The Iraq Thread 2

[m21man 0]

Quote[/b] ]Hi M21man

You mean guys like George W. Bush?

Those are not the kind people they will need it needs to be experienced first responder types: Police, Fire and Rescue services and a reserve call up.

Young kids will not be up to the task.

Kind Regards Walker

Students who're now in college have grown up without having to worry about a draft. Therefore, they will be upset if one is put in place.

[toadlife 3]

I wonder if the death rate among US troops is still on that Exponential rise.

If so Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld may be having to make that hard decision of bringing in the Draft even though it will loose Bush the election....

A couple of bloody days in January does not equate to an exponential rise in casualties.

I don't know where you've been getting your information, but the U.S. will not have the need to reinstate the draft any time soon.

[denoir 0]

my feeling is that Rice and Powell are the doves, but because of their boss(Bush) they are taking the stands to take blunt, while Rummy and Wolfy are sitting in corner.

Powell, perhpas, but I don't give a damn anymore. He is willingly and knowingly following Bush. I'm tired of hearing excuses for Powell.

As for Rice, she's a hawk and always has been. I consider her being one of the most appalling figures of TBA. Like the time she said that Saddam is the worst tyrant and dictator of the 20th century.  

At least Wolfowitz is upfront with his beliefs and is not trying to hide it behind demagoguery.

As for Rumsfeld, I'm not sure if he's a moron and a buffoon or if he's just putting on a show.

Quote[/b] ]I kinda wonder if Ari Fleisher decided to leave thinking that this administration was on its collision course. White House spokes person is not an easy task, but his early(?) departure still makes me wonder.

I can't say that I miss him and his smug face.

[Balschoiw 0]

Powell is done for me. He sold his soul to TBA with all consequences. I´ve seen an interview with him yesterday where he brought up the WMD shit again. This time he said that Iraq used WMD´s against Kurds and in the iran / iraq war but didn´t mention that Saddam got the US support to do so while with war with Iran.

It´s so disgusting to see the  TBA winding like a snake for their lies.

Interesting that the US have removed 1/3 of their WMD inspectors from Iraq. Basically this means that they have given up the idea of finding WMD´s in Iraq.

Asked for the evidence he presented at the UN like the trucks, the transfer of WMD´s within Iraq (Bush said this in march short before war), the plants presented in his fairytale "powell-point" presentation he got pissed but did not answer the questions.

It all was a blatant lie.

Get these people in front of a court if you are still proud of your country.

Edit:

Quote[/b] ]The US search for chemical, biological and nuclear weapons (WMD, Weapons of Mass Destruction) in Iraq has pretty much come up dry. American investigators have found and interrogated hundreds of  Iraqis who worked on these weapons programs. It appears that most, if not all, of the chemical and biological weapons were destroyed in the 1990s. The nuclear weapons and long range missile program had not gone far. However, Saddam ran a very fragmented police state, where no one knew what was going on everywhere. There were many different "special weapons" programs going on independently. None of those interrogated so far have admitted to knowing about stocks of chemical or biological weapons. Much work was done on plans for quickly building factories that could produce old, and new designs, for chemical and biological weapons. But the 1991 oil embargo hit the Iraqi economy very hard and there wasn't money for building these plants and producing the weapons. It is still not clear why Saddam did not admit that he had no chemical weapons and allow UN inspectors to verify this. It is thought that he feared UN investigations would uncover evidence of mass murders and corruption. The interrogations of Saddam are trying to resolve these questions.

GREAT INTELLIGENCE WORK TBA !!!

GREAT TO START A WAR FOR THAT !!!

GREAT TO SEE US BLOOD WASTED FOR OIL !!!

(no more justifying reasons remaining)

IF Bush should EVER again talk of justice in public again he should be the first example to experience justice !

[denoir 0]

I found this a bit interesting:

FOX article on Powells statements

You'll notice that it's basically the same content that CNN posted. The core of the text is roughly the same, with small subtle changes.

CNN:

Quote[/b] ]The study, released Thursday, was conducted by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, a nonpartisan, respected group that opposed the war in Iraq.

FOX:

Quote[/b] ]On Thursday, a liberal Washington think tank accused the administration of exaggerating the threat from Iraq, and argued that the United States should abolish its policy of conducting pre-emptive wars and should work with the United Nations on completing an inventory and history of Iraq's weapons program. [/b]

Nice little twisting on FOX's part to deminish the credibility of the report - since for the FOX generally conservative audience, "liberal" is a negative word.

Another thing that caught my eye, which shows how TBA has not yet mastered the art of telling the truth.

Quote[/b] ]And in Iran, aggressive diplomacy in cooperation with the Europeans convinced the government there to agree to halt programs that could have produced nuclear weapons and to accept more intrusive inspections, Powell said.

