Scopes

[m21man 0]

Can you easily switch scopes on military weapons? For instance, could I take an M4 + Aimpoint scope, remove the Aimpoint scope, and then add an ACOG (In a short period of time)? Could I take a SAW, fire a couple hundred rounds with ironsights, and then quickly add a scope?

[Jinef 2]

You would need to re zero it obviously. Not really quickly done.

[denoir 0]

It depends on how you define "quickly". You generally need a screwdriver. But it's fairly simple on weapons that have standard rails on the receiver. You attach a compatible mount and then you attach your scope on the mount. There are quite many different methods for this, depending on the type and brand of the scope.

As Jinef siad -most often it's the calibration, not the mounting that takes time.

[Balschoiw 0]

Hmmm if you have calibrated the scope on the weapon before, you don´t have much problems when you have a corresponding mounting system. Some of them are in 2 parts, wich means you leave the mounting-unit on the weapon and shoot on ironsights and you can take your scope and attach it to the weapon with a *click*. Those systems are pretty good. Of course you can´t use them on all weapons because of the sights limits some weapons do you have. But even without a permanent mounting-unit it is possible to change sights fast to scoped. I like the first variant better. It enables you to use unscoped, scoped or NV scoped weapon during one patrol. The system works pretty accurate.

Anyway it´s a matter of wich weapon you want to use.

[hellfish6 7]

Zeroing sights is a bitch - I was never able to properly zero my M-16, but I ended up shooting very well with it in basic training.

[Gordy 0]

Zeroing sights is a bitch - I was never able to properly zero my M-16, but I ended up shooting very well with it in basic training.

The same.

When I first grabbed an AK-47 I messed with my sight set-up. So for the next hour i was shooting everything except the target.

Then I managed to come on top with it.

It was fun though.

[redliner47 0]

yeah zeroing weapons is a major pain, much harder with open sights IMO

[Mister Frag 0]

I have a couple of scopes that I swap as needed on both A2 carry handle and flattop (Picatinny rail) uppers. They are all fixed-power low-magnification scopes, such as the Trijicon Reflex. The attachment systems use knurled thumbscrews that can be manipulated without any tools, and the scopes hold their zero across the distances that the rifles are used at despite repeated mounting/removal of the scopes.

I also have high-power variable-magnification scopes (one goes up to 40x), and these scopes will not hold their zero. The rings for these attach to rails using torx screws, and unless a very consistent amount of torque is used, the zero will change. There are some people that use torque wrenches, but I just leave the scopes on the rifle and don't need to worry about it.

H&K has a great claw scope mount design that can be used to attach optics to their rifles and SMGs, and they will also hold their zero quite well. These mounts can also be added or removed without tools.

[redliner47 0]

jesus 40x? when i went hunting out west I barely needed a 12x!

what would you use that for?

[Mister Frag 0]

jesus 40x? when i went hunting out west I barely needed a 12x!

what would you use that for?

It's a target/benchrest scope -- certainly overkill for hunting.

It does let me shoot 100 yard groups that are a single ragged hole, provided I'm doing my part and the wind is consistent.

[Grizzlie 0]

He uses it as AA - hunting flies ;)

[WhoCares 0]

I think in a comparison of the M4 vs. XM8 one of the biggest advantages of the XM8 was, that the XM8 scope remains zeroed if dismounted - remounted. However, it was in an advertisement presentation of HK  

Edit 1: Found a link but I can't open it - stupid company restrictions... So I'm not sure that it si the proper file...

Edit 2: Found an html version of it:

XM8

Quote[/b] ]Integrated operator removable 1/1 reflex sight with integrated IT laser and illuminator. Contains electronic red dot and backup etched range reticule with molded-in emergency sight. All devices are mounted on the same optical plain so all three devices are zeroed on the rifle front he factory or in the field by the operator in one operation. Sight uses a single DL123 battery and single wired or wireless remote switch. Mounts to weapon via flush mounting points and quick release mount that provides 100% zero retention.

