The eternal troubling issue

[Blake 0]

As you all may know, when squad leader dies in multiplayer #2 in the squad cannot take over the squad like in single player, and when #2 dies #3 is unable to lead etc.

I have whined about this issue for over a year and no viable explanation/fix for this bug is ever presented. I beg BIS to address this issue before it's too late.

Don't tell about any scripts, they might work but we need a proper official fix for this issue.

leader is extremely important in coop missions otherwise all goes into chaos or extreme typing etc.

[JRMZ 0]

hmm well that depends on with who you play the coop Blake.

I always play coops with Mad-IT and we all are connected via coms. So when the leader dies the second takes over.

When you play coops without voicecoms or with people you dont know then you have a problem yes.

[Blake 0]

I NEVER play without voice coms as don't my squad mates. It's just the simple fact that it's much easier to point directly where to go for everybody with the move command and order hold fire/engage etc. We have often 20 people online on our directplay server so relying solely on voice comms is not the fix for this issue.

This is a bug that needs to be fixed that is all.

[JRMZ 0]

I agree on that point Blake

[suma 8]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As you all may know, when squad leader dies in multiplayer #2 in the squad cannot take over the squad like in single player, and when #2 dies #3 is unable to lead etc.

I have whined about this issue for over a year and no viable explanation/fix for this bug is ever presented. I beg BIS to address this issue before it's too late.

<span id='postcolor'>

Which version are you using? What respawn type (seagull, group, none, instant, base)?

[advocatexxx 0]

I often play the original BIS Co-op mission 2_5_COOPERATIVE which is the hostage rescue in the Entre Deux and there you only respawn as a group member. i.e. If there are only 2 player-controlled characters and the other 3 are AI, then after dying you will respawn as one of the surviving AIs.

I'm often the group leader and seem to maintain my command after dying.

Maybe the respawn type in the maps you play isn't setup propertly, but I have never had this problem.

Nevertheless most CO-OPs I play don't allow respawn (I like it like that) so I'm not too worried about it.

[nyles 11]

0--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Suma @ Nov. 06 2002,090)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Which version are you using? What respawn type (seagull, group, none, instant, base)?<span id='postcolor'><span id='postcolor'>

Would it be possible that we can get yet another type of respawn, Suma? I would like to have a respawn just like the one where you shift positions within you group and when wiped out completly, you become a seagull. However I would like to have it so that you respawn with your full group back at the defined respawn area with you being the leader (#1) again instead of the seagull part. Would it be possible to get something like this, or can we already do it with code and if yes, how?

[LAW Soldier fd 0]

This got a bit carried away, it seems..

I think Blake's idea was that with no AI friendlies, a player dying and not respawning (seagull or spectate), the next in line of command doesn't receive leadership automatically.

And it is a fact, I've wondered about leadership transition myself many times but let it lie as nothing sensible came of it. It might be possible if one could break up the group entirely when the leader is killed, and then make a new group with the surviving members joining it one by one, under the new leader's command.

But this is all workarounds, it might be a good idea to get a logical leadership transfer.. when the lieutenant gets killed, a sergeant takes over.. if all sergeants are down, a corporal takes over .. if all corporals go down, one of the privates takes over .. etc.

As said, no AI friendlies attached to the group, as in: no free AI slots to "fill up" after dying. and with a sockets server once doesn't have the native VON, and having 20+ members on a 3rd party VON with all listening to the same channel, one can forget about issuing commands over the voice, as there are constantly 4-5 people asking for direction or waypoints or reporting enemy activity etc.

Of course the thing above would be solved with proper radio discipline, but damnit, it's just a game :) I like to be able to give player controlled units, especially a chopperpilot a waypoint where to go. And not say "Look at your map, put a waypoint for you" .. if you're flying 250kph at 40 meters, you cannot afford to look at the map.

But, I'm all for Blake's idea, automatic leadership transition after the leader of the group dies. Even if it's just 1 -> 2 -> 3 -> 4 -> 5 etc etc rah rah rah

--fd

[suma 8]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (LAW Soldier fd @ Nov. 07 2002,14:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">But, I'm all for Blake's idea, automatic leadership transition after the leader of the group dies. Even if it's just 1 -> 2 -> 3 -> 4 -> 5 etc etc rah rah rah<span id='postcolor'>

I am not sure I understand what the problem is. There is automatic leadership transition where leader dies, both in SP and in MP. In MP this was buggy in some older versions - that is why I am asking what version are you using.

Maybe you are talking about something else?

[xyouthx 0]

I don't want to hijack this thread, but I need to thank LDD Blake for some of the best coop missions I've ever played!

(I think what Blake is referring to is that leadership is not transfered when you make use of seagul respawn).

[joltan 0]

0--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Suma @ Nov. 06 2002,090)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As you all may know, when squad leader dies in multiplayer #2 in the squad cannot take over the squad like in single player, and when #2 dies #3 is unable to lead etc.<span id='postcolor'>

Which version are you using? What respawn type (seagull, group, none, instant, base)?<span id='postcolor'>

I know it happens at least with 1.75+ (including 1.85 client on 1.88 server) with seagull respawn. It is easy to circumvent by joining the dead leader to GrpNull, but this has to be done by trigger or script, while it should happen automatically.

[Blake 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I am not sure I understand what the problem is. There is automatic leadership transition where leader dies, both in SP and in MP. In MP this was buggy in some older versions - that is why I am asking what version are you using.

Maybe you are talking about something else?<span id='postcolor'>

No, this exactly the issue. The automatic leadership change does not work, just tested it with squadmates. We shot our human player leader of our group (the #1) and #2 (human player too) right-clicked on his corpse and announced "OH NO, 1 IS DOWN!" but after that, nothing, no "THIS IS 2 TAKING COMMAND, I SAY AGAIN, TAKING COMMAND". And it works perfectly in single player and the leader interface does transfer but not in multiplayer.

I'm using V1.85 of course but this issue has not worked since v1.0. Hopefully you will fix it

[Blake 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (joltan @ Nov. 07 2002,18:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I know it happens at least with 1.75+ (including 1.85 client on 1.88 server) with seagull respawn. It is easy to circumvent by joining the dead leader to GrpNull, but this has to be done by trigger or script, while it should happen automatically.<span id='postcolor'>

The Grpnull script workaround doesn't work on all occasions, sometimes nobody gets leadership or on some occasions the it will transfer correctly but after a while all command options vanish for no reason. I've tested it on at least 10 missions and we have bumped to that problem many times.

an official fix would do the trick...

[Blake 0]

*bump*

[LT.Schaffer 0]

Hi All,

Yeah i've noticed this too,also any chance of BIS including in they're next patch a button to select respawn type like the way you select to turn off AI or time limit?

[suma 8]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Blake @ Nov. 09 2002,02:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">No, this exactly the issue. The automatic leadership change does not work, just tested it with squadmates. We shot our human player leader of our group (the #1) and #2 (human player too) right-clicked on his corpse and announced "OH NO, 1 IS DOWN!" but after that, nothing, no "THIS IS 2 TAKING COMMAND, I SAY AGAIN, TAKING COMMAND". And it works perfectly in single player and the leader interface does transfer but not in multiplayer.

I'm using V1.85 of course but this issue has not worked since v1.0. Hopefully you will fix it <span id='postcolor'>

Confirmed. Fix will be available in the upcoming patch.

[kegetys 2]

great

[Blake 0]

most excellent news