Do I need photoshop to make addons?

[Meatball0311 79]

GOT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

To all who are reading make sure your work is stored in P: drive!!

Now on to the next step... the backpack config

[Meatball0311 79]

I need help understanding how to make resolution LOD's.. I understand that you right click in the LOD window and select NEW, but how do you know what points to select for each LOD?

Can someone explain the process as I have tried to look for an explanation, but have not found one.

[[frl]myke 14]

It depends on the model and your skills how to create a lower resolution LOD. One way could be to copy/paste the original model and by removing parts and/or merging points you get a lower poly model. Or you build up a new lower res model from scratch. Rough guideline: each Resolution LOD should approximately half the polycount.

In your case, i would probably delete the knobs and connectors and i would rebuild the antenna by a simple square box.

[Meatball0311 79]

It depends on the model and your skills how to create a lower resolution LOD. One way could be to copy/paste the original model and by removing parts and/or merging points you get a lower poly model. Or you build up a new lower res model from scratch. Rough guideline: each Resolution LOD should approximately half the polycount.

In your case, i would probably delete the knobs and connectors and i would rebuild the antenna by a simple square box.

do you mean for 0.000 LOD or for 1.000?

[DaSquade 0]

Well best is to have

LOD1

LOD2

LOD3

LOD4

LODX (or more depending how much you reduced the model).

I think a model of max. 400 tris should be made for latest lod in case of cars/planes. Again depends a bit on your model. Some say it is best to have not too many models. Each lod = more mb in total for your p3d.

The golden rule is to have each next lower lod (so higher lod number) half tris (imho it should be verts) of the previous lod or less. Personally, i keep the visual 'deformation' of my model in mind, so lod switching doesn't visually change with huge differences. So often simply removing stuff isn't that good.

Merging point isn't always the best thing aswell:

Often you need to merg the same point on your UV map aswell.

Often you encounter ST error while doing that, something you best fix (especially in the more detailed lods).

Ideally is to make your lods in programs that give you better controle over your model and UV map.

I use modo, because i like it's remove edge feature. If the edge isn't part of an UV unwrap piece, the uv gets adjusted without problems. Very handy and quick way to reduce cilinders that are based on 4-8-16-32-64 segments. But also for other parts.

[Meatball0311 79]

Thanks for all of your help, but I am a complete newbie to modeling and basically teaching myself how to do this. This is what I understand at the moment....

1. I need LOD's (Level of Detail) that represent how the model looks at different distances.

2. 0.000 (or the lowest numbered LOD) has the most detail and every LOD above that should contain half the number of points as the previous LOD.

3. There are three types of LOD's (resolution, shadow and geometry)

I have been using Myke's and Mondkalb's tutorials and also checked out Gnats videos. The problem that I am having is understanding which points I need to select for each LOD. I understand that with each LOD the model will slowly get less detailed, but I dont know how to subtract points without possible ruining the model??

I guess this is what I need help on:

1. How many (I was recommended only 3 resolution LOD's) LOD's do I need?

2. Do I need all three types of LOD's (resolution, shadow, geometry)?

Here a some screenshots of the model:

I plan on adding some pouches to the ruck and improving the look to it. I realize I may be asking for much, but can someone walk me through the steps on what I need to do to make this an addon.

1. Model (Done)

2. Texture (Done)

I need help with:

3. Adding LOD's

4. model.config

Thank you for your help...

[[frl]myke 14]

As i know your model already, here a few hints about how to reduce polycount.

As your radio has the knobs and connectors on the texture, in the next LOD you could remove completely the modelled knobs. Replace the antenna with a version which has only 4,5 or 6 sides (less "round", you get the point).

On the top of the radio (where the display and connectors are) you have modelled some other details, also candidates to remove.

For the last LOD, you could probably make one square box for the radio and one square box for the antenna, nothing more. Will look ugly when looking at it in Buldozer preview but remember, this LOD will only be visible from very very far.

For the Shadow LOD you can use the lowest resolution LOD aswell. For this model it doesn't need more shadow detail.

