Sr-47 / sr-74 addon

[Bosniarat 0]

Never mind my comment on the Rifling of the barrels, I stand corrected. But With that the More rifling you have in the Barrel the Hotter the rifle will get due to Friction that is caused. while the Ak has a 4 twists to it (as i found out, sorry B.) the M-16 and the M-4 Have a 1 in 7" twist which tends to melt barrels faster than the Ak. So I was incorrect on my comment about the Ak. But as for accuracy the M-16 and its varients Smoke the Ak, but when most engagments in a combat area tend to be 50 to 100m Who cares about accurecy the SR-47 Is mostly For Weight the Ak Weights in at nearly 10 lbs, while the SR-47 Should (now should be i can not confirm this) weight in at about 5 lbs freeing up 5 pounds. in Theory Only. In All honestly the Weapon fully loaded problebly weights in at 7 pounds, because 7.62 is much heavier than 5.56

Well anyways Who cares Its just a game

Great Model Earl Keep up the Good Work!

HOOOAAAH!

[earl 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">

Great Model Earl Keep up the Good Work!

<span id='postcolor'>

You bet. I'll have to get around to texturing soon - it'll be quite a process preparing all the textures for this thing.

Now I think I will release 4 weapons in this addon. SR-47 and SR-74, two versions of each: Aimpoint and Trijicon ACOG 4x scope. Here's the ACOG (TA01NSN):

[Bergmania 0]

earl

Hmm after 700-800 polys the weapon stop making a shadow on ground.. "My" Galil ARM have to many polys right now but your marvelously model looks even more complex..

Just a thought..

[FW200 0]

That isn't a problem... just make a "shadow lod" a distance lod with less than 300 faces... make it using simple shapes.. boxes etc... and put in the higher faced lods

Name : lodnoshadow

Value : 1

In the properties box

but make sure the distance lod you use to make the "shadow lod" is pretty far away

[miles teg 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Bosniarat @ Nov. 16 2002,00:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Never mind my comment on the Rifling of the barrels, I stand corrected. But With that the More rifling you have in the Barrel the Hotter the rifle will get due to Friction that is caused. while the Ak has a 4 twists to it (as i found out, sorry B.) the M-16 and the M-4 Have a 1 in 7" twist which tends to melt barrels faster than the Ak. So I was incorrect on my comment about the Ak. But as for accuracy the M-16 and its varients Smoke the Ak, but when most engagments in a combat area tend to be 50 to 100m Who cares about accurecy the SR-47 Is mostly For Weight the Ak Weights in at nearly 10 lbs, while the SR-47 Should (now should be i can not confirm this) weight in at about 5 lbs freeing up 5 pounds. in Theory Only. In All honestly the Weapon fully loaded problebly weights in at 7 pounds, because 7.62 is much heavier than 5.56

Well anyways Who cares Its just a game

Great Model Earl Keep up the Good Work!

HOOOAAAH!<span id='postcolor'>

I don't know about barrels melting. I've fired a hell of alot of rounds through the M16A2 and never had any serious problem with the barrel getting too hot.

The main advantage of the SR-47 is simply that it has good accuracy and can use ammo commonly found in most theatre's of operation. It was used by some SF in Afghanistan simply because they found 7.62mmx39mm ammo all over the place there. U.S. Army Special Forces (also known as the Green Berets) tend to operate far away from supply channels. In addition, resupply can be chancy depending on the altitude they are operating at and the weather. With the SR-47 they are able to use magazines and ammunition scavanged from the battlefield off dead Afghan bodies or from local friendly militias. So, for their purpose, the SR-47 makes perfect sense. Russian ammo (which I've used) is actually not all that bad except for some of the older stuff that has corrosive powder (you simply need to clean the rifle well after usage with water and then after drying with regular gun cleaning oils).

As far as blending in goes, the SF guys generally wear uniforms that stick out like a sore thumb. In other words they generally haven't been dressing like locals except for a few here and there. I've mostly only seen CIA paramilitaries dressed up like locals and even those guys still stick out even when they grow out their beards (aside from a few hispanic guys who might pass for Middle-Easterners).

Also, I can tell you for a fact that accuracy matters greatly! The combat distances you quote are from the Vietnam War. Combat distances in Afghanistan tend to be a bit farther then that. You have to have a well maintained and well made Ak-47 and be a decent shot to hit 200 meter man size targets with an AK.

With a SR-47 (which from what I hear is similar in accuracy to the M-4) you should be able to easily hit 200 meter targets especially with an optical site on the weapon. I assume 300 meter targets shouldn't be much of a problem either as the rifle also has a free-floating barrel design. The compensator on the end should also help prevent the muzzle rise that you get alot of on Ak-47's also although I'm not sure how the silencer effects this.

