How Do MODs Stack UP To Original Content - Why Aren't MODs Incorporated Into Stock?

[infiltrator_2k 29]

I've decided to go down the MOD route with Arma 3 because I'm in awe with the dedication and quality many modders have put into their MODs. I've been particularly blown away by Nodunit & Franze's AH-64D and the realism its added to the game as well as a long list of other MODs. My questions are how do MODs stack up to BIS' vanilla content with regards to quality? And what's stopping (if at all) BIS incorporating the MOD community's content into the stock game? I ask this because IMO the stock game is lacking so much content. I understand that BIS has designed Arma to be a canvas, but by adding the hard work and dedication put into MODs to the stock game it will IMO improve compatibility issues with MP. Or is this something that has been planned to happed by BIS?

What for all intents and purposes is the 'Make Arma Not War' competition aimed at achieving? Obviously BIS are investing a lot of money and time in overseeing this competition. Is it a financially viable way of having content created and added to Arma? Or is it a talent spotting exercise? Possibly a way of promoting the game? Is the competition and its prize money the main incentive why we're seeing so much time and effort put into these MODs?

Sorry if some of these questions seem dumb, but I'm old compared to many in this community and not that up to date with it all due to time constraints, what with my job and family. I'm sure many of these questions have been asked before, but I'd appreciate having these questions and answers put under one bonnet so it gives myself and other community members a clearer understanding of the whole MOD and the Vanilla thing

Regards

Ian

Edited September 27, 2014 by Infiltrator_2K
Added questions

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

Well, first off we tend to call them addons. A mod would be something like ACE, or CSLA. Something big, a few hundred MB or a couple GB, etc. Also, not really sure why you've capitalized "MOD" every time but I'll put it down to a Brit thing. :P

MANW is... complicated. To me, and some others, it is a nuisance at best and at worst a blight on the community. A horn that heralds the end for what makes this community a community. I hope for the best, but expect the worst. Anyways, it's probably being used as a talent spot, and I do believe it was vaguely mentioned somewhere that the people who win the prizes may get offered either jobs at BI or BI may offer to buy their content, but I'm not sure on that and have no idea where it was I got that from. (Either the forums, or one of the skype channels)

As for why BI doesn't put addons into the game... they kind of do. They've been hiring people out of this community for a long, long time now. The Czech DLC for A2/OA/CO was almost entirely non-BIS made content. I'm pretty sure most of it either came from CSLA, or specific members of CSLA (eg: the Land Rovers might have been TheSun's), and one of the vehicles came from a German mod team that has since dissolved and vanished. Or there's the never really talked about yet glaringly obvious part that ACE team members played in Operation Arrowhead's creation. Backpacks, some of the vehicles, etc. Heck, they even hired a (slightly) competent mission maker who was also one of the worst moderators this board has ever seen, lol. You just have to remember that it costs lots of money to buy stuff, and Bohemia can't just steal somebodies addon and put it in their game.

[infiltrator_2k 29]

not really sure why you've capitalized "MOD" every time but I'll put it down to a Brit thing. :P

TBH it's a personal thing.... Every time I type Mod or mod I think of 'Quadrophenia' and that's definitely a British thing :) Thanks for the reply BTW it explained a lot and gave me a better understanding of how content is created.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Infiltrator_2K

[lightspeed_aust 681]

Joined in 2009, 214 posts and you're unfamiliar with mods?

Seems fishy to me, and if it's true then you've missed a lot!

[infiltrator_2k 29]

Joined in 2009, 214 posts and you're unfamiliar with mods?

Seems fishy to me, and if it's true then you've missed a lot!

"fishy" lol... I've posted a lot on scripting. I've not really played that much SP/MP, only missions I've created with friends and whoever joins in. Times a luxury nowadays as I work away all week doing 70hrs Mon-Fri. I get home and I'm wasted with three young daughters to entertain. I've not Arma for three weeks but I'm hoping to have a bash tonight :) There's nothing fishy going on here. I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to Arma. I can create missions with simple scripting but that's it.

Arma seems a bit of a beast with seemingly endless possibilities. The longevity of the game is pretty awesome. I wish I had the time to really get into it and contribute to others, but sadly my personal circumstances and commitments don't allow it. If I'm honest I haven't really given addons much thought because I wanted to get to grips with vanilla first. But I think that was because I didn't appreciate how much skill and dedication have gone into them, and dare I say it, the addons I've downloaded is better than stock.

I've not even played Zuess yet, or bothered with the Karting thing because I want to stay focused on mission editing and making missions that people will enjoy. I think the really good about Arma is the fact you can make the game your own. I'm all for realism BTW ;) I plan to recreate real life military scenarios/engagements to increase the immersion, and I now know addons will contribute to this significantly hence this original post. I was always sceptical about addons (except A2 ACE) believing they were too buggy and unrealistic, but how very wrong I've been. All I can say is there's a lot of talent out now and their work is very much appreciated.

[PuFu 4600]

This sort of thread seems to be appearing at least once a year if not more often than that.