M4

Quote[/b] ]Optional M68 CCO, AN/PEO-2, AN/PAQ-4 must be mounted and re zeroed separately when mounted on MIL STD 1913 rails.

[joltan 0]

Quote[/b] ]Integrated operator removable 1/1 reflex sight with integrated IT laser and illuminator. Contains electronic red dot and backup etched range reticule with molded-in emergency sight. All devices are mounted on the same optical plain so all three devices are zeroed on the rifle front he factory or in the field by the operator in one operation. Sight uses a single DL123 battery and single wired or wireless remote switch. Mounts to weapon via flush mounting points and quick release mount that provides 100% zero retention.

I see a possible disadvantage: you can't have scopes zeroed to different distances (like one with high magnification zeroed at a farther distance than another with low magnification for close distance). Which, in my eyes, would seem to be the main advantage of using different scopes (apart from special NV scopes, etc.).

[Necromancer- 0]

Or you could adjust the hop-up.

[joltan 0]

Mhhh, if I understood it right with the XM8 the part that's adjusted to zero the scope to a certain distance is fixed to the gun, so 'adjusting' it would actually mean 'rezeroing' everytime you want to have the gun zeroed to another distance. If the adjustable part is fixed to the scope instead you zero your scopes once to the desired distances - and every time you attach one of them the gun is already zeroed to the respective distance you want for that scope.

Sounds like the M4 rail is more like that - and to me that sound more practical & flexible. Of course, if you don't need/want different zeroing distances then the XM8 design is simpler.

[4 IN 1 0]

Mhhh, if I understood it right with the XM8 the part that's adjusted to zero the scope to a certain distance is fixed to the gun, so 'adjusting' it would actually mean 'rezeroing' everytime you want to have the gun zeroed to another distance. If the adjustable part is fixed to the scope instead you zero your scopes once to the desired distances - and every time you attach one of them the gun is already zeroed to the respective distance you want for that scope.

Sounds like the M4 rail is more like that - and to me that sound more practical & flexible. Of course, if you don't need/want different zeroing distances then the XM8 design is simpler.

well i dont think the zeroing part is on the gun instead of the sights, XM8 sight mounting is a simlple system which enable you to change through sights quicky, what you CANT do is using different sights from another XM8 as the zero for different sights and rifle is different

zeroing is things that you do to the sight, not the rifle

[PiNs_Da_Smoka 0]

4th Q of 2005?! Ohhh....good thing i'm in a high speed unit that gets all the goods first. New vehicles, new uniforms, new weapons seems like the perfect thing to top that off.

[stgn 39]

Can you easily switch scopes on military weapons? For instance, could I take an M4 + Aimpoint scope, remove the Aimpoint scope, and then add an ACOG (In a short period of time)? Could I take a SAW, fire a couple hundred rounds with ironsights, and then quickly add a scope?

Well the ACOG the USSF(msn version) uses are specialy ceroed for the M4 so I think you could mount it and be able to hit out to 400m or somthing whit out having to cero it first. But you shold always cero your gun for your self not some factory and remember when the barrel gets very hot if will bend slightly so you would need to recero whit some times so you whont hit over your taget. good tank gunners can compensade during battels and keep making perfrects

hits, I know there is a slight difference.

Quote[/b] ]Sounds like the M4 rail is more like that - and to me that sound more practical & flexible. Of course, if you don't need/want different zeroing distances then the XM8 design is simpler.

Dont forget that the Gun has more fire power(higher muzzel speed) and comes in a smaller packagde(shorter and Slimmer)

STGN

[Mister Frag 0]

The ACOG TA01NSN has a BDC (Bullet Drop Compensator) that is configured for the M4 and the 62gr SS109 / M855. Provided the powder charge / muzzle velocity is consistent, any 16" barrel M4 should experience essentially the same bullet drop.

However, that doesn't mean that all rifles will have the same zero. Bent barrels, barrel nut torque, barrel flex, handguard fit, sling tension etc. all change the point of impact, and while a good-quality scope / mount should hold its zero when reattached to the same weapon, it doesn't mean that it will be perfectly zeroed on another seemingly identical weapon.

