The Dogs of War

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,08:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,07:21)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,08:19)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Anybody notice that there has been a complete silence on coalition casualties the last 48h?<span id='postcolor'>

Look here.<span id='postcolor'>

Those are old official pentagon numbers. As I said, they have not been updated for 48h and I doubt that they were correct in the first place.<span id='postcolor'>

Look here.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,12:59)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,08:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,07:21)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,08:19)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Anybody notice that there has been a complete silence on coalition casualties the last 48h?<span id='postcolor'>

Look here.<span id='postcolor'>

Those are old official pentagon numbers. As I said, they have not been updated for 48h and I doubt that they were correct in the first place.<span id='postcolor'>

Look here.<span id='postcolor'>

Yes and I've heard from just as credible sources that there are no coalition troops in Umm Qasr and that there are no coalition forces heading towards Baghdad

I can even post a link to this spectacular source

Well, to be fair, it at least answered my first question.

[theavonlady 2]

Reuters: Coalition ammo and supplies convoy fired upon by civilian dressed Iraqis north of Nassiriya. No details.

[Guest]

Reuters video - Main telecom center in Baghdad bombed last night.

What did I tell you!

[theavonlady 2]

Reuters video. Detailed interview with 3 wounded US servicemen, with details of battle in Nassiriya.

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

First i would like to say that if this conflict lasts a month or two (as most of the analysts here have said) that IS a short war. That length of time is reasonable given the numbers of troops involved and their positions.

Denoir you seem to have bad eyesight.

I said (in the midst of a large post)-

"I dread to know what they did to get some of those men to drive out in those tanks"

You said-

Denoir-"Probably much less then then what the British commanders had to do to get their troops to drive their tanks.

Is it so hard to understand that the Iraqi people and military are fighting to defend their home country?

To put it in terms that you might understand:

During the Battle of Britain, did the Churchill regime have to point a gun at the pilots who went up against the Germans?

LOL. And you are calling Balschoiw biased."

YOU MISSED THE VERY NEXT LINE!

Me-" (unless it is a genuine show of national loyalty as some people would suggest)."

you need to go to the optician perhaps?

Where did Balschoiw say 'British troops will engage with all Iraqi civilians(according to some reports i have heard) , unless the reports are wrong as some would suggest.'

nowhere.

You think British troops will deliberatly try to kill as many civilians as possible?

You think the uprising in Basra in 1991 was just a mirage?

You think Saddam Hussein is comparable to Winston Churchill?

You think America and Britain are comparable to the Nazis?

OH YES!!!!

How did i miss Winston Churchill killing tens of thousands of people in Birmingham when they rose up against him?

How did i miss him using chemical weapons against Edinburgh ,Glasgow and Dundee?

How did i miss him appointing only people from his home town(or family) to the top positions?

How did i miss him totally destroying any signs of democracy?

How did i miss him ordering the torture and execution of tens or hundreds of thousands?

How did i miss him dunking Neville Chamberlain in an acid bath?

If all of that had happened then your statement might have SOME sense of reality but as it is...

A better comparison would be with Stalin or Hitler(and could still make your point as the populations fought)

To put it in terms you might understand:

Rubbish!

You have really no more idea of the feelings or hopes of the majority of Iraqis than me. You think im not aware of such things as nationalism?

That said i think many Sunnis will fight very hard for the regime and even in the name of Saddam. Somewhat less so for the Shia who if they fight are more likely to fight for their country than the figure of Saddam.

Well before this becomes political -*haha*-

It has been reported that another Iraqi missile has been shot down heading into Kuwait by the coalition.... its better for the Iraqis in propaganda terms than for real operational benefits.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 27 2003,14:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"I dread to know what they did to get some of those men to drive out in those tanks"<span id='postcolor'>

You mean like this? (JPost subscribers only)

The above link is an AP dispatch and not one of the JP's always-have-a-slant articles, tsk, tsk.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,13:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 27 2003,14:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"I dread to know what they did to get some of those men to drive out in those tanks"<span id='postcolor'>

You mean like this? (JPost subscribers only)

The above link is an AP dispatch and not one of the JP's always-have-a-slant articles, tsk, tsk.<span id='postcolor'>

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> U.S. and British officials said Thursday.

<span id='postcolor'>

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"Once again, we see the regime's terrorist tactics, where they bring the innocent onto the battlefield as they try to do anything to stay in power," he said. <span id='postcolor'>

What's that smell?

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,14:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> U.S. and British officials said Thursday.

<span id='postcolor'><span id='postcolor'>

Gasp! I thought it was the Saddam Hussein Commitee for Human Rights!

Once again, I'm just posting what was reported. Is it happening? Are the reports baseless? Is it just military wartime propaganda?

Maybe.

Maybe not.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,14:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What's that smell?  <span id='postcolor'>

Gunpowder?

