Ouya! Time for game Developers like BIS to move to an open platform?

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Except for infrared, Ouya has all you mentioned (USB 2.0).

One (1) USB 2.0 port, no Ethernet port.

Can you explain me how can living-room-multimedia-console-device connected to TV and speakers controlled by gamepad compete with smartphones and tablets with touchscreen?

You tell me how it doesn't. :)

46IiRyigUH0

You don't buy console for browsing web or playing games during travel.

Err, regarding the Internet - the trend is against you with PS3/360.

No it doesn't and you still fail to provide reason why. So tell me, why does ARM processor puts you in competition with mobile apps? Energy efficiency and other properties of processor don't have anything to do with it.

Because ARM can't compete with anything else, it battles itself between different architectures and platforms (iOS/Android/Windows 7-8-RT)

What redundancy are you talking about? It's supposed to be cheap multimedia device capable of running decent games. Why would it become obsolote?

Hardware - Tegra 3 will be replaced with Tegra 4. Mind you, ARM is being developed specifically for mobile devices in view.

[batto 17]

One (1) USB 2.0 port, no Ethernet port.

Check the KS page, it has Ethernet.

Because ARM can't compete with anything else, it battles itself between different architectures and platforms (iOS/Android/Windows 7-8-RT)

I don't give a damn about where ARM "battles" (whatever it means). Please stop talking business. Or are trying to tell me that Ouya will battle in TV market and set-top-box market too? Because they all use ARM too ya know.

Mind you, ARM is being developed specifically for mobile devices in view.

False. You just made it up.

Err, regarding the Internet - the trend is against you with PS3/360.

So people actually buy consoles for Internet on business trips?

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

I don't give a damn about where ARM "battles" (whatever it means). Please stop talking business. Or are trying to tell me that Ouya will battle in TV market and set-top-box market too? Because they all use ARM too ya know.

Clearly, we're going round in circles. :) And no, if a device with an ARM microprocessor will be using the same applications as a... device with an ARM microprocessor, then it certainly is in the same category. Next thing, you'll be telling me that MAC is not a PC. :cc:

False. You just made it up.

Of course I did. :dancehead::computer:

So people actually buy consoles for Internet on business trips?

Eh, where does travel picture into all of this? All consoles from now on will feature the aforementioned connectivity and they will be displacing desktop PCs for home entertainment: consoles move up, (smart-)phones move up. Not sure where that leaves Ouya...

...And round and round it goes, where it stops - nobody knows! :icon_mrgreen:

Edited August 13, 2012 by Iroquois Pliskin

[Dead3yez 0]

It's a mobile phone in a box which you plug into your television.

[[frl]myke 14]

And no, if a device with an ARM microprocessor will be using the same applications as a... device with an ARM microprocessor, then it certainly is in the same category

Plain wrong. Or would you say that a Smartphone with a ARM processor is the same type of device like a Tablet with a ARM Processor? I'm sorry, so far i didn't saw anyone holding a tablet to the air and making a call.

Ouya (or any other device with same/similar concept) is meant to remain stationary. They wont need a battery pack which gives place to a optical drive (DVD/Blu-Ray). The purpose is to take place in the living room as media center with included gaming capabilities. Not everyone of us is forever alone, we have family and i think my wife would be pissed if i take the tablet with me while she would like to watch a movie on the TV set, streamed from our NAS. So there is tha place where the ouya concept comes in play.

You might say now that HTPC could take this place which is absolutely true. But there, building a HTPC with PC components is still more expensive than a ARM architecture device. And about gaming, it might be shocking for you but there are people out there prefering android games over PC games (or PS3/XBox/Wii).

So you end up with a cheap device that can play videos, music, android games, browse the web and all this on a big screen while sitting comfortably in your living room. I don't see how this could be wrong.

But i guess, since you don't see how it could be of any use for you, you think it can't be of any use for anyone else.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Myke;2206753']Plain wrong. Or would you say that a Smartphone with a ARM processor is the same type of device like a Tablet with a ARM Processor? I'm sorry' date=' so far i didn't saw anyone holding a tablet to the air and making a call.

[/quote']

Yes, a scaled up screen - no other differences are to be found.

If you people wanted a computing powerhouse on ARM, you're badly out of luck,

ARM 2. ACORN Archimedes. The year was 1987...

Here's to summarise the last 2-3 pages of this thread,

BIQXSgxqCZc

Interesting to see a moderator on BIS forums rationalise this "ultimate multimedia box". Now all you guys have to do is to await delivery March, 2013. Happens to the best of us. :icon_mrgreen:

[[frl]myke 14]

IroquoisPliskin, you better re-learn to read. But maybe it was too complicated. What i said was that the idea behind Ouya (while this particular project might be fishy) isn't that bad and obsolete at all. A cheap device to play DVD/BluRay's, play movies from a NAS and play casual games (i said casual, not the kind of games that would require a Console and/or PC).

