Photoshop and other Adobe products moving to subsription model.

[ProfTournesol 956]

Element isn't that expensive.

[mrcash2009 0]

If anything this helps promotes lesser known (in terms of the usual select few) of things like gimp and so on. More power to the independents to fill a void and opportunity this might bring for those getting sick of the requirement needed to get the job done. Plus anything flying the flag for the name "GIMP" gets my vote :) "Zeds dead baby, zeds dead".

[kavoven 4]

I used the free CS2 giveaway a few months ago for Photoshop - than it stopped working for me and I discovered that I can do everything I need with Paint.net :)

[mrcash2009 0]

Yeh true, if I think about the things I "need" to do within photoshop I can bet I skim past allot of features and GIMP and other software probably do just as much that's needed. The rest is just the "industry standard" in regards to platforms formats that agencies are required to have and share for work projects on so on.

Its very similar in the music industry and music software, you have the big boys that are industry set for schools/music colleges/uni ... main studios, then the spin off packages that do more than enough that may get looked down upon by industry.

Maybe in the end this is a good thing, becuase if it creates a split and makes a void it leaved room for newer things to flourish.

For me one classic adobe example was Cool Edit Pro by Syntrillium, I used that back then like many use Audacity now. Then Adobe took it over as Adobe Audition and as much as its been updated and GUI changed etc its now sucked into the package model or at least will do. In the end I probably use a small fraction of it and even though I dont use Audacity I will now probably switch to it. I imagine folk will do similar now in terms of other adobe packages and alternatives.

Edited May 11, 2013 by mrcash2009

[vilas 473]

the things that we need photoshop in addonmaking are (imo) following:

- nohq plugin,

- alpha channel (glass, windows) tex,

apart from it i do all in old oem of one Corel version like 9 or GIMP

[PuFu 4591]

what do i think ? i think that they will loose more than gain, cause hackers will break security and hacked version will work without limits, and their sales will go down, cause noone will accept "monthly fees" for usage (like tram ticket, urban card ?) in software,

the more "security" in software, the more piracy, cause legal user should get EASY one-click install product which do not require more actions than "instal", if they want fees control, other options terminating software each month - this will be rejected by customers also cause "you must give order to your accountant in your company" to pay it, it makes more beaurocracy in companies etc. for big company with many copies it means big costs plus big beaurocracy in accountance (and more duties in accountancy every month one invoice more etc)

hackers will break it anyway and torrented version will work constantly

greed of software companies always calls piracy reaction, noone in poor countries would than buy single copy if he has to pay every month, people rather (if forced by legal actions against piracy) go to the freeware

people pay for product ONCE and monthly usage payment is f* idea, which will only make enemies to Adobe

when it comes to addons - photoshop is neccesary for 2 reasons - alpha channel, nohq plugin,

if other software was making it good, there would be no reason to touch photoshop

While i not agree with this practice as a whole, you are again, wrong, because you only see it from your perspective

If you were to think who is adobe target audience, and what they have to gain from this, you would think about it a bit differently.

Adobe is, with at least 3 flagship products (PS, AI and AE), leader in its segment. That is a reason why there are so many plug-ins, filters and so forth for it. The main audience, and the once that buy their software on a regular basis are businesses and small and big companies, with a very small fraction being individuals (even though bigger than with other software out there due to it being so well known).

At the office i work (and i am an associated partner btw), we choose to pay a monthly fee for 3 seats (that is 150$/month) in order to have access to all of the products adobe provides, rather than buy on the spot 3 packages that would cost us about 6000Eus from the get go. For any small profitable company in this sector, 150$/month should be penny money, no matter if that was in poland or denmark.

Plus, we will have all the software upgrades without needing to pay for yet another 3 seats each year. That said, Autodesk has the same subscription for a while now, and from a financial pov, it is still the best thing one company, or even individual person could choose to do in order to receive all the software annual upgrades without having to fork 3-4 times the price of the subscription for such an upgrade.

noone who is sane in this world will be using things which are difficult to use (you must remember about invoicing etc.)

people will simply took version from torrent and show middle finger into direction of Adobe

You are obviously living in your own world. Companies (again the main target for adobe) will never think about using torrents.

first thing that should happen is equalize earning (salaries) to level that people can buy software

in some rich countries of the world (Sweden, Norway, Germany, USA, Canada, New Zealand, Finland... ) it is easy, but in rest of our globe, such software costs more than you can save during year ( it costs as much as monthly salary or more, to save it we would not have to eat)

You have a recurring subject, while obviously shows some frustration. I told you before, leave it go.

Oh, and btw, who is to equalize salaries? Adobe? Oh, btw, i have a few friends working for adobe's local filial here, and they earn more or less the same salary as in *insert whatever western country here*

if companies want to have more incomes, they should ... lower prices, it sounds weird ?

what is better ? to sell 10 000 copies for 50 dollars or sell 0 copies for 1000 dollars ? ;)

10000*50 = half milion

1000*0 = ... zero ? omg :D

Don't worry for huge ass companies such as adobe, autodesk, etc. They have such a huge number of companies using their software that they will hardly ever go below the profit margin, even though the piracy for this software is pretty high (almost exclusively between individual users.)