The Geo LOD can be just a single square box, representing the radio body. The other details you can ignore. Geo LOD is for collision detection with bullets (and other objects but non-relevant for your object) so it could save a soldiers life. ;)

You have to look if you can work just by merging points to reduce details. Sometimes it is easier to remodel parts. As example the antenna. Instead of merging points i guess you get it faster done by just deleting and create a new box/Cylinder. And at some parts, simply selete them will do the job.

[Meatball0311 79]

As i know your model already, here a few hints about how to reduce polycount.

As your radio has the knobs and connectors on the texture, in the next LOD you could remove completely the modelled knobs. Replace the antenna with a version which has only 4,5 or 6 sides (less "round", you get the point).

On the top of the radio (where the display and connectors are) you have modelled some other details, also candidates to remove.

For the last LOD, you could probably make one square box for the radio and one square box for the antenna, nothing more. Will look ugly when looking at it in Buldozer preview but remember, this LOD will only be visible from very very far.

For the Shadow LOD you can use the lowest resolution LOD aswell. For this model it doesn't need more shadow detail.

The Geo LOD can be just a single square box, representing the radio body. The other details you can ignore. Geo LOD is for collision detection with bullets (and other objects but non-relevant for your object) so it could save a soldiers life. ;)

You have to look if you can work just by merging points to reduce details. Sometimes it is easier to remodel parts. As example the antenna. Instead of merging points i guess you get it faster done by just deleting and create a new box/Cylinder. And at some parts, simply selete them will do the job.

Thanks for the detailed explaination.. it makes more sense now. I will work on this and update later. Thanks bud!

[esco7800 10]

i need to find the Normal Map plugin for Gimp the link provided did not work?

[[frl]myke 14]

Did you waited the 10 seconds it says on the webpage? It redirected me here:

http://code.google.com/p/gimp-normalmap/

Also a google search would have helped.

[esco7800 10]

thanks and I would like to know how do i take a woodland camo uniform texture. I want to use the texture from a add on I have how can i extract the texture from the pbo file or can I? or is there a easier way to add the texture to my own unit? it just for my personal use to test my unit

Edited April 27, 2010 by esco7800

[Meatball0311 79]

I have finished modeling and texturing and now I need to make LOD's. This is my first time so I want to take this slow :)

This is my first model, so it aint the most prettiest but it will do for now.

I need to make some LOD's and I have decided to make three. 0.000, 1.000, 2.000

As I understand each LOD should be half the number of points as the previous. My model has Points: 1474, Faces: 1336, Sections: 1

0.000 should be Points 1474

1.000 should be Points 737

2.000 should be Points 368

How am I doing so far... is this correct?

From LOD 0.000 to 1.000 I need to reduce the amount of points by half so that is around 737 points that I need to??? delete? or hide? merge??? Having a hard time understanding this.

The ways to reduce the amount of point is to delete or merge? how do I merge?

Can someone walk me through how to create LOD's... When I right click on the LOD section.. and select new... what do I do next.

Thank you all for your help

Edited May 7, 2010 by Meatball0311

[[frl]myke 14]

First of all, don't stay too fixed on this "half the polys/points" thing.if it's not exactly halfed but for a LOD you can't wont go lower, keep it.

To start, copy/paste your model from LOD 0 to LOD 1. From then it's up to you to decide if merge or delete will fit best.

A little exercise to get familiar with merging points: create a 8-2ided cylinder. Now on each end, select 2 nearby points and press shift + D. Repeat until you reduced it to a square. Do the same on the other side of the cylinder. You'll end up with a simple box but what you did was reducing polycount and pointcount. You made something round just less round.

Use the same way to reduce raoundness on your model. Also try to find out which parts you couldn't identify from a certain distance anyway, those are candidates to be deleted.

Remember you have to rework UV mapping in the UV editor afterwards as at least merging points will mess up the UV mapping a little.

[Meatball0311 79]

I wont get stuck on the concept of "half the polys", but will keep it in mind when lowering LOD.

