[WIP] bCombat infantry AI Mod [SP]

[kremator 1065]

I'm just testing if bCombat picks up units once they are 'profiled' and 'unprofiled'. It should do.

Regarding further testing (without ALiVE) it is going well Fab. Any news on next beta for us to test? I tried to use Gamma's dataplot in a mission for bCombat, but my brain melted.

[mr_centipede 31]

with recent beta patch. the AI feels much better in vanilla. Much for fun commanding it. With bCombat, I have mixed feelings. Will report more later

[fabrizio_t 58]

Any news on next beta for us to test? I tried to use Gamma's dataplot in a mission for bCombat, but my brain melted.

Got back in the night, slept 4 hours, now at job.

I'd like to release v0.14 before WE as usual, unless the piles of work related duties crumble on me ;)

---------- Post added at 11:54 ---------- Previous post was at 11:52 ----------

With bCombat, I have mixed feelings. Will report more later

Ok, let me know thx.

[fabrizio_t 58]

V0.14 changelog candidate:

* Machinegunners' behaviour tweaks:

	* Further Prioritization of shooting over movement. 
	* Allowed to spend more time shooting on target / laying suppressive fire from current position.

* Fleeing behaviour tweaks:

	* Custom fleeing disabled for groups containing player. 
	  (Done in order to avoid player becoming group leader due to AI units fleeing, potentially breaking missions)

*  "move to cover" behaviour fixes and tweaks:

	* Units may move to cover more frequently when suppressed
	* Units more likely to move away from roads when suppressed
	* Units may keep current position even if suppressed, when shooter is not in line of sight

    NOTICE: Move to cover behaviour is optional and always disabled for player led groups, this is to avoid undesired movement of units [same behaviour as v0.13).

* "config.sqf" active by default
* Over 40 configuration variables exposed and briefly documented into "config.sqf"
* Minor tweaks and bugfixes.

---------- Post added at 16:23 ---------- Previous post was at 15:50 ----------

Sensible change within DEV build 1.07.113178:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?169122-AI-Configuration-feedback&p=2570469&viewfull=1#post2570469

There is one rather minor change (with possible major in-game consequences) to AI Skill Configuration that's going to appear on today's dev branch build.

Skill of an unit of a group inserted in the editor gets it's initial skill (which you can change via the Skill slider in Edit Unit dialogue) set according to this unit's rank as defined in cfgGroups.

Previously the range was 0.2 (Pvt.) to 1.0 (Col.) which caused - if the mission designer used groups and didn't readjust the individual units' skill - majority of the AI soldiers on the battlefield to get low skill values. However the default skill of a single unit you place in the editor is 0.6. We also aim towards providing a symmetrical range for AI adjustments. (Tweaking the median is a constant process based also on your feedback in AI Discussion)

We have narrowed the range to 0.4 (Pvt.) to 0.7 (Col.), which should help the average soldier to have an average skill and also it reflects the uneven distribution of ranks (majority of units used in groups are Privates and NCOs, very loosely mirroring the reality)

---

This is a single separated change that relates to per-unit skill configuration.

For now we still focus on global settings and we'll return to per-unit skill configuration for some bigger work later. (to how an unit's (sub)skill is adjusted, how you can set it in the editor, standardization/description of values etc.) ;)

Fact is that DEV build is broken, so i can't test it.

I suspect this change will have a broad effect on shooting accuracy for default editor groups.

[kremator 1065]

I've had to steer away from DEV build to help test ALiVE, but this change does look good.

[fabrizio_t 58]

Just played a bit with the latest (hotfixed build), but so far i'm seeing problems.

Not sure whether these arose today, since i did not test builds from nov 28th onwards.

Now i see snipers refusing to target units farther than about 300m. (both vanilla AI and bCombat), whereas i was able to get them shooting from over 600m (i even posted a video).

On same mission, different and worse outcome.

[willywonka 10]

Fab-

I noticed on your videos that you seem to be using the arma keyed command system. Might I suggest articulate.... It makes the game oh so much more immersive and intuitive.

http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=22940

[fabrizio_t 58]

Fab-

I noticed on your videos that you seem to be using the arma keyed command system. Might I suggest articulate.... It makes the game oh so much more immersive and intuitive.

http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=22940

I'm not using keyed, but thatnks for the suggestion anyway.

---------- Post added at 20:10 ---------- Previous post was at 20:01 ----------

I'm doing some more playtesting on v0.14.

I noticed AI units get stuck into buildings alot and with no apparent reason and i'm trying to understand why.

Did anybody noticed this with v0.13? They go inside and act normally, but refuse to fall back into formation or to move anywhere,

Other that that, latest DEV build is further strengthening suppressive fire mechanincs, due to machinegunners firing full-auto.

For instance i've run the usual Assault on Charkia mission ending with > 2,500 bullets fired.

AI Casualties got up too.

