Releasing games early damages sales?

[ToxLaximus 1]

Oops...http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/carrier-command-gaea-mission

Example: Modern Warfare 3 and Battlefield 3 were released at roughly the same time and are the same kind of game, Modern Warfare 3 was polished and sold 29 million, Battlefield 3 was not and sold 14 million to date.

[Thygrrr 1]

This game was in development since about 2006 or 2008. The initial release data was Q1/2010 ... there's nothing "early" about its release, it was long overdue.

[ToxLaximus 1]

Early as in not finished yet.

[Thygrrr 1]

At a certain point, a team can't make a game better, they will just break it more. That happens a lot with AAA titles lately. It's one of the main reasons why indie games, which focus on game play and innovation rather than content (in the AAA sense) are experiencing such a huge renaissance these days.

Funny enough, I wonder if Bohemia Interactive had forsaken the massively subpar campaign (which was IMHO the worst addition to the game they could do... what did it try to achieve? compete with Halo and CoD and even BF2142 and BF3 and all those other games?) if they could have made a more solid overall game without a story-driven campaign.

Yes, all you single player game fans and magazine reviewers out there, who whine when a game has no story yet great game play... THANKS FOR NOTHING! </rant>

---------- Post added at 14:58 ---------- Previous post was at 14:45 ----------

Addendum: Oh, and of course when your core team fails, you can bring in new guys (if you look at the scripts, you see this has most likely happened) but they usually can't fix it either, so your project cost explodes even more. Then you axe or demote the project lead and reassign a new, more business savvy one (which I think may have happened for CCGM) and at the same time have the team work double time and release the game at all costs so you can recover at least some of your expenses.

Because after all, the games industry is a business. :cool: I just wish studios didn't fix bad situations as ham-fistedly as they sometimes do. But there's no recipe to steer clear of a disaster once it has happened. Management is hard.

Edited October 6, 2012 by Thygrrr

[ToxLaximus 1]

You know your stuff as many others here, given half a chance someone on these forums could turn out a quick fix in days or even hours, this would keep the ranting down and give the game a fighting chance.

[Thygrrr 1]

Nah. A bunch of people usually can't finish in their free time what a dozen professionals (no matter the talent) left unfinished in years.

Rare exceptions:

• Just Cause 2 Multiplayer (nice hack! monster-kudos to their team!)
  
• GTA 3 Multiplayer (even though that wasn't really robust)
  
• Forged Alliance Forever / Community Bugfix Patch / etc.
  
• TA Bugfix
  
• Spring RTS
  
• The various Söldner: Secret Wars mods
  

That said, I'm looking hard into making a solid mod for this; I worked on a Carrier Command remake ages ago but I decided it was too much work, especially on the art asset side (infathomably time expensive and probably not doable when you are a coder, not an artist). Also, my real life job has kind of scratched my game development itch on a daily basis almost a decade now... ;)

Now Gaea Mission has a great collection of assets, and they are even Carrier Command themed! And they have a solid engine (and a semi-solid game built on top of it). So, pretty decent starting point. I wouldn't expect to have a blockbuster mod like CounterStrike oder DayZ, but one could possibly build a deep and challenging Carrier Command Plus from the looks of it.

The dream would of course be a solid multiplayer implementation, much of which is totally off limits without any access to the (an) engine like Enforce itself. And even then this could easily become a multi-man-year project. So I actually hope CCGM will get multi player (that is, full CARRIER multi play, not Vehicle or - god forbid - FPS multi play) and we modders can make it shine.

Edited October 6, 2012 by Thygrrr

[Dajunka 10]

I can't see CCGM ever being a massive seller, it's more of a cult game that will still be around and played/bought long, long after your BF and COD have faded into the mist of obscurity.

I would go on to say that CCGM was released in a better condition then 95% of releases these days. There is nothing that a quick patch can't sort out.

[lawndartleo 109]

Oops...http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/carrier-command-gaea-mission

Example: Modern Warfare 3 and Battlefield 3 were released at roughly the same time and are the same kind of game, Modern Warfare 3 was polished and sold 29 million, Battlefield 3 was not and sold 14 million to date.

COD has far more polish simply because there is nothing new there, so move along folks. Activision hasn't released a new game since COD4 Modern Warfare came out. When I recently tried COD 3 I was dismayed at how unchanged it was.... but then it has been a successful formula for Activision so why change. BF3 the othe other hand has pushed the envelope of gameplay and development and make advances in the genre... minimal as they may be... certainly more than COD has to this point.

COD appeals to the everyone for themselves, fast and furious, gibblefest crowd. BF appeals to a crowd that appreciates a slower, more methodical, tactical, team oriented game play approach.

It also doesn't hurt to have the marketing behemoth of Activision behind it all. COD does not deserve the sales numbers it has as compared to BF. It is not a superior game but it certainly has superior marketing behind it.

Honestly I think comparing the two are like comparing a Cadillac to a Corvette. Both are luxury cars that cost $65,000, but that is about all they have in common.

Edited October 6, 2012 by lawndartleo

[Scepticer 1]

"There comes a time in every project when you have to shoot the engineer and start production."

...but I think they should have let him/her fix the walrus AI first. ;)

[Raptor 10]

ToxLaximus is right in a certain way. I mean BIS iniated a P&C for a certain reason because of bug fixing and finding issues for tackle.

And as I remember as the P&C starts many reviewers said that the AI has massive pathfinding problems. Now BIS is pressured by the community and anything goes faster. Actually Dram announced that they found a solution for this critical issue. The question is why can't BIS resolve theses issues before the release if it goes that fast ? Is it the BIS way of living? (Its still the same since ArmA)

Beside the fact that BF and COD has other focuses, as well as focused on mainstream gamers. And to be honest many of the old CC-player are still satisfied with the gamw, which stands to reason.

But this didn't excused the bad release quality.

Edited October 6, 2012 by Raptor

[Nicholas 5]

You can't judge a game by sales or metacritic. Also do your sales numbers include digital downloads? Or only retail sales?

[Bansheedragon 1]

Whats the purpose of this thread?

Is the OP saying this game was released too early?

[JakartaJim 1]

It's always the same. The producers specify a date and the developer must comply with that. Unfortunately, you can not make the game up to that done, so many things are neglected. Main thing is that the game is in store.

Unfortunately, the producers do not think the fact that the game is judged as it comes on the market. And as a semi-finished version can not be very good, it gets a bad review. As it gets a bad review, only a few people buy it. Buy it only a few patches barely be made. Patches are barely done, the fans are pissed.

Result: only little money in the till. Fans angry. Developers frustrated.

Producer ... What a genius.

[ToxLaximus 1]

Unfortunately, the producers do not think the fact the Result: only little money in the till. Fans angry. Developers frustrated.

Game works, fans happy and recommend to their friends, devs make more money and buy porches, girls like porches.

But seriously a game that works is going out sell one that does not work so well, that's the point many sales teams cant understand.