squad ai mod SOG AI

[johnnyboy 3793]

57 minutes ago, scottb613 said:

I use the mods listed above.

Thanks.  That's alot of mods.  There's really no way I can diagnose a conflict with all those mods, sorry.  If somebody reports wheel menu not responding issues without mods, then I can investigate.

[maqim 33]

Heya, johnnyboy,

 

I remember watching this Immediate Action Drill video almost a year ago and being very excited. For anyone who hasn't seen this vid, you should definitely check it out.

 

In the video you mention you were working on a script for player control with hand signals. I assume this amazing SOG AI we now have is the fruition  of the work you were doing then. I was just wondering if or how the script from the video is incorporated into the SOG AI mod. Like, the leapfrogging and "tailgunner plant mine" commands exist in SOG AI, but just wondering how this all ties together. How do we utilise SOG AI to achieve a similar "break contact" result?

 

Thanks again for this incredible addition to the SP game 🙂

 

Cheers,

maqim

Edited August 19, 2022 by maqim
Edied for clarity and spelling

[johnnyboy 3793]

1 minute ago, maqim said:

Heya, johnnyboy,

 

I remember watching this Immediate Action Drill video almost a year ago and being very excited. For anyone who hasn't seen this vid, you should definitely check it out.

 

In the video you mention a script for player control with hand signals which I assume is this amazing SOG AI we now have. I was just wondering if or how the script from the video is incorporated into the SOG AI mod. Like, the leapfrogging and "tailgunner plant mine" commands exist in SOG AI, but just wondering how this all ties together?

 

Thanks again for this iincredible addition to the SP game 🙂

 

Cheers,

maqim

That immediate action drill was the genesis of SOG AI.  The hand signals, wheel menu, and moving units to positions all evolved from that.  Sadly, the Immediate Action drill itself I could never get to work well enough for general usage in SOG.  It looked good for cut scenes, but their survivability and ability to suppress effectively just wasn't good enough.  Later I moved on to Leap Frogging, which was way more effective.  Once I had Leap Frogging, Fast Moves, plus AI Revive working, then I knew I had core features to make SOG AI a reality.

 

I've actually learned alot since the Immediate Action demo, and may give it another go.  It would be amazing if it could work well 90% of the time.

[maqim 33]

Thanks for the response, sir. It would be amazing if that drill could work, but as is, this has transformed the SP SOG:Prairie Fire game in a way that other methods couldn't. I used to play a game called Vietcong many years ago - my favourite FPS ever ... until now. The SOG:Prairie Fire DLC is amazing but lacked the SP playability many of us want from time to time. THIS (SOG Prairie Fire w SOG AI) is now my favourite FPS ever.

 

Thanks, man! Your work is mind-blowing.

[johnnyboy 3793]

Wow, thanks a ton man!  Vietcong was also an all time favorite for me.  Great game.

[johnnyboy 3793]

Preview of new feature in next release of SOG AI:

 

If you like SOG AI (and haven't done so already), please rate and comment on Steam!

[bardosy 158]

Hey Johnnyboy!

 

Thanks for this excellent mod!

Please let me share my experience and correct me if I did something wrong!

 

I tested it with my Valkyrie mission. First I tried it in SP mode but it cannot open your command wheel. So I tried in MP (first with my original AI teammates, but something went wrong so I decide to disable all AI and use your teams) So I describe my third attempt:

I choose a 9 men Army group from your list.

I load the men to the helicopter with BIS "get in" order. And in the AO they unload nicely by my fixed script. Then I game them a frogleap order to east and it was a beauty how they perform it. They use grenade what is better than BIS AI. Then we turn back (get a new task) to the hospital. (In my second try - when I use my original team, not yours - I gave them a circle order from your wheel, but when I want to advance again, I use BIS follow me and it wont work, only your wheel's follow me). So then I game the new frog leap command to the hospital and they do it as it should be.

In the hospital garden I saw a hiding VC, so I dropped my grenade (what accidentaly was a WP) and it was nice to saw your fantastic script: the poor VC run towards to me in flames and before he died, he burn me too. Excellent.