"In cooperation with the Europeans" my ass. The US was not involved in the deal in any way but to loudly refuse to have any talks with the Iranians and to very loudly complain about the final deal. The deal was made by the EU and the Iranians and nobody else, especially not USA who was very opposed to diplomatic talks with Iran in the first place. And now TBA are taking credit for it. I guess that when lying becomes a part of your lifestyle it comes very easily..

[Gollum1 0]

As for Rice, she's a hawk and always has been. I consider her being one of the most appalling figures of TBA. Like the time she said that Saddam is the worst tyrant and dictator of the 20th century.  

Oh Christ....

Anyway, I remember you (Denoir) posted a graph of U.S casualties since the end of the war sometime in October or September(showing a clear increase almost every month), is there an up-to-date chart?

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]"In cooperation with the Europeans" my ass. The US was not involved in the deal in any way but to loudly refuse to have any talks with the Iranians and to very loudly complain about the final deal.

This is getting better and better every day. El Baradei (US people may rember him as he was the one who said there was no nuclear danger coming from Iraq prior war) fixed the deal with old europe and Iran.

Mr Bush, the permanent liar once again twists it till it fits for him. (how low can he go? )

Neither US authorities, nor scientists, nor intelligence agencies, nor US officials, not even the embassador was part of this talks.

US had nothing better to do than to accuse Iran for a nuclear weapon program, collaboration with AQ and Syria against US and such.

That were the things TBA contributed.

In fact US interventions made it even harder for old europe ( repeat old europe) to negotiate with Iran.

I´m sick of the TBA lies.

Go piss Mr Bush !

Mess your own country but stay away from us.

Quote[/b] ]January 7, 2004: The government says it arrested several Iranians, apparently soldiers, and accused them of working for the CIA and sending secret information over the Internet.

Nothing better to do TBA ?

[toadlife 3]

I found this a bit interesting:

FOX article on Powells statements

You'll notice that it's basically the same content that CNN posted. The core of the text is roughly the same, with small subtle changes.

CNN:

Quote[/b] ]The study, released Thursday, was conducted by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, a nonpartisan, respected group that opposed the war in Iraq.

FOX:

Quote[/b] ]On Thursday, a liberal Washington think tank accused the administration of exaggerating the threat from Iraq, and argued that the United States should abolish its policy of conducting pre-emptive wars and should work with the United Nations on completing an inventory and history of Iraq's weapons program. [/b]

Nice little twisting on FOX's part to deminish the credibility of the report - since for the FOX generally conservative audience, "liberal" is a negative word.

Nice observation.

When I want entertainent I watch Fox News, when I want to know what happened in the world today, I watch CNN.

[Acecombat 0]

Quote[/b] ]"In cooperation with the Europeans" my ass. The US was not involved in the deal in any way but to loudly refuse to have any talks with the Iranians and to very loudly complain about the final deal.

This is getting better and better every day. El Baradei (US people may rember him as he was the one who said there was no nuclear danger coming from Iraq prior war) fixed the deal with old europe and Iran.

Mr Bush, the permanent liar once again twists it till it fits for him. (how low can he go? )

Neither US authorities, nor scientists, nor intelligence agencies, nor US officials, not even the embassador was part of this talks.

US had nothing better to do than to accuse Iran for a nuclear weapon program, collaboration with AQ and Syria against US and such.

That were the things TBA contributed.

In fact US interventions made it even harder for old europe ( repeat old europe) to negotiate with Iran.

I´m sick of the TBA lies.

Go piss Mr Bush !

Mess your own country but stay away from us.

Quote[/b] ]January 7, 2004: The government says it arrested several Iranians, apparently soldiers, and accused them of working for the CIA and sending secret information over the Internet.

Nothing better to do TBA  ?

After alls been said and done why is it that the american people dont do something about this prick?

Hell Clinton got impeached for lying on nailing Monicka but Bush gets away after lying about a whole war ....

Why is all this sudden patriotism on protecting TBA?

when all hes doing is ruin their country's image in the first place , i thought the american system didnt put up with this sorta crap and was suppose to be the better one among the worlds present systems buts its all turning out to be a bad illusion.

I cant understand for once why everyone literally from anti Bush to Pro Bush somehow wiggle in a statement to protect them (thats in context to americans mainly).

[m21man 0]

Quote[/b] ]After alls been said and done why is it that the american people dont do something about this prick?  

Hell Clinton got impeached for lying on nailing Monicka but Bush gets away after lying about a whole war ....

He got impeached for perjury, which Bush hasn't committed (Yet...).

