Real Armor Mod

[Alex72 1]

Good job on this. :)

Does explosives such as satchels also have a different impact with this? Dont know how many times ive tried to take out any sort of armor in A3 with either RPG or explosives and it usually resulted in nothing. Barely a scratch. Think i tried to take out the CSAT AA vehicle with 5 satchel and nothing happened in standard A3 (maybe it changed in the latest patches). But i remember shooting PCML 2 times into the AAF APC and it didnt go down. Not even broken wheels (shot from behind twice).

Yeah, conclusion is, very strange values all around in A3. :D

[sonsalt6 105]

update v0.0.6 alpha available at withSIX. Download now by clicking:

[Tonci87 163]

I´m not sure if I want to download this seeing as it came out on April the first :p

(Of course I´ll give it a try)

[LSD_Timewarp82 21]

I will give it a try again^^ I hope the T-100 doesnt still eat rockets before he explodes ^^

[scajolly 14]

Hello there.

I've been wondering. Some common items such as M113s, BRDMs, certainly BTR-40s and from some angles BTRs, all are susceptible either front, side or rear, to lucky 12.7mm, quite a few

, and often 40mm rounds fired from respectively HMGs, autocannons and outright cannons, whatever the distinction. I suppose that for all but the most specialized ammunition, rifle calibers don't output the same effect with anything but extreme rarity. My question is whether you will attempt to make a simulation of these 10-40mm lower calibers and their effect on such small vehicles. Obviously, effects that can be dramatic. Apart from stripping off outside equipment (not currently a feature :(), they can penetrate and cause damage to crew or - horrid to think - the infantry being transported.

The 20-40mm range is obviously interesting to you because of the many IFVs that fit them today, but I suspect very few pay much heed to the 12.7mm. Or maybe you've already taken care of it all, and now we just need APCs ported or made with real world values?

[olds 15]

Or maybe you've already taken care of it all, and now we just need APCs ported or made with real world values?

That's it. As long as the ported vehicles have proper fire geometry reflecting their armor thickness, you're OK. The A2 weapons might need some tweaking to make sure they have proper values. Missiles & Rockets need heavy reworking, but Bullets & Shells will work fine as long as their penetration values ("caliber") are correct.

I'm not planning on doing any significant rework of A3 weapons because... "future!" Just what is necessary to clean up any values that don't work properly with RAM. I am planning on going through the A2 weapons with a fine-toothed comb for realism and to add the many missing 1980's variants needed for my NATO-Pact mod. The existing A2 Bullet/Shell values are probably quite reasonable as a base level however.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Olds

[Guest]

The new version was frontpaged on the Armaholic homepage.

Real Armor Mod v0.0.6 alpha

==================================================

You are not registered on Armaholic, or at least not that we are aware of. In the future we offer the possibility to authors to maintain their own pages.

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[olds 15]

RAM-o-philes are probably already aware of this but...

Bakerman has a great post/download featuring the math behind A3 ballistics. It is essential reading for anyone who wants to port/tweak weapon values. I love spreadsheets, and I'll be using it--especially for those pesky airFriction values--when I get around to A2 ports.

---------- Post added at 17:00 ---------- Previous post was at 15:11 ----------

(zGuba recently confirmed that passThrough values >1 do nothing (additional): that property only works for values >=0 or <=1. I reflected this knowledge in the documentation link and will adjust these values in the next update. They are not making any difference whatsoever right now so I may as well lock them all to 0 or 1 so as not to confuse anybody.)

[olds 15]

With a heavy heart, I note the departure of colleague Bakerman from the modding scene. His passion and talent will be sorely missed. I hope he will return some day, but I wish him the very best regardless.

As I have no information beyond that, let's respectfully consider the topic closed and not derail with further discussion in this thread.

RAM basics are in place, so releases will take a little hiatus as I work on some much needed damage testing and porting experiments.

[Tonci87 163]

Well damn....

[olds 15]

Well whaddya know? The latest Arma update broke RAM!

Go grab 0.0.61 alpha from the front page to get the fix.

(P.S. The real story is that BIS actually fixed an error RAM was working around. I had to remove the workaround to account for that.)

[Guest]

The new version has been frontpaged on the Armaholic homepage.

Real Armor Mod v0.0.61 alpha

==================================================

You are not registered on Armaholic, or at least not that we are aware of. In the future we offer the possibility to authors to maintain their own pages.

If you wish to be able to do this as well please register on Armaholic and let me know about it.

This is not mandatory at all! Only if you wish to control your own content you are welcome to join, otherwise we will continue to follow your work like we have always done ;)

When you have any questions already feel free to PM or email me!

[sonsalt6 105]

New update v0.0.6.1 alpha available at withSIX. Download now by clicking:

[Bouben 3]

This mod, while amazing, has one big mistake. AI can't work with it. They will happily trash all their AT ammo against tank's front armor.

[PVT Watt.J 14]

This mod, while amazing, has one big mistake. AI can't work with it. They will happily trash all their AT ammo against tank's front armor.