Edit: Added the specific ACOG model number that is designed for the 62gr SS109 / M855 in a 16" barrel M4A1.

[stgn 39]

The ACOG TA01NSN has a BDC (Bullet Drop Compensator) that is configured for the M4 and the 62gr SS109 / M855. Provided the powder charge / muzzle velocity is consistent, any 16" barrel M4 should experience essentially the same bullet drop.

However, that doesn't mean that all rifles will have the same zero. Bent barrels, barrel nut torque, barrel flex, handguard fit, sling tension etc. all change the point of impact, and while a good-quality scope / mount should hold its zero when reattached to the same weapon, it doesn't mean that it will be perfectly zeroed on another seemingly identical weapon.

Edit: Added the specific ACOG model number that is designed for the 62gr SS109 / M855 in a 16" barrel M4A1.

A 16" barrel M4A1? dont you mean 14.5"

STGN

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

the name of the company I work for is called SCOPE I just thought I mention it... even though noone would realy care

[stgn 39]

the name of the company I work for is called SCOPE    I just thought I mention it... even though noone would realy care

So do they make scopes or what

"The new scopes form SCOPE makes you hit tagets over 1 km away"

STGN

[Mister Frag 0]

The ACOG TA01NSN has a BDC (Bullet Drop Compensator) that is configured for the M4 and the 62gr SS109 / M855. Provided the powder charge / muzzle velocity is consistent, any 16" barrel M4 should experience essentially the same bullet drop.

However, that doesn't mean that all rifles will have the same zero. Bent barrels, barrel nut torque, barrel flex, handguard fit, sling tension etc. all change the point of impact, and while a good-quality scope / mount should hold its zero when reattached to the same weapon, it doesn't mean that it will be perfectly zeroed on another seemingly identical weapon.

Edit: Added the specific ACOG model number that is designed for the 62gr SS109 / M855 in a 16" barrel M4A1.

A 16" barrel M4A1? dont you mean 14.5"

STGN

Nope. It's calibrated for a 16" barrel.

Quote[/b] ]Details: ACOG 4x32 Scope with Yellow Center Illumination for M4A1 - includes

Flat Top Adapter, Backup Iron Sights and Dust Cover.

The TA01NSN was designed specifically for the US Special Operations

Command SOPMOD M4 Carbine. To meet their requirements, the reticle

bullet drop compensator and range finding stadia lines are based on

the trajectory of the 62 grain bullet from a 16 inch barrel,

flattop mount (Picatinny rail Mil.Std.1913).

Magnification: 4X

Eye Relief: 1.5 in

Exit Pupil: 8 mm

Field of View: 7.0 degrees

Length: 5.8 in

Weight: 9.9 oz

Field of View: 36.8 ft at 100 yds

Adjustment: 3 clicks per inch at 100 yds.

Tritium Activity: 100 milliCuries in one source

Source: http://www.trijicon-inc.com/user/parts/products1.cfm?PartID=142

[Mister Frag 0]

the name of the company I work for is called SCOPE    I just thought I mention it... even though noone would realy care

So do they make scopes or what

"The new scopes form SCOPE makes you hit tagets over 1 km away"

STGN

I hope he doesn't make mouthwash...

[madmedic 0]

Well the ACOG the USSF(msn version) uses are specialy ceroed for the M4 so I think you could mount it and be able to hit out to 400m or somthing whit out having to cero it first. But you shold always cero your gun for your self not some factory and remember when the barrel gets very hot if will bend slightly so you would need to recero whit some times so you whont hit over your taget. good tank gunners can compensade during battels and keep making perfrects

hits, I know there is a slight difference.

Umm...not really sure what you are saying here, but no sight comes zeroed from the factory.

If you install a new ACOG on your M4, you must zero it...it will be nowhere near on target.

NOW, once it has been zeroed...if you have it mounted with a quality detachable mounting device...you should be able to remove/replace it as needed, and retain zero.