So when I copy/paste from LOD 0 to LOD 1, where am I pasting? am I making a new .p3d file?

When I right click in the LOD section, and select "new" do I have to have the points selected for that LOD?

I need a tutorial on LOD's or a step by step explaination of how to do them...

and the rework of the UV mapping.. can you explain a little more.

Once again thank you for your patience and help Myke.

Edited May 7, 2010 by Meatball0311

[[frl]myke 14]

See the LOD's as layers, depending on distance to the player, the engine will select the appropriate Resolution LOD to display the object. Simply said, each LOD is a 3D model for itself, packed together in a p3d file.

About UV mapping and rework it after merging...imagine 3 simple planes. You have one texture with the letters A B C on it, and each plane is covered with one of those letters. Now delete the plane in the middle with the B on it and stretch the remaining 2 planes to fill the gap. You will not end up with A B C because if you stretch a plane, the texture is stretched aswell. So you have A C well stretched. So you have to adjust both planes in the UV Editor so they will the gap there aswell.

[Meatball0311 79]

I will try and see if I can figure it out... basically I copied my original model and selected File>new and pasted. Now I am subtracting points and making a new antenna (squared). When I finish subtracting points... what do I do next

---------- Post added at 09:42 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:24 AM ----------

so I need 3 seperate files? one for each LOD?

and 3 seperate UV Mappings?

---------- Post added at 10:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:42 AM ----------

I think I am understanding now.. I looked at the BI model of the M16 and it makes sense now.... will get back to you when I am done with the LOD's

[Meatball0311 79]

I finished my Resolution LOD's and need to now make shadow and geo LOD's. Can you explain how I will make these? or show me where I can find info on how to do them.

Thanks

[[aps]gnat 28]

In simple terms;

Imagine your Resolution lod is a cube, 6 faces.

- Make a copy of it into a Shadow Lod

- Inverse the faces (w key)

- Triangulate all Faces (no 4 sided faces allowed) (Use teh \ or / key)

- Sharpen ALL edges (U key)

- No need for textures, remove all texture definitions

- Check all geometry is closed (Structure -> Topology -> Find Non-Closed)

- Check all geometry is Convexed (Structure -> Convexity -> Find non-Convexities)

Once all this cleared up, should work.

Couple of notes

- The faces of the shadow lod need to be close to the same position as resolution lod otherwise you can get a "self-shadow" darkening problem.

- If your resolution lod shape is complicated its likely to fail the Convexity test. If thats the case you may have to break your shadow lod into a series of separate shapes instead of 1 or 2 main shapes.

- And I'm pretty sure double sided faces cause issues also

Edited May 13, 2010 by [APS]Gnat
Error about Convexities

[DaSquade 0]

Gnat;1626250']In simple terms;

Imagine your Resolution lod is a cube' date=' 6 faces.

- Make a copy of it into a Shadow Lod

[b']- Inverse the faces (w key)[/b]

- Triangulate all Faces (no 4 sided faces allowed) (Use teh \ or / key)

- Sharpen ALL edges (U key)

- No need for textures, remove all texture definitions

- Check all geometry is closed (Structure -> Topology -> Find Non-Closed)

- Check all geometry is Convexed (Structure -> Convexity -> Find non-Convexities)

Once all this cleared up, should work.

Couple of notes

- The faces of the shadow lod need to be close to the same position as resolution lod otherwise you can get a "self-shadow" darkening problem.

- If your resolution lod shape is complicated its likely to fail the Convexity test. If thats the case you may have to break your shadow lod into a series of separate shapes instead of 1 or 2 main shapes.

- And I'm pretty sure double sided faces cause issues also

Maybe it is me, but why the need of inversing certain objects?

From my experience, i never had to do that. It might help in some case (so i heard and noticed). But personally i avoid it at all cost and only had to use it once as it had better result (versus higher count 'normal' shadow object). As long as the object is closed and doesn't clip the resolution object i have never encountered problems.

Feel free to prove why. We are never too old to learn... :).

