Few questions relating Arma 2 being on consoles

[maxter 10]

Of course I would be no less than damn sad if it turns out the PC version is greatly simplified just because the limitations of the XBOX controls, or any other limitations for that matter. I just don't think the risk of that is very high with ArmA2, XBOX-version or not.

I just hope I'll not have to eat my words later. :)

[Raphier 0]

Hi all

Developing for consoles improves what we get on PC.

Kind Regards walker

Actually...it's the other way around....

Because Videogames improve from content that's been on PC's by years already. PC's has better hardwares and technologies and thus they make the first step in these areas, like procedural coding, new lighting methods, cel-shading, server list, Dedicated servers,streaming.

Just now have console's gotten stuff like patching, DLC and data streaming.

and only now, by a little margin, consoles are getting map editors now.

who knows in the future, you install all your games on hard-drive or stream games via net, install mods and have Anti-aliasing with deferred lighting or completelly get rid of that technology in favor of faster HDR and play MMO games.

All technologies are founded on PC's (well, console games are made on PC's anyway), improved on PC's and just used on consoles.

[walker 0]

Hi all

The problem with pure PC platform development is that it leads to bloatware and unoptimised code.

Restrict what resources a programmer has and they will come up with new innovative solutions to get round it; and be more careful with their code. They also get that external audit of their software and beta test programs and systems as part of the package.

Developing for consoles improves what we get on PC.

Kind Regards walker

Hi all

Interesting seeing people using the media trick of taking quotes out of context to create a straw-man argument.

So I quote my whole text above

Raphier

Actually...it's the other way around....

Because Videogames improve from content that's been on PC's by years already...etc.

See Raphier's whole post above to get context

Not what I am saying; read my post not the out of context quote: I am not denying PC games improve Console games, since console games and all hardware are developed on a PC first, such an argument would be stupid. Implying I am arguing that PCs do not improve Consoles is thus a Straw-man Argument.

-=[Rocco]=-'s post giving examples of bad cases was adequately dealt with by Maddmatt, maxter and others but I would add that BIS's OFP Elite proves they can produce good quality console games without damage to their PC platform.

No one has yet dealt with this aspect of my post

The problem with pure PC platform development is that it leads to bloatware and unoptimised code.

Added bold for key point

What I am getting at is that developing for the console forces you to make optimised code.

Nor has anyone dealt with this

They also get that external audit of their software and beta test programs and systems as part of the package.

That external audit is a massive milestone and a formal fresh pair of eyes spotting bugs.

Yes there are PC based bug finding and audit software, in fact the Console versions are often PC based but there is no external milestone in PC development that you are forced to submit to. It is like the difference between IEEE and an industry agreement. One is an external international standard reached through an open peer review process the other is a bunch of profit making firms seeking to control the standards they have to live up to. Which do you trust?

Oh and yes I know industries try to abuse and influence IEEE standards to exclude market entrants ;)

The whole question of why; some cliques involved in console development, both within console makers and game publisher, seek to prevent User created content is at the heart of the standards debate. Some backward publishers in particular do not want user created content as they want the user to get bored with the game so they will buy the next title.

A note to BIS and particular Marek

The more advanced publishers and developers realise user created content is the future of development. I am glad to say BIS is one of those, though sadly they have not taken the next step of creating a route for the MOD teams to create content professionally.

Are you reading this Marek? When are you going to realise that BIS are a Simulation Engine Developer :confused: and not just a game developer? Yes I can see the need to develop some thing artistic to feed the soul and I am not saying BIS should not do that.

What I am saying is this:

There is a potential gold rush with Real Virtuality Engine MOD development, if only BIS would realise the real money is not in panning for gold but in selling, leasing, and taking a percentage for the shovels and pans? :j:

Look at what happened to those who did that with the quake engine and the unreal engine.

Kind regards walker

Edited April 14, 2009 by walker
Spelling and grammar and one heading

[SaBrE_UK 0]

I think BI have probably looked at the markets and thought of possible financial enterprises. My guess is they've settled on the military stuff which gives them good money, and want to do games for the fun as well as the money. Seems reasonable enough to me.

[Rocco 0]

It's not the console's fault those developers were unable to develop the games properly. See the many other examples where the games came out fine :rolleyes:

What i´m trying to say is, that if people keep pirating games and keep buying consoles instead of highend PCs, we won´t see quality games or ports for PCs, because it´s too expensive or not lucrative enough to develop games for the PC anymore. So if people get fooled by MS marketing (old hardware in the xbox and extra fee for playing online) and keep buying their xbox and if developers take the money, which MS (Games for Windows banner anyone?) blows them up their , we wont see many high quality game products for PC sooner or later.

[walker 0]

=-;1270083']which MS (Games for Windows banner anyone?) blows them up their ' date=' we wont see many high quality game products for PC sooner or later.[/quote']

Hi all

-=[Rocco]=- I think you make a good point. It comes back to the IEEE versus an industry agreement argument I mentioned. It is about impeding market entrants and controlling the market.

In essence it can be anti competitive. The question is to what degree are academic researchers and parties interested in competition allowed to influence the standard.

When standards appear there is always a whole bunch of conflicting stake holders.

Knowing about there use as a tool to impede market entrants it follows that if you are not included in the production or maintenance of the standard you obviously fall into the category of those excluded.

So if you want to influence the Games for Windows banner you need to be involved in influencing its implementation.

Kind regards walker

[Steakslim 1]

Walker thank you for posting your whole quote, as I'll admit I didn't catch the whole thing so I apologize. I do stand on my point about games revolving around consoles causing a bit of stagnation in the technologies around the developement of games.

[Rocco 0]

Hi all

-=[Rocco]=- I think you make a good point. It comes back to the IEEE versus an industry agreement argument I mentioned. It is about impeding market entrants and controlling the market.

In essence it can be anti competitive. The question is to what degree are academic researchers and parties interested in competition allowed to influence the standard.

When standards appear there is always a whole bunch of conflicting stake holders.

Knowing about there use as a tool to impede market entrants it follows that if you are not included in the production or maintenance of the standard you obviously fall into the category of those excluded.

So if you want to influence the Games for Windows banner you need to be involved in influencing its implementation.

Kind regards walker

Exactly what i want to express, but i´m obviously unable to express it like you can because english is not my native language. I´m working for a big gaming company and the influence MS has is ridiculous, wish i could say more, but cant for obvious reasons...

[kiesthegrunt 10]

Seeing that video was a huge relief,there was a lot of discussions and rumors going around indicating that Bohemia hadn't even planned a 360 version. They have me sold now,I don't have too much of a problem with the delay either.

[Blackbird1967 10]

niice thanks for the info dudes