Actually to built up such a PC is still quite expensive, compared how cheap it could be done using the ARM architecture and Android. Linux would be a alternative regarding the OS but Android has by far the more interesting App pool for this kind of device (is Angry Birds available on Linux?).

[batto 17]

If you people wanted a computing powerhouse on ARM, you're badly out of luck

From what I read theoretical performance of Ouya according to its specs seems to be on par with Xbox 360.

Myke;2206935']Actually to built up such a PC is still quite expensive' date=' compared how cheap it could be done using the ARM architecture and Android. Linux would be a alternative regarding the OS but Android has by far the more interesting App pool for this kind of device (is Angry Birds available on Linux?).[/quote']

Android is Linux. (But you need Android for Angry Birds IMO).

Edited August 14, 2012 by batto

[[frl]myke 14]

Android is Linux-based, not quite the same. ;) But i admit it is a bit nitpicking. :D

Point is (if i'm correct), Linux software doesn't run on Android and vice versa.

[walker 0]

Hi all

Interesting Gamasutra article about the Ouya platform and what it brings to the Game Developer market and the threats to and from competitors:

http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/ThomasGrove/20120810/175731/Threats_to_Ouya__Developers_Win.php

In an example of how the concept of Rapid Application Development (RAD) has infected the hardware market thus becoming Rapid Hardware Development (RHD), PC World say Ouya are now preparing to launch the Platform:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/260630/ouya_ends_kickstarter_campaign_prepares_to_launch_androidbased_console.html

The plane fact is that with the:

1. Ubiquitous nature of Android as an OS that is not tied to a particular platform like the PC, though microsoft are playing catchup.
   
2. And the RHD concept that has taken over first the Phone Market then the Tablet Market and now the Console market
   

The increasing speed of platform development has started to exhibit the predictions of Ray Kurzweil's The Singularity is Near

In the near term this is an example of the effects of Disruptive RHD technology on existing Dinosaur technologies like the PC/Mac and the clunky consoles like the Sony Playstation/Microsoft X-Box/Nintendo Wii etc.

As the Gamasutra article points out:

The Ouya itself is at risk to this Disruptive effect of RHD, in fact as is any hardware company, this is the basic economics supply and demmand being applied to all markets, in such a disruptive market the only real protection is to be so cheap as to make competitors see no profit in entering your market, this infact is what BIS did in the Simulation market.

The advantage for the customer is obvious, a much cheaper product, this in turn enlarges the market for developers so good for developers too, as an open platform it also gets rid of much of the power of the non developer producer companies that work hard to stop new developers entering the market as they are each competitors to the Gravy Train of borring, scripted, episodic Soap like, Franchise Games; that have so stagnated the game development arena.

The Effects of disruptive technologies and practices are effecting all markets whether it be games, cars, logistics or music. Many bands now use a kickstarter like model to finance the recording of an album ditto games developers and other artists.

New concepts in financing projects are one of its effects hence kickstarter and its competitors, such new finance systems will start to seriously alter the financial markets too, expect the concept of financial centers like, the City of London and Wall Street to become obosolete within as litle as a decade and to face serious decline in the next five years as finance becomes more democratised and distributed, it has even started to effect charity giving with people directly giving to particular vilages or individuals, expect this whole concept to snowball across the economic markets.

This will in turn is affecting the political arena, do we need parliaments when we have the internet, would the houses of Paliament make a great hotel, also how are all those big financial buildings going to be used if they become obsolete?

Kind Regards walker

Edited August 14, 2012 by walker

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Myke;2206935']IroquoisPliskin' date=' you better re-learn to read. But maybe it was too complicated. What i said was that the idea behind Ouya (while this particular project might be fishy) isn't that bad and obsolete at all. A cheap device to play DVD/BluRay's, play movies from a NAS and play casual games (i said casual, not the kind of games that would require a Console and/or PC).[/quote']

How are you going to watch BluRay movies on it - an external USB drive? What is the point of it then, why not get a proper console?

People really are desperate for this marketing pitch. Good luck competing with XBOX 720 at <$399, which sports everything you will ever need for the next 5 years.

P.S. Forgot to mention a separate hard drive for your Ouya - might as well get a HTPC, rofl. Oh, oh and a USB hub due to the single port, and, and... you get the idea. :icon_mrgreen:

---------- Post added at 13:31 ---------- Previous post was at 13:15 ----------

From what I read theoretical performance of Ouya according to its specs seems to be on par with Xbox 360.

