Posted August 31, 2014 I don't think the situation is comparable to that in 1939. It is very unlikely for Russia to mount a full scale invasion, and even if the rebels win it is also unlikely that they will join RF (they would also only control a small part of Ukraine which is ruined by the war). After all things can't be done today as they could back then. it's gunna be like Spain civil war and Saarland, Rhineland, Austria, Sudetenland, Bohemia and Moravia of Czechoslovakia, Memel prior WW2 the west will be giving territory to aggressor to avoid war, the aggressor gets more bold and cruel each time ... until the real point-of-no-return Transnistria (former part of Moldavia), South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Crimea and now east/southeast Ukraine are defacto silently occupied by Russian forces and each time, the conflict is bigger, cost more lifes of people and heavier weapons are used ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 it's gunna be like Spain civil war and Saarland, Rhineland, Austria, Sudetenland, Bohemia and Moravia of Czechoslovakia, Memel prior WW2 the west will be giving territory to aggressor to avoid war, the aggressor gets more bold and cruel each time ... until the real point-of-no-return Transnistria (former part of Moldavia), South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Crimea and now east/southeast Ukraine are defacto silently occupied by Russian forces and each time, the conflict is bigger, cost more lifes of people and heavier weapons are used ... It is a change of pace, because the west was the aggressor until now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ProfTournesol 956 Posted August 31, 2014 It is a change of pace, because the west was the aggressor until now. In Europe ? Certainly not. Moreover that's not an excuse, even for Putin's worshipers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 In Europe ? Certainly not. Moreover that's not an excuse, even for Putin's worshipers. Yes in Europe and elsewhere. Not saying it is an excuse, just pointing out western hypocrisy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hellfire257 3 Posted August 31, 2014 Western aggression in Europe. Can you provide some examples? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 Western aggression in Europe. Can you provide some examples? Serbia. Or are u not counting it in Europe? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted August 31, 2014 Two Ukrainian ships have been sunk in Mariupol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 Two Ukrainian ships have been sunk in Mariupol. How? With what? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ProfTournesol 956 Posted August 31, 2014 Serbia. Or are u not counting it in Europe? Aggressing the aggressor you mean. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beastcat 14 Posted August 31, 2014 How? With what? With weapons the separatists found in a warehouse that they bought in a local hunting shop. The Russians are now attacking Mariupol And these have appeared in Washington DC And Kolomoisky apparently said that he will blow up the Dnieper Hydroelectric Station if the russians take the city Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mistyronin 1181 Posted August 31, 2014 Yes in Europe and elsewhere. Not saying it is an excuse, just pointing out western hypocrisy. What? How many countries has any of the Western Nations annexed? And NATO attacked Serbia to stop the war provoked by Serbia and the war crimes that resulted from it. In this case it's Russia that provoked the war, invading and occupying parts of Ukraine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aleksadragutin 9 Posted August 31, 2014 Aggressing the aggressor you mean. It was unneeded extensive use of force, with no legal backbone. So yes it was an aggression (1992-2007), with effects still felt today. ---------- Post added at 18:01 ---------- Previous post was at 17:59 ---------- What? How many countries has any of the Western Nations annexed?And NATO attacked Serbia to stop the war provoked by Serbia and the war crimes that resulted from it. In this case it's Russia that provoked the war, invading Ukraine. None, but it sure created couple of new ones, and destroyed some economies. If the war was provoked it sure wasn't by Serbia since the other countries separated from it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oxmox 73 Posted August 31, 2014 Fear of a second Chernobyl 15 nuclear power plants, nuclear research reactors, highly toxic waste: Never ever did occur a war in a country with such a density of nuclear facilities like in the Ukraine. Experts warn about the danger of a second Chernobyl. The biggest nuclear reactor, Saparoschje, of whole Europe is only 200km away from the military dispute in the eastern Ukraine. Sergej Boschko, the chef of the ukrainian nuclear watchdog, says that the ukrainian nuclear reactors are not even properly protected against bigger airplanes. "Our modern nuclear plants, serie WWR320, are protected against small planes with around the maximum of 10 tons. It is already not sufficient protected against a Boeing 737 with 60 tons of weight. Nuclear power plants not designed for war The atomic plants are at the mercy of the heavy weapons used in the East Ukraine. These reactors are not to be designed for a war. This counts even more so for the 100 special containers with burned off fuel elements. Fuel elements which are stored in Saparoschje under the open sky. Furthermore, most of the ukrainian nuclear power plants are outdated and some of them shouldnt be on the network. Boschko´s colleague Nikolai Steinberg potrays it even more drastically: " Nuclear reactors and war is not compatible. Any conventionell war within an area where nuclear reactors exist will lead sooner or later to an "nuclear war". The Ukraine is the first country with more than one nuclear power plant and involved in a military conflict. I did only freely translate some sentences, please google translate the whole article: http://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/atomkraftwerk-ukraine-100.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