In an engagement, the ability to rapidly put your sites on a target and accurately deliver rounds onto the target can make a big difference. However in close range combat such as in heavily wooded areas or in urban areas, the AK-47 probably has an advantage as it very rarely jams. Assuming the SR-47 uses a similar gas system as the M16A2, it will and can jam on occasion...something which can mean death in a close quarters battle. In those situations, reliability, a high rate of fire, and magazine capacity become the dominant concerns.

That's probably one reason why a lot of the CIA guys in Afghanistan carry around AK's of various sorts as they generally operate in urban areas there. The stock Russian-made AK-47 is also I think a very comfortable weapon that is well balanced, not overly heavy, and just highly reliable and effective at close ranges. However the main reason for it's inaccurate fire is because of poor part tolerances in the manufacturing specs. Often for example the bolt may be loose in the receiver or other parts may not fit really well together. All of these things add to innaccuracy. But usually it's accuracy was "good enough" for Soviet style of combat in which infantry depended more on maintaining a heavy volume of fire rather then accuracy. However these days the Russians are making their rifles (like the AK-103) to be more and more accurate while trying to keep the reliability of the older AK-47/74's.

But at any rate, in real life, you use what's best for the mission (when possible). In OFP, this addon will allow users to pickup the AK mags from dead resistance soldiers (or any other addon units who use the Ak-47) while using nice aim dot sites for better accuracy. So it will be a very good weapon to have for SF missions.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[madmedic 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Bosniarat @ Nov. 16 2002,00:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Never mind my comment on the Rifling of the barrels, I stand corrected. But With that the More rifling you have in the Barrel the Hotter the rifle will get due to Friction that is caused. while the Ak has a 4 twists to it (as i found out, sorry B.) the M-16 and the M-4 Have a 1 in 7" twist which tends to melt barrels faster than the Ak. So I was incorrect on my comment about the Ak. But as for accuracy the M-16 and its varients Smoke the Ak, but when most engagments in a combat area tend to be 50 to 100m Who cares about accurecy the SR-47 Is mostly For Weight the Ak Weights in at nearly 10 lbs, while the SR-47 Should (now should be i can not confirm this) weight in at about 5 lbs freeing up 5 pounds. in Theory Only. In All honestly the Weapon fully loaded problebly weights in at 7 pounds, because 7.62 is much heavier than 5.56

Well anyways Who cares Its just a game

Great Model Earl Keep up the Good Work!

HOOOAAAH!<span id='postcolor'>

You stand corrected here also ....LOL

The rifling in a barrel does NOT make it hotter.

OLD M16A1 barrels sometimes melted with extended full auto fire because they were very skinny (less surface area means it does not disperse heat well) that problem was resolved a long time ago. (now they are actually THICKER than AK barrels).

Different barrels are rifled to different twists based on the calibre and weight of the bullet fired.

M16/AR15 barrels are available in various twists. The first M16A1s were designed to fire 55grain ammo (M193BALL) so they had twist rates of 1in14, and later changed to 1in12.

Current M16A2 has a 1in7 twist so that it can stabilize the M855 62grain ammo, AND the M856 tracer (the latter of which is quite long and heavy)

Most civillian AR15s have 1in7, 1in8, or 1in9 twist barrels (1in9 reliably stabilizes 55grain, AND 62 grain ammo...and heavier)

AK47s/74s also are rifled for the particular weight ammo they shoot.

The reason an M16 is inherently more accurate than an AK is that AK variants are built to much looser tolerances (hence THIER inherent non-stoppable reliability), and they have remedial "notch and post" sights.

An AK74 is built on a stamped metal reciever, with the barrel pressed into a steel trunnion block that is riveted into the reciever.

M16s are precision milled from forged aluminum.

Each has its advantages/disadvantages.

BTW Knights Armament is located about 30 min. away from me (they are the ones who were building the SR-47)

Last I heard though...production of the rifle was cancelled.

[miles teg 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (madmedic @ Nov. 19 2002,10:08)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Bosniarat @ Nov. 16 2002,00:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Never mind my comment on the Rifling of the barrels, I stand corrected. But With that the More rifling you have in the Barrel the Hotter the rifle will get due to Friction that is caused. while the Ak has a 4 twists to it (as i found out, sorry B.) the M-16 and the M-4 Have a 1 in 7" twist which tends to melt barrels faster than the Ak. So I was incorrect on my comment about the Ak. But as for accuracy the M-16 and its varients Smoke the Ak, but when most engagments in a combat area tend to be 50 to 100m Who cares about accurecy the SR-47 Is mostly For Weight the Ak Weights in at nearly 10 lbs, while the SR-47 Should (now should be i can not confirm this) weight in at about 5 lbs freeing up 5 pounds. in Theory Only. In All honestly the Weapon fully loaded problebly weights in at 7 pounds, because 7.62 is much heavier than 5.56

Well anyways Who cares Its just a game

Great Model Earl Keep up the Good Work!