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,14:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Reuters: Coalition ammo and supplies convoy fired upon by civilian dressed Iraqis north of Nassiriya. No details.<span id='postcolor'>

This report might be referring to events in Nassiriya yesterday. Interesting read on the complexities of convoy running.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,14:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 27 2003,14:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"I dread to know what they did to get some of those men to drive out in those tanks"<span id='postcolor'>

You mean like this? (JPost subscribers only)

The above link is an AP dispatch and not one of the JP's always-have-a-slant articles, tsk, tsk.<span id='postcolor'>

Similar reporting on this Sky News article.

If the end of the article is true, that may explain the suicidal stupidity of the Iraqi armor coming out of Basra heading south straight into coalition force's gunsites.

I'm sure there's another theory to explain this. Denoir?

[theavonlady 2]

Meanwhile, back near the Kuwaiti border....................

[theavonlady 2]

Apparently more bombings in Baghdad.

Alos, UK Defense Ministry says the two Brits shown on Iraqi TV are civilian truck (lorry ) drivers and are not military conscripts.

[FSPilot 0]

The only reason they're moving so fast is because they're afraid the US public wouldn't want a slow war. So they're running in and securing it later.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,14:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I'm sure there's another theory to explain this. Denoir? <span id='postcolor'>

The same as before

[Die Alive 0]

Free Pin-Ups for Allied forces

All Iraqi soldiers get are free pin ups of Saddam.

-=Die Alive=-

[theavonlady 2]

Could an Iraqi missile have hit the market yesterday?

I have some technical questions about the market bombing yesterday:

1. Was it a bomb or a missile?

2. There was a pic somewhere with the Iraqis holding what looked like a rocket nozzle, claiming it was found at the scene. Anyone else seen the pic and can the missile be identiifed through it.

3. Are there any bombs in use over Baghdad that have parachutes attached to them during any part of the descent?

[joltan 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,14:54)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">9--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,149)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I'm sure there's another theory to explain this. Denoir? <span id='postcolor'>

The same as before <span id='postcolor'>

I think both arguments hold.

There are those that will loose everything if the coalition wins.

There are those forced by these groups to fight their war.

There are those who see the US as the agressor they have to defend their country against.

None of the three reasons above requires those fighting to like Saddam, but all will fight. At least those forced to fight will be more willing to surrender - if given the chance. While the US surely expected those depending on the regieme to fight, it seems that they completely forgot about the last point - thinking that every Iraqui was just craving to be liberated...

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,15:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Could an Iraqi missile have hit the market yesterday?<span id='postcolor'>

Eye witnesses said that two Tomahawk cruise missiles hit the market.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Maj.-Gen. Stanley McChrystal said the U.S. had not targeted the Al-Shaab district in northern Baghdad, but admitted it was possible missiles had gone astray, causing the worst single incident of civilian casualties in a week of war.<span id='postcolor'>

src

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 27 2003,16:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">9--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,159)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Could an Iraqi missile have hit the market yesterday?<span id='postcolor'>

Eye witnesses said that two Tomahawk cruise missiles hit the market.  

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Maj.-Gen. Stanley McChrystal said the U.S. had not targeted the Al-Shaab district in northern Baghdad, but admitted it was possible missiles had gone astray, causing the worst single incident of civilian casualties in a week of war.<span id='postcolor'>

src<span id='postcolor'>

Yeh, I know all that. I'm not impressed by "could have" claims either.

The reason I asked about the chute is because Iraqi TV showed people on the street with a green parachute, claiming it was found nearby. It also showed that the label in the chute said it was manufactured by Israel Military Industries, Jerusalem.

Found it all very strange.

[Winters 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Die Alive @ Mar. 27 2003,15:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Free Pin-Ups for Allied forces

All Iraqi soldiers get are free pin ups of Saddam.

-=Die Alive=-<span id='postcolor'>

No No No,

Its:

"all iraqi soldiers getted pinned up BY saddam"

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 27 2003,15:28)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The reason I asked about the chute is because Iraqi TV showed people on the street with a green parachute, claiming it was found nearby. It also showed that the label in the chute said it was manufactured by Israel Military Industries, Jerusalem.

Found it all very strange.<span id='postcolor'>

Sounds very much like bs. to me. Wouldn't surprise me if it was planted.

[PFC_Mike 2]

Damn, I shoulda joined the army...free issues of Good Housekeeping! Also, non-nude photos from Playboy.

What a morale booster.

Any idea on how many Iraqi KIA? I'm guessing close to 5-6000

Coalition maybe 100 KIA, although that's a very high estimate.

Iraqi + Vehicle = Dead Iraqi + Burning Vehicle

If I were an Iraqi tank driver I'd just leave. The Coalition is slaughtering them from the air and the ground.

I'm beginning to wonder if there is a connection between all of the corpses in US uniforms and the uniforms Saddam bought for the Ba'athists to conduct massacres in. Perhaps fewer US/UK troops have been killed than Denoir, Bn880, Balschow want?

Any updates on the Polish GROM commandos?

[theavonlady 2]

News:

1. Thousands of civilians fleeing Nassiriyah. Large amounts leaving Basra as well.

2. UK says there were only 3 Iraqi tanks destroyed yesterday, heading south out of Basra.