Polish, Belarusian, Bulgarian, Romanian salaries are as 300 euro, 400 euro, some times 500 euro per month, how can people buy anything legal ?

no one i know working in the digital creative bussines that would require Adobe or 3d software package earns that low. And i know a lot of people in this industry, mainly because i also work in such a business?

We talking here about bartenders or shop keepers earning low and not affording professional grade software, or creative artists? You seem to be confused.

more rant

listen, please take this...elsewhere.

for someone soft is 5% of his monthly income, for others it is 110% but all love music, games, all must learn AutoCad to graduate studies etc.

you can get autodesk software for free via their students program. You can get msdn account in most universities as well.

maybe in rich countries , i know lot of people that want to be honest but cannot due to economy of their country

anyway - this way of Adobe is sucking money from those who MUST have it (companies as said above) and now maybe it sound stupid that one accountant has to make one invoice, but 1000 companies means 1000 hours of accountants more globally plus when bank transfer is lost than what ? client looses ability to start software ?

There are always free alternatives for the occasional content creators (and addon makers that do not earn their living off doing content fit right here). There are a huge number of software out there, not all costs an arm and a leg, including free ones, such as gimp and blender. You are doing work for free, then use free software. You are earning (in most cases decent money) from content, and you have choosen to also do some addons here and there? Then most will use their paid professional software.

Edited May 11, 2013 by PuFu

[[frl]myke 14]

the things that we need photoshop in addonmaking are (imo) following:

- nohq plugin,

- alpha channel (glass, windows) tex,

apart from it i do all in old oem of one Corel version like 9 or GIMP

GIMP has nohq plugin aswell (normalmap plugin) and can handle alpha channels by default.

[Messiah 2]

What Pufu said, you're hardly the target audience for Adobe - I'm more than sure that they're well aware that their products are pirated by casuals, students and other random elements of society. It stands to their favour at any rate, as their product becomes 'the' product in various industries, the product that employees expect to use, and are literate in, and broad, multi seat commercial licences are where the money is for them.

This is also why student licences exist. They're not being kind to poverty striken students, they're ensuring that their product is the industry standard - That is, at least, how it's worked within my industry for the better part of two decades now, and new offerings are very few and far between because of the market and/or literacy dominance of the same names.

Companies (again the main target for adobe) will never think about using torrents.

Well, not torrents perhaps, but a few names in the industry have been caught/raided over allegations, but mosty due to the incorrect number of licences. At one office I worked at, it was quite common for Rhino licences to be in short supply, but a simple workaround was common knowledge throughout the office. That's not the company at fault though, more so the employees (even though we continually highlighted the lack of licences to them)

At any rate, I welcome the new model, it make sense for what I do, and keeps me updated with the latest offerings on the fly, rather than a huge, costly update every other year. It also lets me pick and choose, and reasonable(ish) prices, which I like.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Messiah

[Headclot 10]

I am still using my CS5 Student version and I have no intention of upgrading especially since this whole subscription based thing adobe wants to do.

Looks like I will be using Paint Shop Pro or Anime Studio 9. More than Likely Paint Shop Pro :)

[vilas 473]

than returning question - what percentage of graphicians in your countries work as one-man company, self-employment ?

cause you say i am hardly target, hm... in my country majority of graphicians work as one-man self-employment company "dzialalnosc gospodarcza" (like photographers), they do not work in 1000 person company, they work as one-man companies, so all costs are for one man, not for 1000 people company

regarding student licenses, most of them afaik, are age-limited, in my country for example bus-student price is untill you are 26, over 26 you are student but not "student" , and the same with student licenses, age 27 and over

also on such license you cannot work with that software and make any commercial stuff - cause it brakes license

Edited May 13, 2013 by vilas

[PuFu 4591]

than returning question - what percentage of graphicians in your countries work as one-man company, self-employment ?

cause you say i am hardly target, hm... in my country majority of graphicians work as one-man self-employment company "dzialalnosc gospodarcza" (like photographers), they do not work in 1000 person company, they work as one-man companies, so all costs are for one man, not for 1000 people company

i know a lot that work in studios and advertising companies, but yes, abou 50% work indeed self-employed. That said, teh average price/hour in this industry is around 10-20EUs for simple 2D stuff, and towards 40EUs/hour for compositing and other stuff. I have friends that are self-employed and are pushing 350-400EUs/day (c4d/max/maya + AE), and all of them are adobe subscribers.

regarding student licenses, most of them afaik, are age-limited, in my country for example bus-student price is untill you are 26, over 26 you are student but not "student" , and the same with student licenses, age 27 and over

also on such license you cannot work with that software and make any commercial stuff - cause it brakes license

it depends on EULA. some companies have also educational licenses. I haven't read adsk eula recently anyways

regarding commercial work, of course it would break the license, but this being a topic that covers addon creation, that is commercial free, this students/edu version still stands

[vilas 473]

i wanna move to such company in which i will earn in one day that amount of money that i earn here by month (someone offered me a work 200 dollars per month for creating content to one game which is in early stage of development, other company offered 5 euro per hour to my friend who is also moder from Arma :/ )

i posted many advertisments on Gumtree but i didn't had any answers except few Arabs offering me being "money consultant and invest 1000 dollars in upcoming stocks"

Edited May 14, 2013 by vilas