Is there an area-fire command?

[pooroldspike 129]

Hi, I've had ArmA about a week and have been working through all the key commands etc, but I haven't seen one that orders a squad to area-fire, or have I missed it?

For example suppose I suspect enemy infantry are hiding in a distant clump of trees or whatever, is there an order to make my squad area-fire into the clump to saturate it with small-arms and grenade-launcher fire even though they can't see any targets in there?

[celery 8]

There's no such command.

[walker 0]

Hi all

It can be achived with a script and invisible targets.

Kind regards walker

[pooroldspike 129]

What?

[kklownboy 43]

Hi, I've had ArmA about a week and have been working through all the key commands etc, but I haven't seen one that orders a squad to area-fire, or have I missed it?

For example suppose I suspect enemy infantry are hiding in a distant clump of trees or whatever, is there an order to make my squad area-fire into the clump to saturate it with small-arms and grenade-launcher fire even though they can't see any targets in there?

Yes. You would tell the group to fire away at that clump....

[pooroldspike 129]

There's no such command.

In that case realism flies out the window because its a standard real-life tactic

[pooroldspike 129]

To those who say it's possible, I'll buy that when you tell me what key to press

[walker 0]

What?

Hi PoorOldSpike

I used the invisible target methodology when we were doing the proof of concept for CoC_Unified Artillery in the old OFP days, this was before we even had the CoC site and were using a file sharing website. We then used something more advanced than invisible targets for UA, though I believe the invisible targets were still in the first version.

The concept is simple make a simple invisible target object for each side. Use scripts to create it in the direction you wish to fire then have AI target and fire on it.

Various people have used the method for suppression scripts. A search of the ArmA forum scripting threads for "Invisible Target" will find many examples of their use, including this one:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=70948&highlight=invisible+target

Of course Suppression is a two sided equation. It is not just the action it is also its effect. ArmA soldiers do react to being fired on by getting down etc. but the effect is more subtle in reality and involves the complex human concepts of fear and fight flight responses.

This an example of a script attempting to deal with the harder part of the equation:

http://www.ofpec.com/ed_depot/index.php?action=details&id=416&game=ArmA

ArmA 2 apparently includes both sides of the suppression equation by default according to the recent Hungarian Gamestar preview.

Kind Regards walker

[celery 8]

walker, you can't expect every player to pick up the scripting/modding manual and code himself a better Arma experience. The simple answer is that AI units only fire at specific and confirmed targets, they don't know the concept of area fire.

[walker 0]

Hi Celery

I think the code and method is fairly simple, but you do not have to create it just use the existing scripts and addons.

As I said it appears to be default in ArmA II.

Kind Regards walker

[pooroldspike 129]

Guys, guys, what are you saying?

Can I or can't I order my squad to pour area-fire into a location even if we can't see any targets in there?

If it can't be done in ArmA I'm not sure I want to continue playing it.

Other games have it-

http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/FGMForum/showthread.php?t=513

[ProfTournesol 956]

Guys, guys, what are you saying?

Can I or can't I order my squad to pour area-fire into a location even if we can't see any targets in there?

If it can't be done in ArmA I'm not sure I want to continue playing it.

Other games have it-

http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/FGMForum/showthread.php?t=513

No you can't.

Other games can do alot of things, but ArmA (OFP) can hardly be compared to other games.

[celery 8]

Hi Celery

I think the code and method is fairly simple, but you do not have to create it just use the existing scripts and addons.

As I said it appears to be default in ArmA II.

Kind Regards walker

I wouldn't bother with all that crap just to order my AI loons to shoot at nothing.

[pooroldspike 129]

I don't mean the computer-controlled units, I mean the members of my own squad.

If I see an enemy soldier running into bushes I want to be able to order my whole squad to hose down the bushes with small-arms and grenade-launchers, just like in real-life.

If ArmA wants us to pussyfoot around by not allowing such an order to be given, I'm very disappointed-

"Inflict the maximum amount of wound,death and destruction on the enemy in the minimum amount of time."-Patton

"War is a bloody, killing business. You've got to spill their blood, or they will spill yours. Rip them up the belly. Shoot them in the guts"-Patton

"The day goes to the side that is the first to plaster its opponent with fire."-Rommel

"I have a high art, I hurt with cruelty those who would damage me." - Archilocus (Greek mercenary), 650 B.C.

"Carry the battle to them. Don't let them bring it to you."-Harry S Truman

[SWT_Janowich 10]

You can do that but not exactly as you may are used to.

If you think there are enemies hiding e.g. behind a car, press e.g. F2 (For you units); then select command 2 (Targets) and choose the car.

Your unit will now aim at it. Then select the commands 3-3 (Fire) and it will fire on it.

