Osprey VTOL STOL

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Guys you do realize the AV8B-II Harrier can't do VTOL right? It's a STOL aircraft.

[frederf 0]

F-35B should have the GEAR lit when they are OUT. Just like the flaps. I get confused and think they are out when its lit up lol.

Sorry for small OT.

I believe how BIS did it is correct. The warning light should be lit when the gear is up... because landing with gear up is a bad, bad thing. The light extinguishes when the gear is down because that's safe. Admittedly the light shouldn't be the color green, but probably amber or red. It should also say "Gear Up" instead of "Gear."

Guys you do realize the AV8B-II Harrier can't do VTOL right? It's a STOL aircraft.

There are a few Harrier pilots that might have a word to say about that, especially the Landing part of Vertical Take Off and Landing. Under combat loads it's very common and perhaps necessary to take off from a short run for fuel and safety reasons but returning to a tiny flight deck without arresting cables with your bombs dropped and your fuel much depleted... yeah you better believe you're doing a vertical landing.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Yes Harriers can do vertical landing but not so much liftoff.

[CplBlakeman 10]

Never seen a harrier II take off with full load and I dont believe they can. As far as landing vertically, it is harder than you imagine and the slightest wind can drastically alter a landing. With the expeditionary airfields my unit made for the USMC, we saw many a harrier land on a short strip without cables, so my understanding is that you don't vtol unless absolutely necessary.

[MBot 0]

Yes Harriers can do vertical landing but not so much liftoff.

Of course they can, just only with reduced weapons or fuel.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Okay, now you guys are nit-picking over little 'what if' scenarios. A fully loaded Harrier, such as in ArmA 2 (topic), can not lift off vertically with a full payload.

[MBot 0]

Well lets put it that way. I'd rather have a Harrier in Arma 2 that can take-off and land vertically (which is a little wrong) than one that can't do any hovering at all (which is what we currently have).

Of course the best solution would be to have the ability to hover depending on aircraft weight (loaded weapons and fuel). So you have to make a STO and can do a vertical landing once the weapons are gone. But that sort of flight-model fidelity is unlikely to ever come to Arma 2.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Of course the best solution would be to have the ability to hover depending on aircraft weight (loaded weapons and fuel). So you have to make a STO and can do a vertical landing once the weapons are gone. But that sort of flight-model fidelity is unlikely to ever come to Arma 2.

Exactly...

[frederf 0]

Okay, now you guys are nit-picking over little 'what if' scenarios. A fully loaded Harrier, such as in ArmA 2 (topic), can not lift off vertically with a full payload.

I don't think talking about 50% of airfield ops being wrong is "nit picking." You better believe that a high (like 90%+) combat ops from a LHD by Harrier end in a vertical landing.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

I don't think talking about 50% of airfield ops being wrong is "nit picking." You better believe that a high (like 90%+) combat ops from a LHD by Harrier end in a vertical landing.

LANDING. I said take-off. Take what I say literally or don't even bother reading it.

[manberries 0]

My personal view is that indeed it is incorrect that a fully loaded harrier can vtol. But, I do not think fixing this is worth the time considering all the other things that could be done. Also, since this could be done with scripting we should leave that to the individual mission maker not burden BIS with the job.

[chaplainDMK 10]

Sad that the harrier cant hover.

I mean wtf, its the king of hovering for over 40 years and it will be till 2011 when the F35s come into service. -_-

[Tozmeister 0]

LANDING. I said take-off. Take what I say literally or don't even bother reading it.

Dude, people are taking you literally. When you said on page 3 that Harriers 'can't do VTOL [Vertical Take Off and Landing]' and a couple of guys contradicted you with film evidence you said they were nit-picking, then 2 replys later you're telling them to take you literally?

Please, I'm a bit confused as to the line between 'nit-picking' and 'take me literally'

Edited July 13, 2009 by Tozmeister
Clarifying what VTOL stands for.

[frederf 0]

Thank you Tozmeister. That was what I meant.

[horrgakx 1]

Question about the Osprey still - does dropping the flaps affect the rate of airspeed falloff? In other words, will it slow the aircraft down quicker by deploying the flaps or gear?

I suppose this question applies to all the other aircraft too...

[liquidpinky 11]

Taken from an aircraft forum:

There is a water tank installed in all Harriers, AV-8 A thru C and GR Mk I thru V. It is located behind the RR Pegasus engine and is shaped to fit into the V shape of the rear (hot) nozzles. As you stated, water is injected into the engine aft of combustion to increase the volume of gas generated going thru the power turbine section. Since the power turbine section drives the compressor section, this also increases thrust to the forward nozzles (cold). The side benefit of this is also cooler hot nozzle exhaust temperatures. Since the hot nozzles blow on the flaps to increase downward thrust, this helps reduce heat damage to the flaps. All of the water injection is done automatically on the AV-8B and GR Mk V by the fuel control unit. I am not sure if it was automatic on earlier versions.

I have also seen on some programs about the harrier that this tank of water only actually lasts around 1 minute thirty seconds during full vertical thrust and then serious damage/failures start as a result.

Another reason why they only STOL unless at air shows.