You read wrong,

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-how-powerful-is-tegra-3

Looking at XBOX performance at best. That's from 2002 - damn you, second law of thermodynamics!

_Gq_ZU9p5Nk

Environments are surprisingly decent, this has to be rendered at 720p. Although, I'm not sure who would be derp enough to do this on a regular basis, but this is proof of concept for smartphones.

Edited August 14, 2012 by Iroquois Pliskin

[[frl]myke 14]

P.S. Forgot to mention a separate hard drive for your Ouya

NAS & WiFi? You might have heard of it.

Good luck competing with XBOX 720

I think Ouya is competing as much the XBox 720 like ArmA 2 competes BF3. But i'm affraid you wont see the point again.

Oh, oh and a USB hub due to the single port

For what? Connecting Keyboard and Mouse? Or game controller? Well, there is a brand new tech available (maybe not in your corner of the world) called bluetooth.

Could you please stop of making a fool of yourself?

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Myke;2207201']

I think Ouya is competing as much the XBox 720 like ArmA 2 competes BF3. But i'm affraid you wont see the point again.

They would be competing for multimedia. This generation consoles will be <$149 by March 2013.

For what? Connecting Keyboard and Mouse? Or game controller? Well' date=' there is a brand new tech available (maybe not in your corner of the world) called bluetooth.[/quote']

HDD over bluetooth? :cc: What you desire already exists and it is the MK802 Android "Mini-PC",

BiYK1Hfy8X4

Just don't subsidise these Ouya clowns, who had "pledged" money on a disillusioned impulse buy.

We'll be awaiting review of the MK802, Myke. :)

Edited August 14, 2012 by Iroquois Pliskin

[[frl]myke 14]

HDD over bluetooth?

As already suggested, learn to read. Let me quote myself:

NAS & WiFi? You might have heard of it.

But this shows perfectly your attitude to ignore written stuff if it doesn't fit into your narrow field of view.

And for the (at least) second time: i'm not speaking about Ouya specially, i'm speaking of the general idea of such a device generally. So yes, the linked vid looks not that bad, just optically not that what i would expect to have in my living room.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Myke;2207269']

And for the (at least) second time: i'm not speaking about Ouya specially' date=' i'm speaking of the general idea of such a device generally.[/quote']

Cool beans, I'll be awaiting review of the MK802 from you.

NAS & WiFi? You might have heard of it.

You're still acquiring 3rd party hardware to make the "ultimate multimedia box" functional. It's supposed to be a peasant's dream in China - a PC for only $99 ($74)! But you're making him spend more, so sad. :(

So yes, the linked vid looks not that bad, just optically not that what i would expect to have in my living room.

Sure, everyone wants the latest SoC and peripherals, and software support, and ad infinitum, for only $99.99. :-) What is the definition of "optically" in the context of this device - the casing isn't up-to scratch with the design of your 60" TV? :icon_mrgreen:

[[frl]myke 14]

Let's try it the other way around since this seems to be too complicated for you.

What Hardware and OS would you suggest to fulfill the following tasks:

- stream video files from a NAS

- stream audio files from a NAS

- stream webradio

- play YT movies

- HDMI output

- Bluetooth/WiFi

- play popular casual games

- play DVD/BluRay (either built-in drive or attach via USB)

You can achieve this cheaper with ARM/Android combination than with any x86/x64/Win/Linux combination.

What is the definition of "optically" in the context of this device - the casing isn't up-to scratch with the design of your 60" TV? :icon_mrgreen:

It's 50" and Zotac has some nice looking HTPC's in their portfolio. This would also be the competing product class, btw. And there, a ARM/Android device would have good chance to take the lead due to it's lower price and the available apps, nothing Win nor Linux could compete with.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Myke;2207516']Let's try it the other way around since this seems to be too complicated for you.

What Hardware and OS would you suggest to fulfill the following tasks:

- stream video files from a NAS

- stream audio files from a NAS

- stream webradio

- play YT movies

- HDMI output

- Bluetooth/WiFi

- play popular casual games

- play DVD/BluRay (either built-in drive or attach via USB)

You can achieve this cheaper with ARM/Android combination than with any x86/x64/Win/Linux combination.

Sorry' date=' m8 - not an expert on half-assed solutions, which is a single USB port Android ARM dongle. Get a PS3. :)

It's 50" and Zotac has some nice looking HTPC's in their portfolio. This would also be the competing product class, btw. And there, a ARM/Android device would have good chance to take the lead due to it's lower price and the available apps, nothing Win nor Linux could compete with.

I'd like to see you run 1080p MKVs on this ultimate multimedia box, when you hook up all the periphery via Bluetooth and then clog up the CPU with WiFi streaming.

Like I said, this dongle is a peasant's dream for a PC, not a multimedia solution.