HOOOAAAH!<span id='postcolor'>

You stand corrected here also ....LOL

The rifling in a barrel does NOT make it hotter.

OLD M16A1 barrels sometimes melted with extended full auto fire because they were very skinny (less surface area means it does not disperse heat well) that problem was resolved a long time ago. (now they are actually THICKER than AK barrels).

Different barrels are rifled to different twists based on the calibre and weight of the bullet fired.

M16/AR15 barrels are available in various twists. The first M16A1s were designed to fire 55grain ammo (M193BALL) so they had twist rates of 1in14, and later changed to 1in12.

Current M16A2 has a 1in7 twist so that it can stabilize the M855 62grain ammo, AND the M856 tracer (the latter of which is quite long and heavy)

Most civillian AR15s have 1in7, 1in8, or 1in9 twist barrels (1in9 reliably stabilizes 55grain, AND 62 grain ammo...and heavier)

AK47s/74s also are rifled for the particular weight ammo they shoot.

The reason an M16 is inherently more accurate than an AK is that AK variants are built to much looser tolerances (hence THIER inherent non-stoppable reliability), and they have remedial "notch and post" sights.

An AK74 is built on a stamped metal reciever, with the barrel pressed into a steel trunnion block that is riveted into the reciever.

M16s are precision milled from forged aluminum.

Each has its advantages/disadvantages.

BTW Knights Armament is located about 30 min. away from me (they are the ones who were building the SR-47)

Last I heard though...production of the rifle was cancelled.<span id='postcolor'>

That's interesting. I wonder if the Special Forces decided to just use AK's or take their risks with resupply issues and stick with the M4's?

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[madmedic 0]

They are sticking with the M4.

[earl 0]

Progress report -

[VXR 9]

This is some very nice work Earl, Keep going like this.

if you need any support on getting the weapons ingame or the textures need to be converted just ask me and i hope to be able to answer

[akm74 1]

I didn’t expect less from this guy. Great work.

[earl 0]

Thanks!! I'm pretty excited about how it's turning out. I threw a texture on the ACOG really quickly, but it looks almost good enough to leave it as is --

Vixer - thanks for the offer. I'm actually having a bit of trouble getting the textures to display. I remember reading that when O2 imports 3DS models, it uses the material name as the texture filename. My texture name is sr47.tga, so I called the material sr47. Now when I merged the weapon, it had a few strange problems, and the texture did not appear immediately.

In my buldozer folder, I have a folder called SR47 with a subfolder called Texture.

I think when I made my RPK texture work I had to do the following process:

- Attach all objects into a single object in 3DSmax

- Collapse modifier stack

- Import into O2

- Select all faces, changed texture assignments to *.paa in texture\ subfolder

- Open TGA with texview and convert to PAA and place in texture\ subdir.

Then I think it will work. I was going to ask for help but I guess I just worked it out for myself. I had trouble last night with the SR47, but I forgot that I had to reassign the textures from within O2.

Next I just have to figure out config.cpp files. I've had some people offer to help already, and someone even sent me their AN-94 config.cpp to use with my AN-94 model (sorry, i forget who right now) so I will take a good look at that and at the commented config.

Then I think all I have to do is add the helper points, muzzle flash/smoke, and export it into the game... right?

[Edgie 0]

Will there be a version w/o the KAC suppressor? It is quick-detachable...

Will there be a vertical grip to the texture? (I realize that it won't look that great, since there aren't any animations... yet, but still)

Although I'm sure you've fixed this by now, but on the old pics of the Aimpoint, the top part of the mount wasn't present -- that Aimpoint would be sliding off the QD mount real quick like that.

One *glaring* problem -- the buttstock. The endcap of the buffer tube is visible with the stock fully extended -- it should not be. Otherwise, when you slide the stock forward all the way, the buffer tube will still be sticking out.

This is looking to be a really nice job. Looking forward to it.

[contraz0rz 0]

nice model dude!

[earl 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Edgie @ Nov. 29 2002,00:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Will there be a version w/o the KAC suppressor? It is quick-detachable...

Will there be a vertical grip to the texture? (I realize that it won't look that great, since there aren't any animations... yet, but still)

Although I'm sure you've fixed this by now, but on the old pics of the Aimpoint, the top part of the mount wasn't present -- that Aimpoint would be sliding off the QD mount real quick like that.