But now the problems started.

I ordered my AI team to hold (bc they are usually poor performance in building) and enter the building alone. In both second and third try the hiding VC in the building killed me: once in the second floor and other time in the ground level.

When I was dying in the first floor, the rescue guy cannot reach me: he went UNDER me (so the exact location, but in the wrong floor) and cannot revive.

When I was dying in the ground level, two guys come to revive me, but they couldnt: one of them is just stop and the second one cannot pass him (he stucked, because of the other guy)

 

When I was in the first floor, I hold the Space for BIS respawn: all my men died with me and all of them respawn with me (those were my original men by the mission), but I cannot order them anymore by your wheel bc "When you are wounded, cannot command" (I was not wounded. Probably the respawn didnt reset this variable)

When I was in the ground floor, I dont want to respawn, bc I thought all the problem was bc of the respawn, so I wait, how the two AI will solve this problem. I dont really know what happend (maybe BIS respawn modul timeouted, or one of the guy finally revive me, but the VC immediately kill me again.... everything happen so fast), but I was forced to respawn. All my men died with me, but they didnt respawn (those were your men). And I still cannot command by wheel (not just because I had no men, but still warn me, I am wounded, what was not true)

 

My question is: what did I do wrong? Should I edit my mission and remove the BIS respawn modul? Can your AI locate me in 3D (not just 2D) when I wounded?

[scottb613 285]

Hi JB,

 

Just another thought - it's just my two cents - so please take it for what it's worth.

 

Would it be possible to run the SOG AI initialization on new units that join the players group?

 

This comes up when doing POW rescue missions - or - reinforcements (FNG's) are delivered.

 

Thanks.

 

Regards,
Scott

[johnnyboy 3793]

Hi Bardosy.  Thanks for trying the mod and the feedback.

57 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I tested it with my Valkyrie mission. First I tried it in SP mode but it cannot open your command wheel.

That's strange.  I ran your Boots mission SP, and command wheel appeared (using TAB key).  I'll try Valkyries and see if I have same problem.

 

Edit:  I just tried Valkyries mission, and Tab key brings up the wheel menu for me (no problem).

BTW, I just noticed that when choppers take off and first fly over water, you see the patrol boat below take off from shore and cruise.  That is a nice visual detail for making heli ride interesting.  Good work.

57 minutes ago, bardosy said:

(In my second try - when I use my original team, not yours - I gave them a circle order from your wheel, but when I want to advance again, I use BIS follow me and it wont work, only your wheel's follow me)

Usually BI vanilla commands also work.  But when I play with my mod I use command wheel 95% of the time, and only use BI commands when I need one particular unit to go somewhere specific.

57 minutes ago, bardosy said:

In the hospital garden I saw a hiding VC, so I dropped my grenade (what accidentaly was a WP) and it was nice to saw your fantastic script: the poor VC run towards to me in flames and before he died, he burn me too. Excellent.

Haha.  I've see that 100 times now, and still love it every time.  Thanks.

57 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I ordered my AI team to hold (bc they are usually poor performance in building) and enter the building alone. In both second and third try the hiding VC in the building killed me: once in the second floor and other time in the ground level.

When I was dying in the first floor, the rescue guy cannot reach me: he went UNDER me (so the exact location, but in the wrong floor) and cannot revive.

When I was dying in the ground level, two guys come to revive me, but they couldnt: one of them is just stop and the second one cannot pass him (he stucked, because of the other guy)

Since AI have trouble in buildings, this is a real problem.  I thought I had code to detect when player is in building, and if so, the AI should NOT come to his rescue, otherwise they might end up stuck under the building.   If for any reason, the AI don't reach player within 90 seconds, the player gets the Withstand option to heal himself.  This handles the case where AI can't find path to player to heal him (unless AI team is all dead or wounded, in which case player loses the mission).

 

This is a real problem, and I need to check my code so AI does not try to enter building and get stuck.  