Quote[/b] ]When I want entertainent I watch Fox News, when I want to know what happened in the world today, I watch CNN.

When I want my news from right-wing nuts, I watch FOX. When I want my news from left-wing nuts, I watch CNN. When I want my news from a completely unbiased source, I give up .

[EiZei 0]

CNN? Left-wing nuts?

[m21man 0]

In my opinion, they're as lefty as Fox is righty. Watch the two together, and you've got "fair and balanced coverage" .

[bn880 5]

No way... CNN is not left wing... both sources are simply incomplete in covering the news, as with most Canadian media as well.

EDIT: Incomplete/centrist/protectionistic

[m21man 0]

All biased news agencies edit out news that doesn't fit their idea of what should be told. CNN edits out one type of stories, FOX the other type.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Speaking from the center, I can tell you that CNN does not have a liberal bias. Period. It's reporting is irrelevant and sensationalist, but without doubt it is as impartial as American TV news gets. It plays host to the only 'equal-time' show on cable that is actually equal time (Crossfire- not that the show's any better because of it, but it is regardless), and it displays no overt political shade in either the way it operates or the people it hires- whereas Fox was founded by Roger Ailes, an infamous Republican attack dog, and crewed by such fair and balanced folks as a former Bush Sr. speechwriter, the editors of some of the most conservative magazines in the country, and Oliver North (need I say more?). Its guests include such fair and balanced folks as Richard Perle (fired neo-con), Alexander Haig (shiver), William Bennet (self-proclaimed moral compass with a serious gambling problem), the list goes on. The only way in which CNN is left-leaning is that it refuses to come to knee-jerk conclusions like Fox does- rather, it comes to no conclusion at all, making it inconsequential.

I hope it isn't too obvious that I loathe 24-hour cable news.

[Acecombat 0]

I agree with TEX.

On a sidenote a new Arab news channel will be starting soon ready to upset Al Jazeera probably its name is Al-Akhbar.

[ralphwiggum 6]

i support the name to be Al-gebra.

just in case people did not know, CNN is still keeping its special report site up regarding the war.

http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/iraq/index.html

[toadlife 3]

LOL.

From BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3382917.stm

Quote[/b] ]The left-leaning Carnegie Endowment for International Peace said US officials misrepresented the threat from Iraqi weapons of mass destruction.

[denoir 0]

LMAO.  

[Longinius 1]

Quote[/b] ]He got impeached for perjury, which Bush hasn't committed (Yet...).

Yes, and the act of perjury was in regards to something noone except his family had any business with anyway. What does it matter to the people if Clinton has a mistress? Does that make him any better or worse as a president?

[Gollum1 0]

BTW I watched a BBC documentary about a friendly fire incident during the Iraq war, when an F-14 mistakenly bombed a convoy of Kurdish troops, U.S SF and BBC journalists. It was due to incorrect information from an American in the convoy calling in an airstrike on Iraqi armor in the horizon (he didn't bother giving coordinates).  The whole convoy was halted and everyone was basically taking a break, the camera was filming and suddenly the tape skipped, 3 seconds later the convoy was on fire and mutilated corpses were lying all over the place. The cameraman just kept filming and you saw the entire tape continuosly, with ammo cooking off and blackened half-skeletons peeking out of burning cars.

Everyone who sometimes thinks real war is a bit cool should watch the doc.

At least 16 Kurds were killed and over 40 wounded.

Has anyone else seen it?

[denoir 0]

Quote[/b] ]He got impeached for perjury, which Bush hasn't committed (Yet...).

Yes, and the act of perjury was in regards to something noone except his family had any business with anyway. What does it matter to the people if Clinton has a mistress? Does that make him any better or worse as a president?

I think the matter was that he lied under oath in a court of law. Of course the whole thing was a staged witch-hunt aimed at humiliating Clinton, but IIRC they had fairly good legal grounds to impeach him.

[m21man 0]

Quote[/b] ]I think the matter was that he lied under oath in a court of law.

That is perjury, is it not?

[denoir 0]

Quote[/b] ]I think the matter was that he lied under oath in a court of law.

That is perjury, is it not?

Yes, I was just pointing out that it was the issue, and not what he was lying about. He could have been lying about his shoe-size and it would just as well be grounds for impeachement as long as he lied under oath in a court of law.

[Longinius 1]

Yeah, my point still stands though. He lied under oath about a matter that had nothing to do with his abilities as president. Had he lied about his job, his decisions or his policies then I would see what the fuss is about. But a guy lieing about having a mistress... well, I think that is quite common and in the world of politics extremely irrelevant.

But hey, if you rather have a president that lies to start a war than one that lies to try and protect his private life, and his families, thats fine by me. Your call.