Why the USMC?

[C4SINO 10]

I don't know much about this game, but is the storyline about Communists trying to overthrow the Democrats?

If this is the case of the storyline, why does the USMC intervene? The Cold War is over, the Communists are no longer a threat, so why would they care what happens in this small country. What do they get from it?

So mainly, why does the US government feel the need to get involved in this war? What is it they benefit from it? It just seems they're being portrayed as Good Guys who just want to help without expecting anything in return.

Edited June 20, 2009 by C4SINO

[usmc123 1]

I don't know much about this game, but is the storyline about Communists trying to overthrow the Democrats?

If this is the case of the storyline, why does the USMC intervene? The Cold War is over, the Communists are no longer a threat, so why would they care what happens in this small country. What do they get from it?

These insurgents are murdering civilians and causing unrest, so this Quick Response Force, the MEU, hits Chernarus so no more innocents are killed. I havn't touched the campaign in a while but that is what I recall at the beginning, something about civilians being killed and rounded up, etc, etc.

[C4SINO 10]

These insurgents are murdering civilians and causing unrest, so this Quick Response Force, the MEU, hits Chernarus so no more innocents are killed. I havn't touched the campaign in a while but that is what I recall at the beginning, something about civilians being killed and rounded up, etc, etc.

So they're the Knight in Shining Armour? Lol, I won't start ranting, you have usmc in your name ;)

[Cellus 10]

Whether you consider it likely or not, they are the most likely belligerents. More so when you consider the parameters, particularly the need for a counter-part to Russia (extremely likely belligerent, as seen in Georgia/S Ossetia), ie. a large, modern military with democracy-crusading aspirations.

But others are coming - they'll be several new nations before long, and single player is a tiny part of ArmA.

[mr_centipede 31]

it's somewhere along the lines of south ossetia and georgia incident... not exactly the same as though... just that it mimic the real world event

why usmc... probably marketing purposes

[lapa 1]

I don't know much about this game, but is the storyline about Communists trying to overthrow the Democrats?

No. The story scenario is loosely based on the Georgia War and modern geopolitics. Russia and USA both happen to have a history of starting and aiding (and interfering with) wars that serve their respective interests. It's that simple. However, the story is not a black and white portrayal of war.

If this is the case of the storyline, why does the USMC intervene? The Cold War is over, the Communists are no longer a threat, so why would they care what happens in this small country. What do they get from it?

How about you play the game before going on a rant.

[usmc123 1]

So they're the Knight in Shining Armour? Lol, I won't start ranting, you have usmc in your name ;)

Apparently, but I havn't played much of the campaign so I don't know much else. But I guess this Carrier is near buy and the MEU is deployed. Then Russia gets involved and the shit hits the fan...I think.

Looked on the wiki article because I wanted clarification and it said, "Harvest Red is set in the present-day in a fictional post-Soviet country called Chernarus (Black Russia). The country is in a state of political unrest, with a western backed Democratic government trying to hold onto power from pro Communist forces, after many months of civil war, the Communist forces failed to overthrow the current government and set up the Socialist Republic of Chernarus. The remaining democratic forces ask the west for help and the United States of America send the United States Marine Corps and an Expeditionary Strike Group to anchor off the Chernarus coast. The campaign starts as the U.S. Marine Corps Force Recon lands in Chernarus to try and quell the civil war."

[C4SINO 10]

So no one has really told me why the USMC, I've been told it's based of the Georgian Incident. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Georgia invaded Ossetia while killing Russian Peacekeepers.

So after this, the Ossetians and the Russians drove back the Georgians and invaded them. Is this right?

If so, I ask again, why the USMC? I've never even heard of these countries until this incident occured.

[CplBlakeman 10]

The USMC is able to deploy without the authorization of Congress, thus it is usually sent in first. The USMC is able to deploy more rapidly than the US Army, so is used in a 'quick response' manner more often than the US Army, who is usually called up for large scale operations (i.e. full on war). There is a Marine saying 'First to fight' which often sums up this nicely. :)

I would suggest playing the game to get the exact story.

[C4SINO 10]

The USMC is able to deploy without the authorization of Congress, thus it is usually sent in first. The USMC is able to deploy more rapidly than the US Army, so is used in a 'quick response' manner more often than the US Army, who is usually called up for large scale operations (i.e. full on war). There is a Marine saying 'First to fight' which often sums up this nicely. :)

I would suggest playing the game to get the exact story.

I know the Marines can be deployed quickly, I heard they can be deployed anywhere in the world within 18 hours.

But no one has answered the question, why does the USMC intervene. Why does the US feel the necessity to get involved with a Civil War? As far as I can see, this doesn't affect them whatsoever, as I said, the Cold War is over so who cares if the Communists win.

