Ukraine General

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

So you support the killing off civilians? suggest you read some history and see how wonderfull the UK goverment is! btw i dont support any agressions agains any state goverment or it citizens but by blaming russians while your own goverment's kill ppl and discard its own citizens ass garbage i dont like either, but corporation payed goverments, and media are never good we better open our eyes and see how wonderfull the dream we live in really is!

[mistyronin 1181]

Whose side are people in this forum on?

I'm not with any side in particular. But:

- I'm against Russia's actual Gov. ( or any other country's gov ) doing imperialistic invasions to annex more territory.

- I'm with every nation who peacefully and democratically fight for their right of auto-determination, culture, and customs ( as long as they respect the human rights ).

- I'm with the human rights and democratic values ( no matter sex orientation, religion, skin color , etc. ).

- I'm against those who take war weapons unless they have expired all democratic ways and only in self-defense and with measure ( the opposite of the thugs in Easter Ukraine ).

[Tonci87 163]

Almighty FSB spynet:D

And to be seriously - I just googled it. The channel is clearly pro-Ukr as you may notice.

That's definitely T-64 - just look at wheels that smaller than T-72 ones, ERA bricks places at different angles that Ajaya ones, IR searchlight on the left side of turret (T-72's one is on the right) and what differs it most of all - sound of boxer diesel engine. Compare any video with moving T-72 and this one and you'll see that it is clearly T-64.

BTW Ukrs already start using T-72s again.

Hard to tell from the video but I believe that this is indeed a T-64, just from the general shape of the vehicle.

I'm not with any side in particular. But:

- I'm against Russia's actual Gov. ( or any other country's gov ) doing imperialistic invasions to annex more territory.

- I'm with every nation who peacefully and democratically fight for their right of auto-determination, culture, and customs ( as long as they respect the human rights ).

- I'm with the human rights and democratic values ( no matter sex orientation, religion, skin color , etc. ).

- I'm against those who take war weapons unless they have expired all democratic ways and only in self-defense and with measure ( the opposite of the thugs in Easter Ukraine ).

Me too.

[spooky lynx 73]

Hard to tell from the video but I believe that this is indeed a T-64, just from the general shape of the vehicle.

"Russian tanks advancing" is just an apology of losing own machines to Donbass rebels who got them. Earlier South-East informants stated that three T-64's were captured near Lugansk. Now I see fairytale about three 'Russian' tanks entering. I don't believe in such coincidences. And I'm surprised that those junta propagandists told about only three(!) tanks. Why not a brigade or at least regiment? My imperialistic feelings are offended!:mad:

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

HUH,-

- I'm with every nation who peacefully and democratically fight for their right of auto-determination, culture, and customs ( as long as they respect the human rights ).

explain plss

peacefull fighting and democratic fight for their rights,hows that work?

you really contradict yourself in the same piece,you love peace but the one's that dont like it get a bullet or something?and what democracy your talking about, the one that upress it citizens,wage wars agains any that oppese their rulling and or crippilling sanctions that do more harm then good.

[Tonci87 163]

"Russian tanks advancing" is just an apology of losing own machines to Donbass rebels who got them. Earlier South-East informants stated that three T-64's were captured near Lugansk. Now I see fairytale about three 'Russian' tanks entering. I don't believe in such coincidences. And I'm surprised that those junta propagandists told about only three(!) tanks. Why not a brigade or at least regiment? My imperialistic feelings are offended!:mad:

LOL :p

As you can see I´m not strictly pro Ukraine, I´m simply anti-propaganda BS (something obviously both sides enjoy using)

[Sgt.Spoetnik 10]

yeah indeed why not a whole armored division,Russia can do better then 3 tanks:p, btw why would Russia risk it all for 3 tanks,not even good one's for that matter!

[spooky lynx 73]

Meanwhile some sources suppose that something very bad may happen on 14th July in Donbass.

1) Western journalists leave the area in masses

2) Ukr officials are recommended to relocate their families in other regions

3) Polish consulate suspends its work

4) Railway tickets are unavailable

5) Junta forces supposed to leave Karachun mountain positions and left all the roadblocks near Kramatorsk

Some people suppose that WMD of some kind will be used against South-East. At the same time an urgent excercises of Ukr. NBC troops started and recruiters try to get more NBC specialists to NG and various new batallions.

[mistyronin 1181]

peacefull fighting and democratic fight for their rights,hows that work?

you really contradict yourself in the same piece,you love peace but the one's that dont like it get a bullet or something?and what democracy your talking about, the one that upress it citizens,wage wars agains any that oppese their rulling and or crippilling sanctions that do more harm then good.

:confused:

What are you talking? Are you OK?

When I said : I'm with every nation who peacefully and democratically fight for their right of auto-determination, culture, and customs ( as long as they respect the human rights ).

I mean like Gandhi in India. Catalan, Scottish, Flemish, democratic Basques, Quebequians ( or how they are called ), and a long etc.

That could be the path followed by the pro-Russians armed groups. But they choose violence, terrorism and mayhem.

[spooky lynx 73]

Here are all three 'Russian' tanks. Spotted in Torez town.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Hew6bmufYk

[mistyronin 1181]

Here are all three 'Russian' tanks. Spotted in Torez town.

I'm still not sure if they are T72 or T64. Or if they are the same as the ones Ukraine's Gov. talk about ( Because theoretically should only be two, the third was captured this last night )..

