missleading meaning of language for non-native

[vilas 477]

You don't ask somebody to have him make you avoid him.

???

e ???

and what about "don't get in my way"

for example someone lied to you, owns you money (debt), you had to collect debt using force, cause he had problems with giving back

and you say to him "walk such path to not get in my way"

what is strange in this ?

than "make me miss you" would be "if you ever see me, run , that i would not look at you and not notice you and feel stress looking at you"

it would be "missing" in sens as "i missed bus" "i missed friend, cause i haven't noticed him on street when i was waiting, it was big crowd"

???

or second sense

"i love you so much, but i can't cause i have wife - make me something that i would hate you and not want to see you again" ???

than "make me avoid you" is reason simple (maybe not to this lyrics, but to what you said)

for example : you love girl, she not likes 69, than you must do something to forget about her and change her for someone who like it

and you beg "do something to get you out of my heart cause i feel pain that i want you and i can't have you this way"

or opposite way - girl is religious but loves you and asks you (when you are anti-clerical) "do something, hit me, something to make me not want you anymore"

?

doesn't make sense ?

Edited March 10, 2010 by vilas

[celery 8]

Vilas, don't argue about the English language or speaking in general like you know better. These are simple matters of context and how things are said, and you can't apply the Polish language and assume the most elaborate and improbable translation to be correct. Accept the possibility that your dictionaries are shit.

P.S. Since we're talking about language here, you might want to use the SHIFT button a bit more when writing.

[vilas 477]

i don't argue

he said it doesn't make sense (the sentence) so i said how i see sense of sentence

cause i wanna understand sens of translation, not that someone is not asking for something (Deadfast)

cause lyrics, poem doesn't have to be rational

it is art, so someone can in art ask to wear blue socks when it's raining, it is not rational, it can be even like monthy python sentences of comedy, cause we talk about lyrics of musicians (in this example Metallica)

concerning dictionaries - now i know that "pathetic" in dictionary is wrong

but still i have doubts with "miss"

i have clarified "lie" "lie on/in/at" difference

but "miss me" is doubtful for me still , when i take under account "missed train" and "miss loving girl which is far away for week"

and Deadfast told about rational reasons of action (thats how i understand "something doesn't make sense")

not all in life must be rational which mostly you see when girl say that she want "delicate and brutal man, good and bad, cold and hot" , for me as engineer there cannot be + and -, hot and cold, good and bad, delicate or brutal at one time, cause i am rational and it is agains math or physics

but lyrics of song can say about feelings of someone , which not must be rational mathematic engineer mind to make sense

lyrics are about feelings, love, hate, pain, joy - about all , and i don't put them into "rational" box, cause i know many artists who have surrealistic lyrics , example Armia (Polish rock band which has lyrics like mess of words example "street of rattles, small girl, paper ticket, mystical support" ) if someone would like to translate Armia, he would be in serious mess :D

or the best example of all - religion - it is also irrational, cause ghosts and miracles are not proven by science, physics, math...

so when Deadfast said about lack of sens in "make someone to make you avoid you" it makes for me the same sense as "don't get into my way" "make me hate you cause i cannot love you"

i simply not understand sense of "than make me miss you" - which in my eyes would fit "make me feel pain cause i don't see you (at the moment i have enough of you)" and also "don't get into my way"

James Hetfield needed here :(

and native UK/US opinions (i am grateful for showing difference lie/lie on, pathetic)

Edited March 10, 2010 by vilas

[Deadfast 43]

so when Deadfast said about lack of sens in "make someone to make you avoid you" it makes for me the same sense as "don't get into my way"

Except this isn't the same thing.

You can miss somebody as in you haven't seen him for a long time or you can miss somebody as if you were to arrive just a few moments earlier you would have met.

"Make me miss you" as in "Make me arrive 5 minutes later so that we don't meet each other" just doesn't make sense.

[vilas 477]

miss [mÅ s]

vt

(train etc) spóźniać się (spóźnić się perf) na +acc

Daniel nearly missed his flight.

(target) nie trafiać (nie trafić perf) w +acc

The bombers missed their target.

(chance) tracić (stracić perf)

It was a good opportunity which it would be a pity to miss.

