Oxygen not being freely distributed online!

[M-N-0N 0]

oh i would like todo that ... but right now all i would wanna do is have a play around with it since i am busy with makeing models for other important stuff ... not mods but retail stuff ... =:/ so i dont think they would select me... cozz i cant promis i would release stuff often.

[Maddock 0]

Geez BIS, I hope you guys/gals have thick skins.....it's getting pretty hot in here!

[Garritos 0]

Time for my unimportant 0.02 cents.  I dont neccisarily agree with BIS welshing on their original statement of releasing OXYGEN to the public by the end of Febuary.     I dont like the Idea of the game developer "playing God" with the tools.  But assuming OXYGEN has not already been released to certain Mod teams already, there may not be an immediate need for it.  During the last few weeks I have seen some eye opening screenshots of new weapon models in game(on the lost brothers page) and the G8 team has released a M113 with no turret    There is also the tool from a-lone-wolf that allows weapons to be altered.  Im no expert but it seems at the rate the community is going, by the time BIS releases OXYGEN to the public, there may be no need for it  

I will list the following list of the PPL in MY OPINION that deserve the tool, and if any didnt get it, would really make me loose faith in the direction that BIS is taking:

-Tigershark/Jellybelly: anyone in the OFPEC camp should get it automaticly (I dont care if they want to make a flying terd with wings) for the simple fact that if it was not for their site, this community wouldnt have half the members that it currently boasts (me included, this game would still be sitting in the dust pile on top of my WW2online CD had I not stumbled upon their site and decided to take a stab at the editor)  now I plan on purchasing IL and RES expansion.  Also include select this and ebud with them

-UceE:  Have you seen those Russian federation skins or the upcoming finnish mod ('nuff said)

-Kegerty:  Just incase he decides to tinker and stumble upon the next breakthrough  

-Lost Brothers team:  Im not sure if they need it but their work looks great with a fine eye for detail

-I44:  excluding them would put some amazing work down the drain

-OperationVietnam:  another very promising pre1985 mod

-Satchel:  I wouldnt have normally put him in here since i havent seen much of his work but have you seen that apache in the add-on forum??  put the default to shame, Id like to see what this guy could do with such a powerful tool.

Im sure I have left out some really important ppl but these came from the top of my head and if any of these guys were excluded it would really hurt BIS's image in my eyes (and probably more than just mine).  Again, let me state that these are the shue ins in my opinion far more than 7 ppl in the community deserve OXYGEN.

  Im really hoping that this decision works out for BIS and the OFP community,  I dont see the wisdom in it right now but maybe i can be persuaded  

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Garritos @ Mar. 01 2002,05:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Time for my unimportant 0.02 cents.  I dont neccisarily agree with BIS welshing on their original statement of releasing OXYGEN to the public by the end of Febuary.     I dont like the Idea of the game developer "playing God" with the tools.  But assuming OXYGEN has not already been released to certain Mod teams already, there may not be an immediate need for it.  During the last few weeks I have seen some eye opening screenshots of new weapon models in game(on the lost brothers page) and the G8 team has released a M113 with no turret    There is also the tool from a-lone-wolf that allows weapons to be altered.  Im no expert but it seems at the rate the community is going, by the time BIS releases OXYGEN to the public, there may be no need for it  

I will list the following list of the PPL in MY OPINION that deserve the tool, and if any didnt get it, would really make me loose faith in the direction that BIS is taking:

-Tigershark/Jellybelly: anyone in the OFPEC camp should get it automaticly (I dont care if they want to make a flying terd with wings) for the simple fact that if it was not for their site, this community wouldnt have half the members that it currently boasts (me included, this game would still be sitting in the dust pile on top of my WW2online CD had I not stumbled upon their site and decided to take a stab at the editor)  now I plan on purchasing IL and RES expansion.  Also include select this and ebud with them

-UceE:  Have you seen those Russian federation skins or the upcoming finnish mod ('nuff said)

-Kegerty:  Just incase he decides to tinker and stumble upon the next breakthrough  

-Lost Brothers team:  Im not sure if they need it but their work looks great with a fine eye for detail

-I44:  excluding them would put some amazing work down the drain

-OperationVietnam:  another very promising pre1985 mod

-Satchel:  I wouldnt have normally put him in here since i havent seen much of his work but have you seen that apache in the add-on forum??  put the default to shame, Id like to see what this guy could do with such a powerful tool.

Im sure I have left out some really important ppl but these came from the top of my head and if any of these guys were excluded it would really hurt BIS's image in my eyes (and probably more than just mine).  Again, let me state that these are the shue ins in my opinion far more than 7 ppl in the community deserve OXYGEN.

  Im really hoping that this decision works out for BIS and the OFP community,  I dont see the wisdom in it right now but maybe i can be persuaded   <span id='postcolor'>

ehh....you mean 2 cents, right? not 2/100th of a cent...

