Helicopter yaw, FM in general

[niktator 10]

Hi,

I really wonder if the FM of the helicopters will get some work in the close future. I`m checking dev changelog like daily - waiting for some FM improvement.

The yaw function is like not working at all when left the state of hover. Especially on copters with guns it is mandatory to be able to yaw up to high speeds.

In Arma3 all helis behave like a plane aready at very low speeds. This should be fixed asap, I think.

Actually the FM of all helis should be tweaked into more realistic physics. since arma3 claims to be simulation and small children are not allowed to play it - there is no need that a 5 yo girl can fly copters.

[bravo 6 0]

Hello,

sorry for my ignorance, but what do you mean by FM? Can you please clarify or add more info on this?

I agree to any chopper improvement including the cockpit pedal and throttle/collective animations already requested here :)

[EDcase 87]

FM = Flight Model: How the helicopter behaves according to physical flight characteristics. ie. if it flies arcadey or realistically.

Currently ARMA3 is somewhere in the middle but closer to arcade than sim.

I would also LOVE to have TakeOnHelicopters FM as a difficulty option.

Animated pedals etc. not so important for me.

Edited November 6, 2013 by EDcase

[swiftn7 1]

The tail rotors main funtion is to produce anti-torque to the main rotor to prevent the fuselage from spinning around. It is not supposed to deliver a turn function on speeds above ~50knots, because the flight dynamics are equally to an airplane when exceeding that speed. However you can support the turn flight with the tail rotor on higher speeds, otherwise you would overstress the machine.

[niktator 10]

The tail rotors main funtion is to produce anti-torque to the main rotor to prevent the fuselage from spinning around.

you don`t say...

It is not supposed to deliver a turn function on speeds above ~50knots, because the flight dynamics are equally to an airplane when exceeding that speed. However you can support the turn flight with the tail rotor on higher speeds, otherwise you would overstress the machine.

Well, talking about modern copters, this is just wrong.

@100 kts:

here some more precise numbers:

http://youtu.be/TOnSGyeSvsk?t=2m32s

nice video including the snap and flying backwards:

Even the old lil birds can yaw way better then the FM in arma3 offers.

It`s not like I need to understand what the tail rotor is beeing used for - i`m asking for more realistic FM.

[EDcase 87]

Well, talking about modern copters, this is just wrong.

@100 kts:

here some more precise numbers:

http://youtu.be/TOnSGyeSvsk?t=2m32s

nice video including the snap and flying backwards:

Even the old lil birds can yaw way better then the FM in arma3 offers.

It`s not like I need to understand what the tail rotor is beeing used for - i`m asking for more realistic FM.

The Commanche was/is the ONLY helicopter in the world that could fly sideways or backwards that fast.

The tail rotor effect for the other copters in the game feel correct.

[niktator 10]

Well I`m only a fixed wing pilot in RL, but I was flying ecuril and md500 in RL (with instructor) - and I would state at any time, that the yaw functionallity was WAY higher then it is implemented in arma3.

I`m not asking for 90° at 100kts in less then 2 seconds. but a lil more realistic FM in general would feel good - and correct.

[EDcase 87]

Perhaps you can ask the instructor the max speed for latteral flight in those aircraft.

I've only flown an R22 :(

[swiftn7 1]

you don`t say...

Well, talking about modern copters, this is just wrong.

@100 kts:

here some more precise numbers:

http://youtu.be/TOnSGyeSvsk?t=2m32s

nice video including the snap and flying backwards:

Even the old lil birds can yaw way better then the FM in arma3 offers.

It`s not like I need to understand what the tail rotor is beeing used for - i`m asking for more realistic FM.

No need to use some pseudo-cool internet slang on me! From where could i know that you are experienced in real-life flight topic?! To me it just sounded like you had no clue WHY the helos behave like that... sorry i tried to help...

[timmo1982 10]

I think there could be a bit more tail rotor authority....but remembering that as airspeed increases, the 'weather vaning' effect of the body also reduces tail rotor effectiveness so, as noted, turns are mostly made with left right cyclic and supported with the torque pedals.

Perhaps the OP could change his technique? i.e. flying circular orbits around the target to keep guns on rather than trying to fly sideways....that has the added benefit of being a moving target and having more forward speed to get out of an area faster if stuff begins to turn nasty.

[nuxil 2]

The Commanche was/is the ONLY helicopter in the world that could fly sideways or backwards that fast.

The tail rotor effect for the other copters in the game feel correct.

Ka50/52 ???

the fm in arma just sucks. not sim based at all. its aradish to the bone.

but hey, we can atleast fly sideways :p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdSgTb5-Dg8&feature=youtu.be

[zepplin139 10]

Not sure if this is the place to post but i cant start a thread myself.

Anyway, I have an issue with arma where i have a slight left rudder issue. The rudder is always applied and this problem just started. I have an x-52 and have re-installed every driver, re mapped and have tested in other games and i oly get this issue within arma 3. This leads me to believe it is a problem within the game.

I reset the ingame calibration to the default arma 3 settings and what happens is when i turn of the deadzone on the z-axis(x52 rudder) the problem is there and when i turn it up, it goes away. Its starting to frustrate me and if anyone can help i would really appreciate it.

[mobile_medic 43]

I find the lack of rudder input to be very non-helicopter like.

For example, when you pitch down and roll right, you should be able to kick in right rudder and the nose should readily move in the direction of your turn to bring it around quickly.

As stated, anything above a hover, is more like a jet, than a helicopter. The lack of proper rudder input has long frustrated me. Just b/c your rudder becomes less functional at higher speeds does not mean it becomes completely useless and inactive. Rudder is essential for good, helicopter like, flight when pitching and rolling. In arma, it is non-existent. being able to fly at a steep bank and the nose just stays at a line is not realistic. the weight is going to cause the nose to dip in the direction of the bank. In arma, this doesn't happen.

It also seems much easier to gain altitude than to lose it in A3. That you can *still* roll the helicopter, even at low/no-speed and low altitude is something that should have been fixed long ago, imo.

Overall, the helicopter flight dynamic is more like a jet that can hover, than it is an actual helicopter. This is most evident with the lack of proper rudder input once you move out of a hover.

[ratszo 17]

How do you find the little-bird, since it's the lightest?

And what speed are you talking for the heavies?

---------- Post added at 07:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:01 PM ----------

Also, you using a stick, pedals?

[progamer 14]

I find the lack of rudder input to be very non-helicopter like.

For example, when you pitch down and roll right, you should be able to kick in right rudder and the nose should readily move in the direction of your turn to bring it around quickly.

As stated, anything above a hover, is more like a jet, than a helicopter. The lack of proper rudder input has long frustrated me. Just b/c your rudder becomes less functional at higher speeds does not mean it becomes completely useless and inactive. Rudder is essential for good, helicopter like, flight when pitching and rolling. In arma, it is non-existent. being able to fly at a steep bank and the nose just stays at a line is not realistic. the weight is going to cause the nose to dip in the direction of the bank. In arma, this doesn't happen.

It also seems much easier to gain altitude than to lose it in A3. That you can *still* roll the helicopter, even at low/no-speed and low altitude is something that should have been fixed long ago, imo.

Overall, the helicopter flight dynamic is more like a jet that can hover, than it is an actual helicopter. This is most evident with the lack of proper rudder input once you move out of a hover.

Yea, hopefully we can get JSBsim in the game. Then we can have a flight model as realistic to our hearts content.