Also for shadow lod geo i don't think one has to worry about the convexed geometry check. That is only needed in the geometry and fire lod, maybe also on the view geometry lods.

Edited May 12, 2010 by DaSquade

[STALKERGB 6]

Maybe it is me, but why the need of inversing certain objects?

From my experience, i never had to do that. It might help in some case (so i heard and noticed). But personally i avoid it at all cost and only had to use it once as it had better result (versus higher count 'normal' shadow object). As long as the object is closed and doesn't clip the resolution object i have never encountered problems.

Feel free to prove why. We are never too old to learn... :).

Also for shadow lod geo i don't think one has to worry about the convexed geometry check. That is only needed in the geometry and fire lod, maybe also on the view geometry lods.

Like you said, I think inverting the Shadow LOD stops it casting on itself if there if some clipping. So like a helmet in a shadow LOD wont cast on the helmet on the actual model. I think this only really helps if the shodow LOD doesnt quite "fit" the model, so made too big or different shape. Past that I don't think it does anything special. I dont think the actual end result differs much if the Shadow LOD has been done well though.

For the shadow LOD, does it have to all have sharp edges? I'm sure I remember having a part of mine with soft edges but didn't notice any difference (maybe rpt error?).

[[aps]gnat 28]

... for shadow lod geo i don't think one has to worry about the convexed geometry check. That is only needed in the geometry and fire lod, maybe also on the view geometry lods.

Duh, I had a brain fart. Corrected.

@STALKERGB

Arh, that may explain why some of my (old) models have self shadow problems. I've only tended to invert faces in recent years.

As for sharp edges ...... I felt sure you had too.

[Meatball0311 79]

Thank you all for the explanations it will definitely help out. I have decided to start all over again... so I deleted everything and am remodeling my radio. I am at the point that I am closing up all the faces and I am running into some that are seeming impossible to close. When it comes to open faces... does every single face have to be closed?

*** do I get a prize or something... this is my 500th post :)***

[[frl]myke 14]

Thank you all for the explanations it will definitely help out. I have decided to start all over again... so I deleted everything and am remodeling my radio. I am at the point that I am closing up all the faces and I am running into some that are seeming impossible to close. When it comes to open faces... does every single face have to be closed?

*** do I get a prize or something... this is my 500th post :)***

Welcome to the club. At the beginning i also discarded a lot of work just because in the meantime i've learned a lot new things so starting over had been easier than fixing the existing model.

Faces don't have to be closed in resolution LOD's. In fact, you can delete faces that can't be seen anyway. Saves resource as the GPU doesn't have to check if the face is visible and should be rendered or not.

And sure you get a prize:

:D ;) :p

[Meatball0311 79]

Welcome to the club. At the beginning i also discarded a lot of work just because in the meantime i've learned a lot new things so starting over had been easier than fixing the existing model.

Faces don't have to be closed in resolution LOD's. In fact, you can delete faces that can't be seen anyway. Saves resource as the GPU doesn't have to check if the face is visible and should be rendered or not.

And sure you get a prize:

:D ;) :p

Wow that is the best prize anyone could ask for! ;)

You are right in the fact that I have learned a lot and it would be easier to just remodel based on the new info and practice I have been getting. Also it seems that the model is more accurate in size and looks a whole lot cleaner. I think I will be finished with the radio soon and will then go and make the lod's again. Will report back soon...

[STALKERGB 6]

@STALKERGB

Arh, that may explain why some of my (old) models have self shadow problems. I've only tended to invert faces in recent years.

As for sharp edges ...... I felt sure you had too.

Well I thought you needed to use sharp edges but I'm certain that in the past I used a soft edged helmet shadow, infact, I might test it now to see what happens lol maybe I'm going mad!

With the inverting to remove the self shadowing, I'm not sure exactly how it calculates what to not shadow but it seems to do a pretty good job.

EDIT: Tested with helmet having smooth edges and there didn't seem to be any problems in game, not sure if the rpt had anything to say about it though, tested unbinarized as well.

Edited May 13, 2010 by STALKERGB