Realistic AFV damage models and FCS

[chappy 0]

self explanatory.

devs keep saying they are all about absolute realism,well then they will need to model the FCS on all of the MBTs and IFVs/APCs in it,.

[mr.g-c 6]

100% Agree, its absolute mandatory in a game of such a scale.

Discussion is going on there currently: http://www.flashpoint1985.com/cgi-bin....t=77096

[Second 0]

Could someone first post here piece of code which explain to AI that it's idiotic to fire at frontal armor of tank because it can just scratch it and it's better to wait or fire at another tank which has flank exposed.

Enough said and thank you.

[mr.g-c 6]

Could someone first post here piece of code which explain to AI that it's idiotic to fire at frontal armor of tank because it can just scratch it and it's better to wait or fire at another tank which has flank exposed.

Enough said and thank you.

We discussed this already some time ago and i said and say here that one with access to the core engine AI (for instant BI-Developers) could achieve something like that or similar*

Could be that AI puts themselves into a better position to the Tanks Flanks first, before firing like stupid idiots on the first spotting of a Tank (like currently in Arma).

[Second 0]

Reason i brought this up early in thois thread is that hopefully people can maybe understand why just penetration model isn't enough (before bitching and whining about lack of it), and why it probably just ruins whole game outside pure PvP.

True, only BIS AI-coders knows how AI can be made to understand importance of getting flank shots and how to gain change for flank shots.

[Pulverizer 1]

Not even the AI in Steel Beasts Pro pursues flank shots. Hitting the gun or optics, disabling gyroscopes for a while, disabling radio, jamming the turret etc are plenty enough reasons to shoot at the front of a tank even when there's zero chance of penetration.

[faguss 64]

There's also a thing called emotions. Would soldier risk and delay shot while tank is charging at him?

Could depend on skill. Could depend on knowsAbout.

[mr.g-c 6]

Not even the AI in Steel Beasts Pro pursues flank shots. Hitting the gun or optics, disabling gyroscopes for a while, disabling radio, jamming the turret etc are plenty enough reasons to shoot at the front of a tank even when there's zero chance of penetration.

Now thats an argument!

[Second 0]

Not even the AI in Steel Beasts Pro pursues flank shots. Hitting the gun or optics, disabling gyroscopes for a while, disabling radio, jamming the turret etc are plenty enough reasons to shoot at the front of a tank even when there's zero chance of penetration.

But will ArmA model vehicles as much? I don't think so. So we probably have just gun, hull and turret in frontal armor, no small optics or such. Besides Steel Beasts is tank sim, with focus in tanks. Infantry works differently and ArmA2 focuses more on infantry. There is for example Combat Mission: Shock Force (wargame) where AI thinks about usefulness to use grappy PG-7 at M1A2 Abrams' frontal armor, because at most it might take damage optics and just result in M1A2 firing at RPG-gunner, which might cost lives of whole squad ofthat particular RPG-gunner. Not very wise.

Faguss: There is always change for frontal penetration in reality (better or worse, but there it is), BMP-2's 30mm AP has change to penetrate T-72's turret from front (has happened in tests). However these are slim changes and because of this armies do train that which weapon and warhead has change to penetrate which targets, and should gunner seek for flank shots. Sure if situation is that tank is coming full speed at soldier then training might not apply because soldier might panic and try to get lucky shot.

EDIT:

As a general info lets' take this consideration of flank shots to "extreme heights" of usefulness of it:

We have infantry platoon (3 squads) formed on V-shaped hill. They form consentrated killzone into valley inside V-shape (basically all of them, including AT-weapons, can fire into valley). In that valley there is 3 tanks in Wedge-formation.

Now. without consideration of flank shots, our AT-guys starts to fire easiest tanks for them to hit, which means that they shoot closest tank, which means that when tanks are in wedge, their frontal armor is directed at closest infantry-squad. So basically idiotic At-guys fires at frontal armors.

Now. With consideration of flank shots, our AT-guys don't act as stupidly, as they know that they can't much do harm to closest tank (150 meters). Then again at distance of 200-250 meters there is tank which side is exposed to them and their AT-weapons. Now they sum 1+1.

Catching my drift, eh?

[Dvich 0]

I think that a realistic game mechanics (realistic penetrations and "penetration after effects") are in a higher priority since making a smarter AI is worth nothing without this.

Both in this thread and in "Armor Warfare" thread we discuss on something that, very sadly, we are not going to see in ArmA 2, we are going to see this hugly importent "feature" in a patch or expansion pack for the very best and that is only if we are going to recruit all the community with us in order to put a pressure on BIS.

[wipman 1]

Hi, you will have to move and shot and then move again, if you've

2 APC's and enough AT wepons; if you've two MBTs... then your

best chance it's to call Arty CAS, or just flank the last MBT and

try to catch him by the back, moving, shot and moving again. Let's C ya

[chappy 0]

thanks for the link to the other thread. i prbly shoulda searched first eh , still, having a new thread helps with exposure to this CRITICAL element of the simulation experience.