Does not work all the time but did help me a lot sometimes

[tj72 0]

......nevermind I was confused and you probably meant your squad AI.....

I have a script for this. Check the editing board in next few days where I will post an example mission that uses the scripts.

Edited May 18, 2009 by TJ72
added text

[Andi 10]

First of all, I'd like to know why you would want to do that.

1. You want to randomly shoot into bushes to have a small chance of inflicting damage to someone or something.

- Waste of ammo, imho.

2. You want to surpress whatever is hiding there.

- No chance. AI is not programmed for hiding, running away or shitting their pants.

[pooroldspike 129]

You've seen that youtube video where an Iraqi insurgent dives into a wooden hut thinking he'll be safe from American rifle fire because they can't see him?

Bad call, the grunts simply riddle the hut with rifle fire and shred him inside. There ya go..:)

But in ArmA you can only riddle stuff yourself while the rest of your squad watch you like dummies because there's no way in the game to make them join in.

Like I said its a standard real-world tactic, and until ArmA incorporates a 'squad area-fire' command I can't take the game seriously

[franze 196]

Grab a SAW, a couple grenades, and do it yourself. Let the AI do the sniping and draw fire. :)

[ProfTournesol 956]

In that case realism flies out the window because its a standard real-life tactic

If it can't be done in ArmA I'm not sure I want to continue playing it.

If ArmA wants us to pussyfoot around by not allowing such an order to be given, I'm very disappointed-

Like I said its a standard real-world tactic, and until ArmA incorporates a 'squad area-fire' command I can't take the game seriously

I think we've understood.

[dmarkwick 261]

Guys, guys, what are you saying?

Can I or can't I order my squad to pour area-fire into a location even if we can't see any targets in there?

If it can't be done in ArmA I'm not sure I want to continue playing it.

Other games have it-

http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/FGMForum/showthread.php?t=513

When you say other games have it - I don't know of any FPS games that have it. However, I do believe that ArmA can use an addon to get area fire. There is certainly at least one good suppression addon that at least simulates the effect of suppressive fire, so with a little addon magic you'll be good to go.

As far as FPS goes, ArmA is certainly the way to go for realism IMO. I looks to me as though you're looking at ArmA for multiplay action in any case, so as far as your squad is concerned area fire would be done by teammates anyway.

I have seen AI in ArmA watch an enemy run behind a wall, and then estimate the enemy path until they appear on the other end, tracking via last-known trajectory.

[pooroldspike 129]

Thanks, I WANT to like ArmA but as long as I can't do area-fire like in real-life (below) I shall sit sulking. Meantime I'll search around for a mod

US Marines v Iraqi bus

*Explicit Content*

1- An insurgent runs towards the white hut on right and dives into it

2- But even though the grunts can't now see him, they still spray the hut to kingdom come with area-fire, notice the dust being kicked up by the hail of fire

3- And the guy is toast, you can run bub but you can't hide..

*Explicit content*

But we can't do area-fire like that in ArmA because the instant a target vanishes into a hut or bush or whatever, our squad just stand around like shmucks because there's no way in the game to order them to spray the hut or any other cover

Edited May 19, 2009 by Sniperwolf572
Explicit content

[ProfTournesol 956]

Ok, i don't want to be rude, but i would like to understand why you're keeping on saying the same thing on and on again :

(1) I think we do understand the need of such a feature, BUT

(2) NO, ArmA has no suppressive/area fire unless you take some time to understand how you can use already existing mod/script to correct this, which i understand can be boring.

(3) You can also WAIT ONE MONTH for ArmA2 which is said to offer such a feature (at least suppressive fire, which isn't maybe exactly the same).

[celery 8]

Christ, why do you have to post pictures like that?

[dmarkwick 261]

Thanks, I WANT to like ArmA but as long as I can't do area-fire like in real-life (below) I shall sit sulking. Meantime I'll search around for a mod

US Marines v Iraqi bus

*Explicit Content*

1- An insurgent runs towards the white hut on right and dives into it

2- But even though the grunts can't now see him, they still spray the hut to kingdom come with area-fire, notice the dust being kicked up by the hail of fire

3- And the guy is toast, you can run bub but you can't hide..

*Explicit content*

But we can't do area-fire like that in ArmA because the instant a target vanishes into a hut or bush or whatever, our squad just stand around like shmucks because there's no way in the game to order them to spray the hut or any other cover

To be honest, I've not seen a scenario like that in ArmA in any case. It's more keyed toward battlefield behaviors rather than urban ones. As such, it's very good at what it does do, however if you're totally focused onto one single battlefield element then as has been mentioned, addons are the way to go. If it's a deal-breaker for you, then the deal is simply broken.