I imagine this would be a tricky one to solve.

Here is an overly complicated solution that is entirely impractical but *might* work.

1. Reduce cost of tank in config. I believe this reduces target priority.

2. Set cost of HEAT missiles to high enough that they won't often be used against tank directly.

3. Create dummy vehicles to use is targeting points for rear/sides. Set the cost of these dummy vehicles to be high.

4. Attach dummy vehicles to side/rear of tanks.

Of course, Olds rightly prefers clean solutions and that is nowhere close to clean!

[Bouben 3]

I imagine this would be a tricky one to solve.

Here is an overly complicated solution that is entirely impractical but *might* work.

1. Reduce cost of tank in config. I believe this reduces target priority.

2. Set cost of HEAT missiles to high enough that they won't often be used against tank directly.

3. Create dummy vehicles to use is targeting points for rear/sides. Set the cost of these dummy vehicles to be high.

4. Attach dummy vehicles to side/rear of tanks.

Of course, Olds rightly prefers clean solutions and that is nowhere close to clean!

Well, would be interesting to see if Olds can do something with it.

[olds 15]

Well, would be interesting to see if Olds can do something with it.

Intriguing discussion gentlemen. I have nothing concrete to offer as I'm slowly working on porting issues now, but for whatever it's worth, here's a big "AFAIK...":

• Arma has only the simplest approach to telling AI what's attackable; and--who would have guessed?--it's hitpoint based! :icon_rolleyes:
  
• Yes, there are related properties that determine AI interest in a target (cost, threat).
  
• But only damageResistance tells them if their current weapon is worth using. And this is based purely on the hit value of the weapon; unfortunately target facing is not a factor in this calculation.
  
• Of course, penetration values are ignored, but everyone knew that already...:p
  

To be fair, I think it would be pretty darned common for (inexperienced) combatants to do nothing more than fire a vaguely appropriate weapon when they got a chance and leave it at that. We've got that behavior covered (:)) and I have to say I don't find that terribly unrealistic given the overall state of the Arma AI(!)

Experienced troops (and some fancy AI) would not just recognize facing, but reposition themselves for flank shots, or predict target movement and wait for them, or fire ATGMs from upper floors, etc.... now let's face it, this ain't happening in Arma.

All that being said, Shadow's suggestion is instructive. I'd guess the implementation would be simpler: the dummies (or script) doesn't change threat/cost, it simply provides a weaker damageResistance for vulnerable facings. (I won't even go into the fact caliber, not hit, is what really matters in RAM..!)

Further, I have no idea what the actual AI formula is for calculating attack-ability based on damageResistance. You'd think the value would simply be "lowest hit value of a weapon worth using", but instead you get this mysterious fractional number. Pfft! "Documentation!" :icon_rolleyes:

BTW, formula is: minWeapHitValue² / vehArmor * (0.27/vehBoundingRadius)²

(This is also a useful reminder to look thru damageResistance and hit values at some point down the road to make sure nothing is too far out of whack when weapons/vehicles are tweaked/added.)

[gliptal 25]

Damn it the more of these great mods come out the more I feel compelled to get back playing the game. Sorry if I don't go through all 20 thread pages, but are all vanilla weapons and vehicles affected by the mod?

Yay!

Edited April 21, 2014 by Gliptal

[olds 15]

Damn it the more of these great mods come out the more I feel compelled to get back playing the game. Sorry if I don't go through all 20 thread pages, but are all vanilla weapons and vehicles affected by the mod?

Yay!

Howdy Gliptal,

Vehicles affected so far: Tanks, APCs, Wheeled APCs

Weapons affected: All Bullets & Shells are automatically affected, all HEAT warhead weapons have been fixed, mines work, other explosive weapons work to varying degrees and are still being fixed

Enjoy :)

[gliptal 25]

Great, that's what I was hoping to hear! :D

Yay!

[darkxess 60]

Hey guys, is this mod still causing a conflict with ASR_AI? Just wondering.

Thanks.

[orcinus 121]

Hey guys, is this mod still causing a conflict with ASR_AI? Just wondering.

Thanks.

Hi mate

Apologies, something was a bit screwed when I ran the tests I reported yesterday. Neither ASR_AI nor bcombat are involved. The Combined Arms showcase goes fubar when RAM is combined with either Taosenai's or Redfield-77's bullet mods - see my post here

Cheers

Orc

[darkxess 60]

Hi mate

Apologies, something was a bit screwed when I ran the tests I reported yesterday. Neither ASR_AI nor bcombat are involved. The Combined Arms showcase goes fubar when RAM is combined with either Taosenai's or Redfield-77's bullet mods - see my post here

Cheers

Orc

Ok, thank you for confirmation :)

[zimms 22]

From today's Dev Branch update:

• Introduced minimalHit parameter to better protect MRAPs from small arms fire
  

This looks like it could be helpful to you. Would that mean that the vehicle's hitpoints are untouched?

[Predator.v2 10]

Does this addon work on MP? And who needs the addon? Server only oder players too? Or just players?