I've decided to go down the MOD route with Arma 3 because I'm in awe with the dedication and quality many modders have put into their MODs. I've been particularly blown away by Nodunit & Franze's AH-64D and the realism its added to the game as well as a long list of other MODs. My questions are how do MODs stack up to BIS' vanilla content with regards to quality? And what's stopping (if at all) BIS incorporating the MOD community's content into the stock game? I ask this because IMO the stock game is lacking so much content. I understand that BIS has designed Arma to be a canvas, but by adding the hard work and dedication put into MODs to the stock game it will IMO improve compatibility issues with MP. Or is this something that has been planned to happed by BIS?

BI doesn't need to add the content to the vanilla game. It needs to improve the way local game files are synked with the game server files, in an autonomous way.

To answer the reason why BI cannot add addons and mods content in the game:

1. The IP belongs to the Original Creator. BI doesn't own the IP for any mods made. They would most likely have to buy it.

2. There are many mods where the are quite a few IP conflicts, or lack of licensed content (from boeing, bell, colt etc). I won't even touch the sounds part, or the fact that a lot of the content is made with non-commercial tools (BI tools included). You just can't have a wide range of legal problems associated with that sort of content if you are a commercial entity. I have tried to explain the reason numerous times before.

That being said, BI has worked (commission based work) with quite wide range of community members for its content (for A2, OA and its DLCs, and A3 as well).

What for all intents and purposes is the 'Make Arma Not War' competition aimed at achieving? Obviously BIS are investing a lot of money and time in overseeing this competition. Is it a financially viable way of having content created and added to Arma? Or is it a talent spotting exercise? Possibly a way of promoting the game? Is the competition and its prize money the main incentive why we're seeing so much time and effort put into these MODs?

1. In my mind, the money can act as a big incentive for some people, for some it is the competition in itself. All that content is meant to be released for the average Joe for free, prior to the deadline. So all in all, you are about to see a lot of mods (in different stages of development with a lot of different quality levels), but all being released in a pretty short timeframe. Of course, for most, the development will most likely continue past the competition deadline, because it would simply be a waste not to invest further in a product (addon/mod) if you have spent a huge amount of time already.

2. Of course it ss a talent spotting exercise.

3. It is also a PR stunt in itself. For that sort of amount, this has already been covered by a number of gaming magazines and independent press, even the mainstream one.

4. By putting money in the middle, they hope to grasp some other talents from other modding groups and bring them to ArmA.

5. It might also be some sort of recognition for the simple fact that this game lives so long simply because of its modding community.

Sorry if some of these questions seem dumb, but I'm old compared to many in this community and not that up to date with it all due to time constraints, what with my job and family. I'm sure many of these questions have been asked before, but I'd appreciate having these questions and answers put under one bonnet so it gives myself and other community members a clearer understanding of the whole MOD and the Vanilla thing

They are not dumb, but they have been all answered (more or less) many times before ;)

Edited September 27, 2014 by PuFu

[lightspeed_aust 681]

I'd invite you to join us on our coop nights (we use loads of the gr8 mods) but we r in oz and I don't think the time zones will work. But offers open anytime, just pm me.

Family and work getting in the way of Arma, I hear ya. ;)

[chortles 263]

I've not even played Zuess yet

Ehhh, I would definitely recommend giving it a shot or alternately playing in a Zeus Game Master scenario under a GM (i.e. BI does a weekly livestream), not least because it can and is used for realistic scenarios, despite the different dynamic that comes from "on-the-fly" mission 'generation'.

[mistyronin 1181]

IMO the MANW was also intended to create a broad mod / addon base for A3. As with the new game and the new setting, the simple exercise of porting content from previous games in the series is way more complicated. That's why also they opened previous games content and allowed it to be ported.

Lot of players from previous games didn't feel attracted to the new A3 "futuristic" setting, but now with the MANW super HQ mods like RHS Escalation and VTN they are gonna buy the game ( you just have to check the comments in the social media accounts of the mods ).

Funny thing is that, at least in my opinion, mods like RHS will deliver more quality and content that what BI would have done if A3 setting was kept to modern warfare stuff.

And probably some of that content would have been created without the contest, but I think it has added an extra point and motivation.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Where I stand, is a line between. Arma 3's Vanilla content is brilliant and high quality, but some things could be better. Arma 3 Vanilla content display's it's variety of existing real world assets, plus a few fictional ones, because they feel like adding those in. Modding however, is a love hate relationship. There are great things, and there are the not so great things. Some mods are higher quality than others and more reliable than others.

Ultimately, this is where I stand. What I would love to see, is the modding content that is on par, and fits in with the existing time frame and story line, and quality of Arma 3, to be able to be added into Vanilla at some point.

[super-truite 54]

As a new addon maker, MANW was a huge source of motivation and I learned a lot in the making of my entry. Without a deadline and the competitive side, I am not sure I would have found that much time on top of daily life obligations to make addons. I guess it had the same effect on others, which is good. I have the feeling that it will not do any harm. But since I am a contestant, I might be seeing the implications of MANW with blinkers ;).