Intense missions

[afp 1]

I'm trying to edit simple MP missions let's say a a single objective (ex destroy bridge) and several patrols around it. I am concerned about AI and gameplay and I need some general guidelines to make it intense and fun to play.

- how strong the medium enemy should be in order not to kill you instant but still fun? Is it better to have all enemies medium strength or should be a combined army of "good" and "bad" enemies? What about the group size?

- how to separe enemy fire accuracy of reaction speed and "intelligence" so they look after and behave as natural is possible? High skilled enemies open fire too fast, I guess for a nice gameplay they should react fast but inaccurate.

- how the waypoints should be placed, some randomly placed waypoints covering the target area is good enough? What type? Or is it a better placement, like fixed positions around objective etc?

- How to make them observe you at long distances and what the apropriate action should be? Is there a way to control this? (Of course some should start hunting you, others take cover, some other open fire etc).

I guess people with lot of mission editing experience already been through this and can help or redirect to some other resources.. In the end it should be some intense mission, not easy neither one-shot-one-kill from enemy or looking at enemy running sideways... I guess I want something like "best practices" about mission editing... :)

Edited July 26, 2009 by afp

[Carpaazi 0]

1. If you mean with medium infantry, that you move the skill slider to halfway, that way they are fast and damn accurate, there is no skill that they would fire quickly and be inaccurate at the same time. The skill goes hand-on-hand with reaction speed & accuracy.

You should set the enemy skill with thought, like if your mission has unlimited respawns, hard enemy is a good choice, unless youre planning to put like 200 super soldiers around the map/objective that is. A mission with 1-death-game-over, you better use a bit "bad" enemies, but on the other hand you could use them alot and mix some better units (spetznatz) with them. Imagination is the limit, so there ain't any. Just remember that if players dies all the time because enemy is just too damn fast and accurate, its only frustrating if the mission is medium/long.

Patrols (2-5 men) is always good, some sentries, static...everyone has a different taste for things.

2. Im not sure,but i think there is some sort of script that makes enemy soldiers fire spread more, so they don't instantly hit a headshot from 400m away.

3. Patrol: I would use MOVE waypoints with some pretty large random areas

Attack: Seek & destroy ofc =)

etc

4. There is some script(s) for the enemy to start "hunting", but its in game too.

Example: You shoot a patrol from 500m away, leave your spot, the enemy will advance to the place you shot them from, either if they see you, or they just go to your last know position (the position you shot them from, kinda following the gun shots)

Its really hard starting to suggest HOW you should make your mission =D. Some of us likes very hard battles (but those always require very good teamwork), some medium (still hard if you dont pay attention well, and still requires players to be active teamworkers), and easier but prehaps more fun battles ( lots of enemies and s#&t and things to blow up xD)

[jakerod 254]

About Patrolling:

I usually give the men that are patrolling two or three move waypoints and then a cycle one. I also add some random placement to the move waypoints. I either make another move waypoint after the cycle or a guard waypoint with behavior aware or combat and also full speed.

I then sync the cycle to a "Switch" trigger that is activated by detecting the enemies. The move or guard waypoint after the cycle waypoint normally goes to some sort of cover so they will try to find some place to hide. The guard waypoint, if you don't know, will make them respond to any enemies seen and then move towards them.

[afp 1]

Thanks for your answer so far. In my first MP mission we found in position of being able able to snipe most of the enemies from long distance with ACOGs without real reaction, so I realized that things are more complicated than putting enemies on the map.

I noticed indeed that the "guard" waypoint seems to be the best from reaction point of view, if you go undercover they go to your last position unlike others waypoints when they stay still.

Can't figure out yet how the soldier type influence this, well most of the team leaders have binoculars and they use it.

Also weapon seems to influence it a lot, if they have optics they engage you from longer distances.

Jakerod's idea of triggering going under cover when detecting enemies is very good indeed. I'm thinking of putting 5-6 random "MOVE" waypoints around the objective and switch to a "GUARD" waypoint undercover when enemy detected.

Also the combined team may perform well... 1-2 snipers along with the others so they engage at long distances. Or maybe some snipers team in hold / sentry waypoint so they don't leave the objective too much and engage from far away...

Edited July 27, 2009 by afp

[Starlight 10]

The Urban Patrol Script UPS is great for some of the stuff you are talking about, automatically created random patrol routes for any units assigned to the marker zone.

See -kronzky's ups script

[afp 1]

Yes, that script is nice however I want to know what can be done first without any external overhead. It seems that the Jakerod method performs best, I managed to reproduce it, once they see you they break the patrol and engage, if you go undercover they come to the last position after you. With some other "seek and destroy" units, may be just perfect.