 

If you design new missions with SOG AI in mind, these are things you can do to make them more friendly to SOG AI:

1. Don't put objectives in tunnels or large buildings, since AI can't path find there.
2. If there is a village in your AO that has many fences around buildings, remove the fences so AI can path find in the village.
3. Test your mission AO with AI following you and try different routes to your mission objectives.  Look for large gaps between boulders (or other obstacles) and see if AI will follow you.  If they won't follow player through the gap, then create a blocking obstacle there so player is not tempted to lead AI there, and then become frustrated with stupid AI.  For the campaign mission Ashtray I found many wide paths between boulders that AI would not follow, so I spawned punji fences and rocks there to block them, so player finds a friendlier path and is not frustrated.
4. Do not use Respawn module if you plan mission to be used by SOG AI.  But if you play your mission SP (like I did with Boots), this shouldn't be a problem.  My mod sets respawn tickets to zero automatically, and you shouldn't need respawn thanks to the AI revive system.

Thanks for trying the mod.  I'm sorry the building gave you a problem, and I will try to prevent AI from going in there.  Instead they will say "Can't get there!", and player will have to wait until Withstand action appears for him.

[johnnyboy 3793]

3 minutes ago, scottb613 said:

Would it be possible to run the SOG AI initialization on new units that join the players group?

 

This comes up when doing POW rescue missions - or - reinforcements (FNG's) are delivered.

 

I plan to add this in the future.  There are many story reasons why mission designer want to add units to group as story progresses, and I need to support that.  It will take some work so it may be a month or so before I get to it.

[scottb613 285]

2 minutes ago, johnnyboy said:

I plan to add this in the future.  There are many story reasons why mission designer want to add units to group as story progresses, and I need to support that.  It will take some work so it may be a month or so before I get to it.

 

Thanks for the consideration - and - most importantly - at your leisure.

 

Great Mod.

 

Regards,
Scott

[bardosy 158]

Johnnyboy,

 

I tried Valkyr in 4th times at night and your stuff works fine (mine not soo). I didnt play with arma in the last 5-6 months and all the updates since then ruined a lot of things:

* Somehow - when I play in SP - the task system didnt work. I didnt get new tasks. But all the triggers works, so I (who know what to do) can play it to the end, but there was no tasks. What is very odd, because the first 3 try I had.

* Somehow a litle white circle with transparent black fill is appear around my crosshair (I could play with it. Even it was easier to aim). I am not sure, maybe it's from your GUI? Maybe not.

* My napalm script (spawn a F4 with napalm and drop it) didnt work: the F4 spawned and fly correcly, but it didnt drop the bombs. Probably they change the name of the class of the bomb, so when I "fire" it, it's just dont do.

* The cannon on the beach (what I should use as arty map) is start jumping when I activate arty map. Sometimes it jumps into the water and damage the cannon and kill me. Other times, I could filfull the task (fire enough to the target area), so trigger activated and I could continue, but everything looks sooo ugly.

 

So my point is, I tried in SP mode and SOG AI works fine. I dont know why command wheel didnt appear in the first try.

Oh, just a small suggestion: maybe it's just me, but I had to try all the keys on keyboard to found the key to the command wheel. You should mention the Tab key in the description of Workshop. (But if all the other guys could use it without problem, maybe it's obvious, and I am just dumb.)

[bardosy 158]

I saw your YT video about Boots for walking mission. I commented it, but I have one question what is more esily to answer here.

 

In the village I saw you to use the bis revive (when your AI didnt help) How is it works for you? When I did it, your script told me I am wounded and cannot command my men.

[johnnyboy 3793]

6 hours ago, bardosy said:

So my point is, I tried in SP mode and SOG AI works fine. I dont know why command wheel didnt appear in the first try.

Well I'm glad it wasn't my mod's problem!  Haha.  The last Prairie Fire update broke some of my scripts also, and was caused by class name changes.

6 hours ago, bardosy said:

Somehow a litle white circle with transparent black fill is appear around my crosshair (I could play with it. Even it was easier to aim). I am not sure, maybe it's from your GUI?