Feels like suppressive fire needs to be toned down a bit now, otherwise ammo depletion would become a sensible issue.

[bravo409 13]

I'm not using keyed, but thatnks for the suggestion anyway.

---------- Post added at 20:10 ---------- Previous post was at 20:01 ----------

I'm doing some more playtesting on v0.14.

I noticed AI units get stuck into buildings alot and with no apparent reason and i'm trying to understand why.

Did anybody noticed this with v0.13? They go inside and act normally, but refuse to fall back into formation or to move anywhere,

Other that that, latest DEV build is further strengthening suppressive fire mechanincs, due to machinegunners firing full-auto.

For instance i've run the usual Assault on Charkia mission ending with > 2,500 bullets fired.

AI Casualties got up too.

Feels like suppressive fire needs to be toned down a bit now, otherwise ammo depletion would become a sensible issue.

Fab I have not experienced that problem with my test. The AI always come out of the building or stay at a window sometimes but thats very rarely. I have also tested 10vs10 and the FPS was getting real laggy, so That could just be my machine so I think others should try that test and see how it works for them and report there findings.

Edited December 6, 2013 by bravo409

[fabrizio_t 58]

Fab I have not experienced that problem with my test. The AI always come out of the building or stay at a window sometimes but thats very rarely. I have also tested 10vs10 and the FPS was getting real laggy, so That could just be my machine so I think others should try that test and see how it works for them and report there findings.

Thanks for feedback on units stuck. I'd like to know from more testers, if possible, since it's a sensitive issue.

10vs10 is highly unlikely to cause lag, looks like a PC glitch, care to retry and post back the result?

If you still see problems please attach the mission.

[mr_centipede 31]

I have 24 vs 24 and haven't had any lag/slow down as of yet with bCombat...

[fabrizio_t 58]

I have 24 vs 24 and haven't had any lag/slow down as of yet with bCombat...

Playing myself with 80+ units, no sensible issues.

---

Mr_Centipede,

some time ago you wrote about having mixed feelings about bCombat, may i ask you which issues you encountered?

I'd like to know, since i'm finalizing v0.14 and your feedback is valuable.

Thank you.

[mr_centipede 31]

Yeah... the problem with mixed feelings, is that its mixed. sometimes it feels good, sometimes it feels weird... I sometimes have that coloured teams converge at a position when I ordered them to move to a position, and when they're there, they wont dispersed, sometimes fell victim to friendly fire. Unfortunately it didn't happened everytime... so yeah. It's hard to put it in objectively...

[kremator 1065]

Playing with 2500 AI (ok most are profiled) but I do have around 120 'real' AI at any time, and I don't see any noticeable slowdown :)

0.14 ready for the weekend Fab ?

[lordprimate 159]

had some time to test and i have noticed an issue with grenades.. AI seemed to revert to their old Spin while they throw behavior. Is anyone else seeing this.. I was with two team mate ai. and one just threw a perfect grenade over the wall right in front of them. The the second one started to throw, and began to spin around and ended up throwing the grenade at friendlies. I have tested this both in Dev and NON dev and the behavior is the same..

this is with about 28 vs 35

[fabrizio_t 58]

Yeah... the problem with mixed feelings, is that its mixed. sometimes it feels good, sometimes it feels weird... I sometimes have that coloured teams converge at a position when I ordered them to move to a position, and when they're there, they wont dispersed, sometimes fell victim to friendly fire. Unfortunately it didn't happened everytime... so yeah. It's hard to put it in objectively...

Yes, i know what you mean, bunching it's a side-effect of fast move, which is always on for player led groups.

It should not happen often, but that's an issue i'm aware of.

About friendly fire: suppressive fire and gunfire by suppressed units aren't much careful, sadly this is a vanilla issue (units not checking if LOS is free frequently enough + dispersion cone scarcely accounted).

However bCombat provides a (optional) configuration setting to cap max. friendly fire damage, so at least your units can be damaged by friendly fire to some extents, but can't be killed.

That's a compromise solution, documentation will come with v0.14.

---------- Post added at 15:12 ---------- Previous post was at 15:11 ----------

0.14 ready for the weekend Fab ?

I'm working on debugging the units stuck into buildings issue, which is a major annoyance.

I suspect it's related to latest beta builds.

I hope to get it sorted soon, to be hopefully able to release tomorrow.

No promise yet.

---------- Post added at 15:15 ---------- Previous post was at 15:12 ----------

had some time to test and i have noticed an issue with grenades.. AI seemed to revert to their old Spin while they throw behavior. Is anyone else seeing this.. I was with two team mate ai. and one just threw a perfect grenade over the wall right in front of them. The the second one started to throw, and began to spin around and ended up throwing the grenade at friendlies. I have tested this both in Dev and NON dev and the behavior is the same..

this is with about 28 vs 35

Yes it may happen, as it happens as well in vanilla.