See how is done bellow:

Normally, the unit patrols between WP1, WP2 and WP3 with the help of WP4 CYCLE waypoint.

Once detected by the trigger, he breaks patrol route and run towards WP GUARD waypoint (undercover). If you went undercover too in the meantime, he will leave and go after you in last seen position. Without this method they will keep patrolling or remain still which is kinda unnatural, once the enemy is detected they should try to destroy it.

Edited July 27, 2009 by afp

[Starlight 10]

This is why I love the UPD script, you can set the behaviour for each Patrol unit to either as standard to chase enemy when spotted, or to not follow outside of their patrol zone. So if they are guarding a high value asset they will not leave their zone to chase you.

Also the AI should utilize any cover they have nearby or go prone should none be available.

You only need a marker covering the patrol area and a single call script in the patrol units init box as

nul=[this,"town"] execVM "ups.sqf"

You then do not need any of the waypoints or the trigger!, just the patrol unit and a marker zone

[jw custom 56]

This is why I love the UPD script, you can set the behaviour for each Patrol unit to either as standard to chase enemy when spotted, or to not follow outside of their patrol zone. So if they are guarding a high value asset they will not leave their zone to chase you.

Also the AI should utilize any cover they have nearby or go prone should none be available.

You only need a marker covering the patrol area and a single call script in the patrol units init box as

nul=[this,"town"] execVM "ups.sqf"

You then do not need any of the waypoints or the trigger!, just the patrol unit and a marker zone

Yes 'UPS' and 'Random House Patrol' is great scripts and even better in combination with "Probability of Presence" and "Placement radius". It's really cool to have units in houses and on buildings :cool:

[NorthStar 10]

Enemy group sizes should depend on the number of players you plan to support in the mission. If it's for 4 or fewer, I wouldn't have any full strength infantry squads running around. A rule of thumb might be to make groups of at most 2x the number of players.

Regarding the enemy accuracy, this needs to be set in the .ArmAProfile on the server who is hosting the mission. The variable you want to set is "precisionEnemy."

UPS is good for small-scale stuff but in large cities with a lot of AI using it it's extremely taxing on all machines, especially the host. A quick and easy alternative is to place the patrolling squad at roughly the center of your desired patrol area, give them a "seek and destroy" waypoint at the same location with speed "limited" and behavior "safe," followed by a "cycle" waypoint at the same location. This will make them slowly patrol that area indefinitely, engaging enemies as they see them. Hope this helps.

[afp 1]

UPS is good for small-scale stuff but in large cities with a lot of AI using it it's extremely taxing on all machines, especially the host. A quick and easy alternative is to place the patrolling squad at roughly the center of your desired patrol area, give them a "seek and destroy" waypoint at the same location with speed "limited" and behavior "safe," followed by a "cycle" waypoint at the same location. This will make them slowly patrol that area indefinitely, engaging enemies as they see them. Hope this helps.

Seek-and-destroy looks fine, as far as I could notice they patrol around the waypoint and they try to flank the enemy once spotted. Only thing that bother me is that after they spotted the enemy, some of them still move randomly neither spotting or flanking the enemy...

It a good solution on a fixed small area anyway.

[kylania 568]

Remember, the Seek and Destroy waypoints have a range limit. If on foot the group leader will search all positions within approx 50m of the waypoint. If say in a vehicle, perhaps 300m. So make sure your S&D waypoints at where you want them to attack.

[afp 1]

I have checked the internals of UPS mod, it brings a lot in sharing information about enemies and spotting them but I think it is not necessary in case of a good mission design. So I guess if you are not an experienced mission designer you better use it.

I was wondering how the information about enemy is shared among groups, I mean when an enemy is spotted by a member of a group, all its members knows about this instant? How about other groups? In case of a "Seek and Destroy" patrol if the attack fails and they retreat, the patrol will keep chasing after 50 m (I'm lazy to test this :))

Edited July 29, 2009 by afp

[nomdeplume 0]

If you haven't already, you should read about the waypoint types in the wiki. Some of them work a bit different to what you might expect just from their names.

The sentry one in particular might be useful for you. It makes them stay at the sentry location until they detect an enemy, and then proceed with their next waypoints. So if you know your players will always come from a particular location, you can use this to have groups start moving towards them once they're detected.

Guard can also be used in interesting ways.

Dismissed seems a lot like Sentry, except they will wander around (sometimes quite far, which is annoying) and sit down and so on. Can be useful for non-critical groups that you want to have just hanging out. The distances they can wander can give you quite variable results though - which can be good or bad.