That is strange, I have never seen thant.

2 hours ago, bardosy said:

In the village I saw you to use the bis revive (when your AI didnt help) How is it works for you? When I did it, your script told me I am wounded and cannot command my men.

When player shot and goes into wounded animation, he can't command while waiting for an AI to come and revive him.  But after 90 seconds if no AI comes--but there are still AI team mates alive--the player gets the Withstand revive action and he can heal himself.  I did this because when playing the long 1-2 hour campaign missions solo there is no SAVE game.  And sometimes the player's AI have bad path finding and can't get to the player.   So instead of player dying, I give him the Withstand action.

 

But if all of the AI team is dead or wounded, and player is wounded, then the mission will end with my fun ending (if you haven't seen it, kill all your team mates once while near the enemy and then let the enemy kill you)..

[scottb613 285]

9 hours ago, bardosy said:

* Somehow a litle white circle with transparent black fill is appear around my crosshair (I could play with it. Even it was easier to aim). I am not sure, maybe it's from your GUI? Maybe not.

Hi Folks,

 

I've seen that ONCE in all my testing - it wouldn't go away - restarted the mission - haven't seen it since. Just confirming it does exist. I can't recreate it.

 

Regards,
Scott

[johnnyboy 3793]

3 hours ago, scottb613 said:

I've seen that ONCE in all my testing - it wouldn't go away - restarted the mission - haven't seen it since. Just confirming it does exist. I can't recreate it.

That makes the mod suspect then.  But I'm simply re-using the Prairie Fire wheel menu calls where I substitute in an array with my options.  So if my mod is the culprit, the problem is likely buried in Savage Game Design's wheel menu gui code.  I don't plan on investigating this unless its a widely reported problem.

[bardosy 158]

Another feedback:

 

I tried my Secure Transport mission with SOG AI. Here are my experience:

 

* I dont know it's just the leapfrog or you did something else with the AI, but leapfrog is VERY EFFECTIVE. Yeah, it's not a fast train, but do the job: my squad became an advance panzer train. And also it looks extremly cool. In vanilla SP the player is the Rambo and team only support him. But with leapfrog, they do the job of a regular soldier and I can be the Team Leader. What is perfect! (I saw many feedbacks in Workshop forum and they are right: you should do this leapfrog command available as a mod for basic Arma (not just for SOG). Yeah, I get it, there is no command wheel, but if you just add in the action menu, it would be perfect!

* I dont know it was you, but it's the healing system, but my men has a bandage after they were healed by the medic. Very good mood.

* I know it's not easy (I mean the scripting is easy, but not too realistic), but you should add a command to action menu (like "treat you all") when some of AI team mate is far enough from the group (or detect somehow he is stucked - but if he is far away it's possible because he is stucked). So the player SL has an ability to unstuck him from action menu (just teleport him a few meters away or teleport him next to a closer AI teammate. I know and you know SOG terrain is a nightmare to AI and they always trapped. If you add a little help to the players (even if it's a little bit unrealistic) add a huge help.

Or if you have a better idea how to teleport a little bit realistic, it could solve your problem? not all PF mission is playable, because AI cant cross river... etc. So if you add some teleport option, player can swim or boat cross the river and then teleport the AIs.

* I get this circle again. Forget it! Probably connected somehow the medic and healing system. It's somehow the medic do the revive, but the revive gui somehow show for the player? It was present on my screen, but once the AI medic cannot reach the wounded guy, so I go there and treat him. And then I saw the revive circle and when I revive the guy, the circle is dissapear. But yeah, you dont have to waste time on this, it's not a big issue. I just try to discover this circle for you.

* I dont know why, but in the very late game (Secure transport is a very long mission and a lot of walking and I mostly use leapfrog command), But sometimes I add follow me order or move there order. And in the late game, two guy refuse the follow me and the move there commands. They just lay in the ground (in the GUI, under their name was "stop", like during the leapfrog, when half the squad is just "stop". I dont know some code from leapfrog interfere with this OR they did this strange disobey because their colorcode-mate (they were the read team) was stucked in a fence 6 km away (and they just wait for him?). Finally they follow me and everything went fine...