[usmc123 1]

So no one has really told me why the USMC, I've been told it's based of the Georgian Incident. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Georgia invaded Ossetia while killing Russian Peacekeepers.

So after this, the Ossetians and the Russians drove back the Georgians and invaded them. Is this right?

If so, I ask again, why the USMC? I've never even heard of these countries until this incident occured.

Well Bohemia Interactive wanted to try and make a bit of a plot and for them the USMC was perfect. You have your independents, the Guerrillas, you have your EAST the Insurgents assisted by the Russians you can find the relation, and you have the West, the CDF assisted by the USMC. The USMC being the Western link that gives Chernarus aid, which in the Georgia war I don't believe any nation commited any actual fighting force but more so supplies and etc.

For BI, the USMC was perfect for a role like this. The unit you play as are apart of a Marine Expeditionary Unit. These guys rove the oceans or are deployed to hostile regions of the world. They wait for crisis and orders from the President or Congress to be sent into a warzone. They are the United State's quick reaction force, sure you have your small special forces but an MEU can deploy an entire fighting force, air, sea, land, etc. So BI created this element in their Georgia-esque plot.

Read you post, I agree America is such a glorified country...

Anyway, the wiki states, "Harvest Red is set in the present-day in a fictional post-Soviet country called Chernarus (Black Russia). The country is in a state of political unrest, with a western backed Democratic government trying to hold onto power from pro Communist forces, after many months of civil war, the Communist forces failed to overthrow the current government and set up the Socialist Republic of Chernarus. The remaining democratic forces ask the west for help and the United States of America send the United States Marine Corps and an Expeditionary Strike Group to anchor off the Chernarus coast."

[CplBlakeman 10]

Because it is made up? :P

I would assume it is because they do not want a democracy overthrown by a communist regime and want stability in the area. It could be that there are nukes somewhere, or that they need an ally they can trust in the region and are backing them up. Could be that the airport in Chenarus gives them range to targets in the middle east and the rest of the area so they agree to help out for rights to use the airfield?

nvm, read USMC123's response above.

[C4SINO 10]

Well Bohemia Interactive wanted to try and make a bit of a plot and for them the USMC was perfect. You have your independents, the Guerrillas, you have your EAST the Insurgents assisted by the Russians you can find the relation, and you have the West, the CDF assisted by the USMC. The USMC being the Western link that gives Chernarus aid, which in the Georgia war I don't believe any nation commited any actual fighting force but more so supplies and etc.

For BI, the USMC was perfect for a role like this. The unit you play as are apart of a Marine Expeditionary Unit. These guys rove the oceans or are deployed to hostile regions of the world. They wait for crisis and orders from the President or Congress to be sent into a warzone. They are the United State's quick reaction force, sure you have your small special forces but an MEU can deploy an entire fighting force, air, sea, land, etc. So BI created this element in their Georgia-esque plot.

That's good man, I like to see that you put in a long answer. Personally, I think BI put the USMC in for those reasons, but for marketing. More people in the World would rather play as the USMC than let's say the Chinese Army, or a Georgian Army.

But once again, let's look at the story. Communists trying to overthrow the Democrats in this small country, the Democrats ask for help and the USMC respond? Why would they want to do that? This is a small country having a civil war, it happens all the time and the USMC never respond to those, so why this particular one?

[CplBlakeman 10]

This is a small country having a civil war, it happens all the time and the USMC never respond to those, so why this particular one?

See my hypotheticals above. :)

[C4SINO 10]

See my hypotheticals above. :)

Yeah, I saw yours after I posted mine. I know it's made up, obviously, and it's just a game. But if this is a Realistic Military Simulation, don't you think they could at least make a Realistic Story line?

[dreday 1]

But no one has answered the question, why does the USMC intervene. Why does the US feel the necessity to get involved with a Civil War? As far as I can see, this doesn't affect them whatsoever, as I said, the Cold War is over so who cares if the Communists win.

I think what you are trying to say that the storyline for the campaign does not reflect the complexities of the modern world geopolitics and that it demonizes Russia's protectionism of her compatriots in the near-abroad while idealizing the US hegemony... I would tend to agree with that. But guess what, I did not buy this game for the campaign, and I am certainly not disappointed with my purchase!

Peace,

DreDay

[usmc123 1]

That's good man, I like to see that you put in a long answer. Personally, I think BI put the USMC in for those reasons, but for marketing. More people in the World would rather play as the USMC than let's say the Chinese Army, or a Georgian Army.

But once again, let's look at the story. Communists trying to overthrow the Democrats in this small country, the Democrats ask for help and the USMC respond? Why would they want to do that? This is a small country having a civil war, it happens all the time and the USMC never respond to those, so why this particular one?