On the other hand. What I don't understand is why with such a clear target, the Ukrainian Army doesn't organize the sending of jets against them. I guess that because they are in the middle of a city and the insurgents have AA weapons. But anyway I think there should be ways to neutralize them at some point ( when they move across villages, etc. ).

Edited June 12, 2014 by MistyRonin

[spooky lynx 73]

It's clearly T-64's. Their ERA differs from T-72's, the same goes to wheels. And you can hear not simple diesel sound but opposite engine one (much higher, like circular saw).

Here's another photo of that tank. Note IR light at the left side of turret - clear sign of T-64.

What I don't understand is why with such a clear target, the Ukrainian Army doesn't organize send jets against them. I guess that because they are in the middle of a city and the insurgents have AA weapons. But anyway I think there should be ways to neutralize them at some point.

After Lugansk tragedy many of pilots refuse to take on and perform tasks. Junta even seeks for foreigns pilots (attempts were in Georgia, Serbia, Croatia).

[mistyronin 1181]

After Lugansk tragedy many of pilots refuse to take on and perform tasks. Junta even seeks for foreigns pilots (attempts were in Georgia, Serbia, Croatia).

Whats your source for that? And what's your explanation about being 3 tanks instead of the two the Ukrainian Gov. said? Did they mate and had a child?

[spooky lynx 73]

Whats your source for that? And what's your explanation about being 3 tanks instead of the two the Ukrainian Gov. said? Did they mate and had a child?

Various blogs (I've provided links on them here).

My explanation is that Ukr. officials are neither professional nor honest - they always lower their losses and distract real picture of the battles happened. An-30 recon which was shot down was labeled as transport An-26. And minister of internal affairs cannot distinguish tanks that are in use by own army from foreign.

Edit: another video and pics of shelling with WP mines.

http://s1.stc.all.kpcdn.net/f/4/image/84/04/810484.jpg (132 kB)

Edited June 12, 2014 by Spooky Lynx

[Tonci87 163]

I call BS on this.

What would you do if you are in an area with WP going down? You would run like hell. Instead of that we hear multiple cameras clicking.

And I also doubt that this is WP what we are seeing, I think that these are just smoke grenades. I also think that they might have been fired by the separatists for that particular "press event", because why else should someone fire them in an open field. I also think that the incoming sound of the grenades and their visible trajectory indicates that they are flying overhead, e.g. shot from behind.

[mistyronin 1181]

And I also doubt that this is WP what we are seeing, I think that these are just smoke grenades

Of course it was white phosphorus, what do you think is used to make smoke grenades? And of course it was not used as an offensive weapon, but to create smoke curtains.

Wikipedia

In addition to its offensive capabilities, white phosphorus is also a highly efficient smoke-producing agent, burning quickly and producing an instant blanket of smoke. As a result, smoke-producing white phosphorus munitions are very common, particularly as smoke grenades for infantry, loaded in grenade launchers on tanks and other armored vehicles, or as part of the ammunition allotment for artillery or mortars. These create smoke screens to mask movement, position or the origin of fire from the enemy.

[Tonci87 163]

Yeah that is what I wanted to say, it is evidently not used offensively but as a showcase for a "press event".

[surpher 1]

(Reuters) Ukrainian forces reclaim port city from rebels

Ukrainian government forces reclaimed the port city of Mariupol from pro-Russian separatists in heavy fighting on Friday and said they had regained control of a long stretch of the border with Russia.

[mistyronin 1181]

( Reuters ) Pro-Russian rebels add tanks to arsenal in east Ukraine

Where the tanks came from is also unknown. Whether they rolled across the border from Russia, as Ukrainian Interior Minister Arseny Avakov said, or are from a Ukrainian military stockpile, as the rebels say, is up for debate. [...]

"We got them from a military warehouse," said one of the rebels wearing a loose-fitting camouflage balaclava, as the tanks rolled out of the rebels' makeshift headquarters on the grounds of a coal mine.

"Don't take any pictures," the rebels warned Reuters journalists. "Cameras down!"

Another source about Mariupol:

( Al Jazeera ) Ukrainian troops regain port city of Mariupol

[Tonci87 163]

Well having tanks is one thing, having ammunition for them is another. If they got them out of an old vehicle depot or a service garage they likely won´t have any ammunition for them.

[spooky lynx 73]

With all the shortage of money and simple corruption among UA military getting some ammo for tanks is not very big problem. They already sold all data about pilots involved in bombings of Slaviansk and Lugansk and artillery crews that performed strikes on Slaviansk and Semenovka.

[Tonci87 163]

With all the shortage of money and simple corruption among UA military getting some ammo for tanks is not very big problem. They already sold all data about pilots involved in bombings of Slaviansk and Lugansk and artillery crews that performed strikes on Slaviansk and Semenovka.

What do you mean by data?

[mistyronin 1181]

What do you mean by data?

I guess he refers to personal data. So everyone knows who they are, where they live, and can threaten them and their families.

[spooky lynx 73]

What do you mean by data?

Name, surname, adress.

Some pics of damaged and abandoned junta Grad launcher, which was used for strike on Dobropolye village:

[Tonci87 163]

I guess he refers to personal data. So everyone knows who they are, where they live, and can threaten them and their families.

That is really low.....