One *glaring* problem -- the buttstock. The endcap of the buffer tube is visible with the stock fully extended -- it should not be. Otherwise, when you slide the stock forward all the way, the buffer tube will still be sticking out.

This is looking to be a really nice job. Looking forward to it.<span id='postcolor'>

I suppose it's not much trouble to make a non-suppressed version.

I'm not going to make a vertical foregrip, it adds too many more polys and has no visible function in the game. If it was an integral part of the weapon, I would.

I modeled the aimpoint from a pic with the full mount. Once it is textured it will make sense to you, but the diameter of the cylinder there includeds the mounting bracket (top and bottom). The flange where the bracket is bolted together is actually just a box extruded though the cylinder, I can post a wireframe later tonight, but rest assured the aimpoint is in fact fully attached to the mount which is connected to the gun. Our poor operators will not find themselves short one optical device when they take aim.

Thanks for the tip on the buttstock - though I disagree that it's glaring with asterisks. Is there simply an empty cylinder there when the buttstock is extended?

[madmedic 0]

On that type of buttstock, there is a hole left there when it is extended.

That is actually the end of the buffer tube.

I will post a picture of one that is on one of my AR15s if you like, (extended, and collapsed)

[Edgie 0]

http://www.edgie.com/images/sopmod3.jpg

That's a picture of my M4 w/ a Aimpoint QD mount (the one you are modelling) and, obviously, an Aimpoint (Comp M XD, which is no longer produced).

I have a spacer in the mount, so that the scope will clear the front post -- otherwise the scope takes up a good portion of the view. This is something I don't think anyone has ever correctly reproduced -- all the weapon addons I've played with that utilize a reddot or scope (on weapons with flattop receivers, like the M4) never take that into account. Even though on the models, the scope visibly does not clear the front post.

The rear sight is a ARMS #40 flip-up sight, which is used as part of their new SIR (Selective Integrated Rail) system. This sight is also integrated as part of their #38 SWAN sleeve rails (which I also own). Now, going back to the spacer, the scope does not *completely* clear the front post, but leaves enough so that if I need to use the iron sights, I can -- without removing the Aimpoint.

As someone else already pointed out, the sliding stock itself is hollow. When the slide is fully extended, you cannot see the buffer tube endcap unless you're looking into the stock itself. It would be visible if the stock was fully compact, however.

Hope all this helps.

[madmedic 0]

This is the new style M4 buttstock, your model has the old one, but the part in question is the same.

Here it is collapsed:

and here it is extended:

[earl 0]

Cool, thanks for the help guys. There's certain things you can never understand unless you get to play with the real thing.

[earl 0]

Hmm, I got Oxygen to import the texture with the 3DS model finally, but now when I view it in game, it has no texture at all!  I guess the path must be wrong somewhere, I remember reading a warning about that in a tutorial, but how can I fix it now?

I have all my files in a directory called "sr47", no subdirectory for textures.

This looks okay (needs more work, and has to be darker)

But this just isn't acceptable!  

My texture image is 512x512 right now - could that be the reason?  I thought OFP only supported 256x256 px, but Buldozer displays the texture on the model.

Nevermind, it's all under control.

Visit http://www.baconbomb.com/modworks for in-game screenshots.

[Edgie 0]

Minor detail I hadn't noticed before, but:

The SR-47 was/is produced with the newer fiberrite stock (the one with the ribs, no sling passthru on top, just the central one, sling pin on the bottom of the stock, and the end is shaped at a slight curve).

http://www.quarterbore.com/kac/sr47.html

Again, not a big deal just a minor quibble.

[CrunchyFrog 0]

OFP support up to 4096x4096 textures...

[madmedic 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Edgie @ Dec. 03 2002,11:13)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Minor detail I hadn't noticed before, but:

The SR-47 was/is produced with the newer fiberrite stock (the one with the ribs, no sling passthru on top, just the central one, sling pin on the bottom of the stock, and the end is shaped at a slight curve)<span id='postcolor'>

Yes, it has the "new" M4 buttstock, as it is a "new" rifle.

It is the same buttstock pictured on my rifle a few posts up.

[Mr. Snrub 0]

That's one big freakin' gun in that picture!

Looking very impressive indeed - can't wait to have a crack at it in-game

Just 1 question - what sort of sounds are you going to use in-game? Both the standard M16 and AK47 sounds are a bit weak I think, and having a "beefier" (for the lack of a better word) as in Fliper's M4's, certainly makes weapons nicer to use

[earl 0]

I believe I'm constrained to use original sounds, because I have to use original AK47 mags (and it seems all weapon data is attached to the magazine).