---------- Post added at 09:38 ---------- Previous post was at 09:33 ----------

P.S. Intel's Haswell architecture CPUs are coming in 2013 - up-to 3x iGPU performance over Ivy Bridge's HD4000 - HTPC under $299. Winning.

[batto 17]

I'd like to see you run 1080p MKVs on this ultimate multimedia box, when you hook up all the periphery via Bluetooth and then clog up the CPU with WiFi streaming.

Interesting. My m8 bought very little "multimedia center" device (with ARM most probably) and it handled 1080p MKV stream from USB flawlessly. We stressed it with 1080p Planet Earth series (sh*tload of details) with almost no problems (except the view on thousands of flying birds). It handled it better than CoreAVC codec on Core2Duo.

And by the way, since when WiFi clogs up CPU?

EDIT: So the device I talked about (WD TV Live) has some Sigma processor. Go be Intel employee somewhere else.

Your arguments are based solely on buzz.

Edited August 15, 2012 by batto

[[frl]myke 14]

Get a PS3.

Epic fail, man. Maybe read posts fully before answering. You know, not interested in playing PS3 games but here and there a casual android game. But i forgot, Android games run great on PS3. Also compare cost of PS3 with a possible Android/ARM HTPC.

I'd like to see you run 1080p MKVs on this ultimate multimedia box

Hmm...1080p MKV's just run fine on my Android tablet, hooked up to my FullHD screen, even with my bluetooth keyboard hooked up on it. Yeah, should get a decent remote but for now the keyboard does the job. And as you might guess, the MKV is streamed over WiFi.

But it's a tablet, so i would prefer something that fits optically better to my HiFi set...or keep it completely invisible. Something stationary, ya know. Maybe from time to time play a round of angra birds, nothing fancy. Oh, and not too expensive of course. Do you know what could fit there?

[Pyronick 21]

Sorry, m8 - not an expert on half-assed solutions, which is a single USB port Android ARM dongle. Get a PS3. :)

My PS3 doesn't handle all the codecs of my movie and music collection. My HTPC does, with XBMC that is.

If a cheap Android dongle (or OUYA for that matter) with enough grunt is able to run XBMC with 1080p60 hardware acceleration on almost all codecs (even VP8), why would it be a half-assed solution? So far, my PS3 is a half-assed solution - it does not do "everything".

I'd like to see you run 1080p MKVs on this ultimate multimedia box, when you hook up all the periphery via Bluetooth and then clog up the CPU with WiFi streaming.

Like I said, this dongle is a peasant's dream for a PC, not a multimedia solution.

These dongles have SOCs which have dedicated DSP IC for de/en/transcoding various codecs so that the CPU and GPU are not taxed at all. Just like the newer CPU's from Intel and AMD.

[batto 17]

Just found this.

http://www.ouya.tv/its-open-season/

[dm 9]

I enjoy that the controller, "designed" by this Matt guy, is just a carbon-copy of the xbox controller (with fatter, squarer handles). I enjoy even more her comment of "it really takes into consideration the open-ness of ouya". How, exactly, does the controller do that, crazy lady?

As the top comment says:

The power of a phone with the portability of a console.

Nah, I'm okay.

Edited December 28, 2012 by DM

[Dwarden 1125]

ironically i'm very dissaponted with the specs of this console , only 1GB of shared memory (way slower one than XBOX360 or PS3 has)

4-5 years old PC with 4GB memory and 1GB VRAM can do way better ... but wait standard these days is 6-32GB and 2-4GB VRAM lol

(hell these days you find tablets with 1,2,4,8 GB RAM memory already (smartphones with half))

any Java based game or app will go cry me a river on this console ...

so sad, nice concept, obsolete hardware by launch

also about the GPU, while they claim to use faster OC version of Tegra 4 it's sort of worrysome compared to new PowerVR and upcoming NVIDIA Tegra 4

(aka anything what comes with the new hw mid 2013 will make Ouya instantly obsolete)

Edited December 28, 2012 by Dwarden

[Mr. Charles 22]

I enjoy that the controller, "designed" by this Matt guy, is just a carbon-copy of the xbox controller (with fatter, squarer handles). I enjoy even more her comment of "it really takes into consideration the open-ness of ouya". How, exactly, does the controller do that, crazy lady?

As the top comment says:

It does that by being transparent, silly buns :o

€dit: i love how they put a fan in a closed box :cool:

[Dwarden 1125]

i assume the fan isn't closed (so there are holes)

and from the look it's some cheap fan which means it goes dusty, rusty and shaky soon ...

so forget about quiet and cool

all in all, nothing what any Chinese Android miniPC builder can't do... (slap some SOC, chips and ports together on small pcb)