* I experienced second time: if I play with SOG AI, my tasks f*cked up: In the beginning I saw the task: "get in the helicopter", but when I do, it never became complete. The heli triggered and transport us into the AO, but the task never checked and I dint get the new task. The whole mission went fine (but only because I know what to do, bc there was no tasks). I use an old task framework by FHQ (because it's better for MP) maybe its interfere with your script.

 

Johnnyboy! This is a fantastic MOD. Pls consider my suggestion about the "untrap AI" option!

Also a question: is it possible to use SOG AI in PF campaign by a friend: I mean, we played all PF mission by two and it was very hard. If we could use SOG AI and your AI team, it made all these mission most enjoyable.

 

[johnnyboy 3793]

Hey Bardosy, thanks for the excellent detailed feedback.

43 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I dont know it's just the leapfrog or you did something else with the AI, but leapfrog is VERY EFFECTIVE. Yeah, it's not a fast train, but do the job: my squad became an advance panzer train. And also it looks extremly cool. In vanilla SP the player is the Rambo and team only support him. But with leapfrog, they do the job of a regular soldier and I can be the Team Leader. What is perfect!

Thanks man.  I definitely find the Leapfrog is effective and you feel part of a team instead of Rambo plus dummy support squad (like you said).

44 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I saw many feedbacks in Workshop forum and they are right:

I know I need to make a general purpose Squad AI that is not dependent on SOG DLC.  It would be a fair amount of work, so might not happen for months due to time constraints.

45 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I dont know it was you, but it's the healing system, but my men has a bandage after they were healed by the medic. Very good mood.

That's all johnnyboy magic!  🙂

46 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I know it's not easy (I mean the scripting is easy, but not too realistic), but you should add a command to action menu (like "treat you all") when some of AI team mate is far enough from the group (or detect somehow he is stucked - but if he is far away it's possible because he is stucked). So the player SL has an ability to unstuck him from action menu (just teleport him a few meters away or teleport him next to a closer AI teammate. I know and you know SOG terrain is a nightmare to AI and they always trapped. If you add a little help to the players (even if it's a little bit unrealistic) add a huge help.

Or if you have a better idea how to teleport a little bit realistic, it could solve your problem? not all PF mission is playable, because AI cant cross river... etc. So if you add some teleport option, player can swim or boat cross the river and then teleport the AIs.

I'll consider it, but I don't like it because its a cheat and immersion killer.  It happens fairly frequently that 1 or 2 AI will stay back, but they almost always follow a later command.  And if they are disobeying orders, try to use Vanilla AI commanding where you select the unit and use the move there action.  They should obey that, and then once moving again, they will obey wheel menu commands again.

 

For the cases where they actually get stuck under a hut or something, I have the Come To Me action that force animates them to the player.  This will unstick them from behind a fence or under a building.

50 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I get this circle again. Forget it! Probably connected somehow the medic and healing system. It's somehow the medic do the revive, but the revive gui somehow show for the player? It was present on my screen, but once the AI medic cannot reach the wounded guy, so I go there and treat him. And then I saw the revive circle and when I revive the guy, the circle is dissapear. But yeah, you dont have to waste time on this, it's not a big issue. I just try to discover this circle for you.

If you can show me how to recreate the problem, I'll try and fix it. Its never happened to me in hundreds of hours of play.   Do you have other mods running?

51 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I experienced second time: if I play with SOG AI, my tasks f*cked up: In the beginning I saw the task: "get in the helicopter", but when I do, it never became complete.

My mod should not mess up tasks.  I've played the SOG campaign and tasks all complete.  And I've played a Recondo mission by Fubar, and tasks complete, and tasks worked fine in Boots For Walking.   I can't guess what this problem is.

53 minutes ago, bardosy said:

not all PF mission is playable, because AI cant cross river.