How many countries specifically ask for serious aid. The kind of aid that sends tanks, air support, land forces, etc, etc. I'm not saying that the United States would just send a million people to help those in Darfur or something. I'm not Naive but typically if a nation asks another nation for serious aid, they get something in return. Especially if they are in good standing with the other nation. I mean there is no doubt that the USMC was a good marketing choice but at the same time look at BI's audience. They haven't really signed on with a publisher like Atari which will put their game in front of Americans. They signed with 505 (European) and some German publishers first, Steam gets it later and while I will say Steam is well known I guarantee there is a ton of Americans that have no idea what ArmA is, or ArmA II for that matter.

[mr_centipede 31]

may i suggest not to overanalyze things? or you could get creative... say chernarus is in caucasus area and they got oil there. kuwait was small also, and US respond with desert storm.

maybe chernarus president is a very good friend of US president and the president, using his emotional response, send in the USMC...

[C4SINO 10]

I think what you are trying to say that the storyline for the campaign does not reflect the complexities of the modern world geopolitics and that it demonizes Russia's protectionism of her compatriots in the near-abroad while idealizing the US hegemony... I would tend to agree with that. But guess what, I did not buy this game for the campaign, and I am certainly not disappointed with my purchase!

Peace,

DreDay

Lol, touche. If this game ever comes out on 360, I'll buy. But one thing that annoyed me about Flashpoint 1 was the corny story. It just didn't feel realistic, I've yet to see a game that could portray a story that could potentially happen in real life.

[lapa 1]

But no one has answered the question, why does the USMC intervene. Why does the US feel the necessity to get involved with a Civil War?

Geopolitics = gas pipeline to the West, superpower sabre rattling, a potential country for US's strategic missile shield, Georgia's NATO relations etc. There are a lot of reasons majority of which boil down to energy resources and strategic interests.

[Barnaby 10]

That's good man, I like to see that you put in a long answer. Personally, I think BI put the USMC in for those reasons, but for marketing. More people in the World would rather play as the USMC than let's say the Chinese Army, or a Georgian Army.

But once again, let's look at the story. Communists trying to overthrow the Democrats in this small country, the Democrats ask for help and the USMC respond? Why would they want to do that? This is a small country having a civil war, it happens all the time and the USMC never respond to those, so why this particular one?

The reason they have the Marines in the game is because the Marines are always the first ones into a combat zone. They are always the first one to see action.

[C4SINO 10]

How many countries specifically ask for serious aid. The kind of aid that sends tanks, air support, land forces, etc, etc. I'm not saying that the United States would just send a million people to help those in Darfur or something. I'm not Naive but typically if a nation asks another nation for serious aid, they get something in return. Especially if they are in good standing with the other nation. I mean there is no doubt that the USMC was a good marketing choice but at the same time look at BI's audience. They haven't really signed on with a publisher like Atari which will put their game in front of Americans. They signed with 505 (European) and some German publishers first, Steam gets it later and while I will say Steam is well known I guarantee there is a ton of Americans that have no idea what ArmA is, or ArmA II for that matter.

Countries that asked for serious aid, what about the Rwandan Genocide? Almost 1 million people killed in 100 days, no help came for them? And I'm sure they asked for aid.

And yes, I agree with you that not many people know what ArmA is. I would say that's because this game is aimed at a specific audience, not the general population to maximize profits.

may i suggest not to overanalyze things? or you could get creative... say chernarus is in caucasus area and they got oil there. kuwait was small also, and US respond with desert storm.

maybe chernarus president is a very good friend of US president and the president, using his emotional response, send in the USMC...

That's what I'm asking, what's the reason?

[mr_centipede 31]

try ghost recon 1... the original not graw... eerily similar to georgia conflict... glad the real world didnt happened like in the game

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Please do not discuss politics and analyze real life conflicts and such here. If you wish to discuss events of real life conflicts and such, there's plenty of offtopic threads for that.

[dreday 1]

Lol, touche. If this game ever comes out on 360, I'll buy. But one thing that annoyed me about Flashpoint 1 was the corny story. It just didn't feel realistic, I've yet to see a game that could portray a story that could potentially happen in real life.

Hehe! Big respect for your good sense of humor. I totally agree with you about the storylines for all the BIS games. However, you have to consider the source. Many Czechs have a fairly biased view of Russian foreign policy, given their past history; and while I don't share that view, I certainly understand where it is coming from.

Like I said though, the campaign is a very minor part of the game for me. The editor and the modability make it well worth the purchase. Besides, within a few months you would see all sorts of fictional and realistic campaigns coming out from the community.

I would strongly urge you to consider purchasing it for a PC (where it truly shines).

Peace,

DreDay

Edited June 20, 2009 by DreDay