However within v0.13 move-to-cover bevaviour may overlap with grenade throwing, causing more occurrences of this problem.

Issue has been lessened into v0.14.

---------- Post added at 15:23 ---------- Previous post was at 15:15 ----------

In the meantime,

changelog candidate updated.

v0.14
-----

Core:

* Machinegunners' behaviour tweaks:

	* Further Prioritization of shooting over movement. 
	* Allowed to spend more time shooting on target / laying suppressive fire from current position.

* Fleeing behaviour tweaks:

	* Custom fleeing disabled for groups containing player. 
	  (Done in order to avoid player becoming group leader due to AI units fleeing, potentially breaking missions)

*  "move to cover" behaviour fixes and tweaks:

	* Units may move to cover more frequently when suppressed
	* Units more likely to move away from roads when suppressed
	* Units may keep current position even if suppressed if shooter is not in line of sight

    NOTICE: Move to cover behaviour is optional and always disabled for player led groups, this is to avoid undesired movement of units [same behaviour as v0.13).

* Improved tightened formation feature for AI groups
* On enemy contact units will usually crouch instead of going prone
* units under fire may crouch instead of going prone when moving fast or being far from shooter (mobility enhancement)
* Higher chance units alerted by gunfire / explosion events will investigate event position, unless some enemy is already known
* "config.sqf" active by default
* Over 40 configuration variables exposed and briefly documented into "config.sqf"
* Minor tweaks and bugfixes.

Edited December 6, 2013 by fabrizio_T

[fabrizio_t 58]

Benchmarking session results

I've just completed a benchmarking session on Assault on Charkia mission with v0.14, before applying a batch of optimization tweaks.

This way i will be able to spot improvements.

The test is was done this way:

* On today's DEV build

* bCombat enabled vs. disabled

* with config.sqf uncommented

* Running the mission 4 times

* With map open

* Collecting minimum and average FPS for the first 120 seconds

Here are the results:

bCombat disabled

Run #1 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 16 / 28

Run #2 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 16 / 28

Run #3 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 14 / 27

Run #4 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 13 / 27

bCombat enabled

Run #1 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 16 / 28

Run #2 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 14 / 27

Run #3 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 13 / 28

Run #4 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 18 / 28

Surprisingly, almost the same results.

EDIT:

in the meantime i tested the tweaks, consisting in lazy evaluation for statements.

From what i can see, performance wise these gave no appreciable gain ( between 0 and 2% at max).

Results with lazy evaluation:

bCombat enabled (lazy evaluation)

Run #1 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 14 / 28

Run #2 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 16 / 28

Run #3 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 17 / 27

Run #4 - FPS MIN / FPS AVG: 18 / 28

Edited December 6, 2013 by fabrizio_T

[lordprimate 159]

in terms of performance gains.. ill take the 2% (at max). its better then nothing and will probably make a big difference down the line! I havent had time to really sit down for hrs and test bcombat like i'd like, however, i do as often as i can. i can earnestly say that i Like where this is going!! and cant wait to test .14

side note: yea i remember the spinning grenade throws from Arma 2. I had not seen it until the last week. Just to not i also enabled "more grenades" +2 to be exact. just to see and test it.

[Psilocybe 3]

Having trouble as you say Fabrizio with units engaging making my tests a little difficult at the moment. AI vs AI still works, with satisfactory results, I rarely see grenades thrown due to the nature of my tests, but I have been quite pleased with general movements with no major issues outside what we have already seen in the thread so far.

[fabrizio_t 58]

Hi gentlemen,

i'm sorry to inform ypu that is unlkely v0.14 will be released today / tomorrow.

Fact is that despite the efforts, i'm not completely satisfied with its current state.

I've still problems with units stuck into buildings and in the meantime i'm trying to deal with (apparent) issues introduced by latest beta builds:

* Units fire much more now (full-auto), a bit too much when coupled with bCombat. Casualties are skyrocketing.

* I'm seeing further problems with AI units refusing to engage from distance (e.g. snipers), we haven't got these previously.

* AT units do strange things again, such as continually changing their weapon.

All in all i find actual vanilla AI more sluggish than before, which is a shame.

[kremator 1065]

No probs Fab. Keep working on it.

[Psilocybe 3]

Dejavu with Flexi AI and the dev builds.

Whenever its ready Fab, whenever its ready, no need for apologies.

[lordprimate 159]

yea seriously, work at your pace man, well be here when you push out the update.

[froggyluv 2136]

AI getting stuck inside was something I noticed in Vanilla maybe 6 months ago and was pretty rampant. Is this Vanilla issue or worsened by script?

[fabrizio_t 58]

AI getting stuck inside was something I noticed in Vanilla maybe 6 months ago and was pretty rampant. Is this Vanilla issue or worsened by script?

I'd say both.

For example i see units being stuck into buildings: vanilla does not usually make units go into them, but i think it's a ArmA bug.