I've been planning a "Cross River" action where player looks at river and action appears.  Code would then move units to water's edge, and force animate them into the river and force animate swim across if deep.  Its doable.  Similarly, I'm starting on a "Cross Bridge Fast" action now.  User looks at bridge, and action appears.  Then team moves to edge of bridge, then force animates to run to far side.  If its a wide bridge, then units can run parallel to each other across bridge (instead of AI slow walk on one side of bridge only).

57 minutes ago, bardosy said:

I dont know why, but in the very late game (Secure transport is a very long mission and a lot of walking and I mostly use leapfrog command), But sometimes I add follow me order or move there order. And in the late game, two guy refuse the follow me and the move there commands. They just lay in the ground (in the GUI, under their name was "stop", like during the leapfrog, when half the squad is just "stop". I dont know some code from leapfrog interfere with this OR they did this strange disobey because their colorcode-mate (they were the read team) was stucked in a fence 6 km away (and they just wait for him?). Finally they follow me and everything went fine...

When I play, I keep an eye on the team and make sure they are together.  If one is lagging, I give him a separate move command via Vanilla and he always ends up coming along.  The only truly mission breaking problem of stuck units is when stuck in buildings or under a rock.  Then you have to run to him and use the Come To Me action.  I think I want to improve that so you don't actually have to look at unit, because if he's stuck under a rock you can't see him. 

 

I may try to write code and detect a stuck unit (he's been command to move but hasn't moved in X seconds), and then maybe provide the teleport option.  That way its not a cheat if teleport action appears only if my code detects a stuck unit.

1 hour ago, bardosy said:

Also a question: is it possible to use SOG AI in PF campaign by a friend: I mean, we played all PF mission by two and it was very hard. If we could use SOG AI and your AI team, it made all these mission most enjoyable.

I know that would be really cool.  Especially if you each could command a small squad.  But I suck at MP coding, and this mod is already complicated, so I just don't have time to make that work.

1 hour ago, bardosy said:

Johnnyboy! This is a fantastic MOD.

Thanks again my old friend Bardosy!  I'm really glad you enjoy it.

[bardosy 158]

About stuck AI: yeah, you are right, its a cheat and immersion killer. And I saw that "come to me" but didnt know I should try to use it 🙂

When the guy stucked in a hut I tried everything with vanilla BIS commands: change stance, go there, RTF... etc but he couldnt move.

 

That forced/animation swim and bridge crossing sounds VERY good!!! You are the man!

[scottb613 285]

Hi JB,

 

Thanks for all the SP consideration - I always felt we took a back seat to MP stuff.

 

I was last active back when Mad Cheese was working on C2 - had a bunch of conversations with him - and I enjoyed his mod a great deal. Then when I resurfaced with SOG - I wanted - simpler - instead of micromanaging and spinning mouse wheels in the heat of combat - I just wanted "smarter" more effective AI teammates. You're definitely on the right track.

 

I'm getting that screen artifact more often now - could it be ACE? Bardosy - perhaps if we share mod lists we can isolate it? I've been trying to pare down my list of mods. I think ACE is the only thing I have that messes with GUI stuff. It's the "No Medical" version for me.

 

Regards,

Scott

[johnnyboy 3793]

7 minutes ago, scottb613 said:

I'm getting that screen artifact more often now - could it be ACE? Bardosy - perhaps if we share mod lists we can isolate it? I've been trying to pare down my list of mods. I think ACE is the only thing I have that messes with GUI stuff. It's the "No Medical" version for me.

I never use ACE, so that might explain why I haven't seen this problem.

[bardosy 158]

I only use SOG AI mod. No other mods. 

[bardosy 158]

It1s not SOG AI related, but I could fix the napalm strike script, plus I add your napalm effect script. And it looks great.

[johnnyboy 3793]

5 stars in 16 days!   Not too bad considering this mod is for the Prairie Fire audience only.  Thanks for all the support everybody! 

[scottb613 285]

Hi JB,

 

CONGRATS !

 

If you look more closely - you're the #1 "SOG" mod download of ALL TIME.

 

Well deserved.

 

Regards,
Scott