(meeting) opuszczać (opuścić perf)

I couldn't miss a departmental meeting.

(notice loss of) zauważać (zauważyć perf) brak +gen

He did not miss his wallet until he was on the plane.

(regret absence of) tęsknić za +instr

Did you miss me?

vi

chybiać (chybić perf), nie trafiać (nie trafić perf), pudłować (spudłować perf) inf

She threw her plate at his head and missed.

n

chybienie nt, pudło nt inf

We had a few near misses in the first raid.

you can't miss it nie można tego przeoczyć or nie zauważyć

the bus just missed the wall autobus omal nie wpadł na mur

you're missing the point nie rozumiesz istoty sprawy

------------------

if bombers miss target or i couldn't miss conference , than why "make me miss you" is not "don't get into my way" ? or if "missed wallet" than maybe "make yourself invisible" ??? "than make me miss you" < make you not notice by me ?

Edited March 10, 2010 by vilas

[Deadfast 43]

Vilas, you just can't take words out of their context and try to apply them for something else.

[vilas 477]

you say about context :

Hit dirt, shake tree

Split sky, part sea

Strip smile, lose cool

Bleed the day and break the rule

Live to win, dare to fail

Eat the dirt and bite the nail

Then make me miss you

Then make me miss you

So wash your face away with dirt

It don't feel good until it hurts

So take this world and shake it

Come squeeze and suck the day

Come carpe diem baby

Draw lead, piss wine

Sink teeth, all mine

Stoke fire, break neck

Suffer through this, cheat on death

Hug the curve, lose the time

Tear the map and shoot the sign

Then make me miss you

ou yeah

Then make me miss you

than what context it has ? in Polish we call it "bełkot" gibberish bla bla bla

there is no context in this gibberish

many Metallica texts are like this , i know it is "poetic" (i never was good at literature lessons and i never liked poets and poems , i like novels about facts )

so tell me what you see from this senseless context ?

for me this text make no sense opposite to for example this :

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/systemofadown/byob.html

System of a Down

http://www.darklyrics.com/lyrics/kreator/violentrevolution.html#12

Kreator

http://www.lyricstime.com/samael-slavocracy-lyrics.html

Samael

this text is concrete / has sense and context

Edited March 10, 2010 by vilas

[Deadfast 43]

The context I was talking about is the sentence itself.

(You) Make me miss you.

Neither of your other definitions can be screwed on top of this.

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

The lyrics quoted in the post #32 talk about a person that is not worthy of him/her, whoever wrote them.

YOU get through all the things I've been through, then we can talk, until then - you'll be ignored. It's rather obvious.

[nomdeplume 0]

"you made a lot of sorrow and bad to me, so make it so, to disappear from my thoughts, make me not see you again, cause you gave me so much things i suffer from" miss like "i missed the train"

This would be like saying "the bombers missed the orphanage" -- although technically correct, there's an inherent implication here that they were actually trying to damage or destroy the orphanage. So this phrase wouldn't be used; instead it would be something like "the bombers did not do any damage to the orphanage" - which implies the actual target was near the orphanage but that their delivery was accurate enough that no damage was done to this other building.

"Missing someone" implies you wish to be in their presence. "Missing the target" implies you wanted to hit the target. Your "missed the train" version is implying that the speaker intended to catch the train. Therefore, for the phrase "make me miss you" to be interpreted in this way would require that the speaker wanted to encounter the person. However, then it wouldn't make any sense to be telling them to stay out of their way. So this interpretation of the phrase "Make me miss you" is internally inconsistent: you can't "miss" something that you didn't want in the first place.

Simply put, a native English speaker wouldn't use the phrase in the way you're describing, as it's a non-obvious interpretation. Occam's Razor applies: the simplest interpretation tends to be the correct one.

[vilas 477]

thanx, now i understand :D that "miss" comes with intention to do something :) mega thanx :)

[Takko 10]

Cant you just go read a dictonary or ask in a language forums?

[vilas 477]

"go read dictionary"

if you were at least in some percent wise man (which you proven many times - you aren't ) you would notice that i asked cause dictionary was misleading and i given examples from dictionary which people corrected

bravo, IQ 0 and complete lack of ability to read with understanding