I agree with your list. BIS should not hesistate to give those ppl OXYGEN, whether they have some project in mind or not. Those ppl should send email to request one. They all contributed to OFP community in enormous way, and they deserve it.

[M-N-0N 0]

what i would like to know tho ...

is what are the chances of ppl like myself that do model weapons player and vehicls or anything else for that matter, would be able to get a copy of that programe ... but cant promise many release that BIS would expect?

i mean i would not mind messing around editing player models or makeing new one and maybe a weap or two, but not have not got the time for doing it full time ....

cozz i am busy with other game releated production right now ... so i am busy ... but i would still like to mess around and release once in a while???

i mean would ppl like myself have a chance at getting the tool?

[Tigershark 0]

Thanks guys

We really want to see a Littlebird in the game....so we'll try and get that implemented ASAP.

It will probably have the same flight physics as the Kiowa....but will look much cooler....Can't guarantee the ability to sit on the benches though....we'll see.

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (M|N|0N @ Mar. 01 2002,05:52)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">what i would like to know tho ...

is what are the chances of ppl like myself that do model weapons player and vehicls or anything else for that matter, would be able to get a copy of that programe ... but cant promise many release that BIS would expect?

i mean i would not mind messing around editing player models or makeing new one and maybe a weap or two, but not have not got the time for doing it full time ....

cozz i am busy with other game releated production right now ... so i am busy ... but i would still like to mess around and release once in a while???

i mean would ppl like myself have a chance at getting the tool?<span id='postcolor'>

yes you do...they said they would release it.

[Garritos 0]

lol ralph I guess my .02 cents did turn into a couple of dollars, too.  and I think there was a point to my huge run-on sentence of a post.  If BIS dosent give it to those ppl will you have your father arrest them, or better yet make them into a police informant     but I do feel for the ppl like minion that could possibly come up with some good stuff, but they will be passed by b/c they are not "name" OFP model editors.  Guess we cant have our cake and eat it too  

[M-N-0N 0]

yeah ... like someone said before ... not only are they filtering out the bad modellers and that .. but they are also filting out the talented ppl that havnt showin themselfs yet ....

and one of those ppl could be me .... and there are bound to be 50+ others aswell

[ralphwiggum 6]

Here's my reason of supporting BIS's decision.

When O2 is released to all ppl right now. what will happen is that ppl will scramble to make their version of same weapon, causing problems of compatiblity. I mean, if I have Ak101 that can fly 20000meters, and I'm playing with my friend who has another version that only lets you fire 10000meters. AFAIK OFP will say, 'Hey, both have AK101!, i'll say they are compatible.' But what will happen is that when I see my friends 15000meters away, I can blow him away(ok not literally...my shooting sucks) because my AK101 add-on has legit reasons to do it.(of course, my friend can blow me up too, since when he fires, the info will be relayed to my PC, which will use my AK101 setting).

However, what happens is that I took advantage of the difference. My firend, despite seeing me, would say that, 'Ha! he's too far away to shoot me!' because he knows that his Ak101 add-on fires 10000meters, not 15000 meters. however, as I shoot, the bullet will fly 15000meters and hit him ,which will be recorded as a hit, and then my poor friend will die, despite having himself out of HIS add-on's effective range.

What will follow is system of rating as ppl mentioned earlier. However, this has its own share of problems. First, we know some idiots will do anything to promote their mod, so that will skew what ppl really think is a great addon( by vote). even if we have rating system, we need a centralized rating system. that way, ppl don't have to compare the rating system to see which one is the most valid one.

so, let's say we have a unique rating system, all folllowed by OFP community. Another problem that rises is that getting rating would be also biased, and have seed to debate on which is more accurate and so on. ppl will claim that their add on is perfect and others is a crap, and vice versa. So someone, with respective authority has to make decisions. And who do we have for that? BIS

But that's not the end of problem. Since there will be debates and controversies on who is better, and some will undoubtly cry foul at BIS's choice. What does this mean? BIS has to eval all 100000mods, and that translates into eating BIs's time. This will cause trade-off in BIS's time. Instead of developing bugs and other stuff, BIS is now forced to take the roll of evaluator, and any improvements will be coming at slower pace. This will be disasterous for OFP's life-span

I know many are disappointed and vow not to set foot on this place. But if you think about it, going from 0 to 60miles is not easy thing to do. you have to go from 0 to 10 first, and then 10 to 60. You can't just make a baby run, when he hasn't even learn to crawl yet.

By reducing numbers of release, BIS can make sure that mods are properly made, and knowledge is built on how to use. Of course, they need to share the knowledge, but having some kind of ordered knowledge will benefit dumb ppl like me. IF we just start sharing ideas right now, this forum will crash.

So we have to take a step at a time. Please, be patient

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (M|N|0N @ Mar. 01 2002,06:24)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">yeah ... like someone said before ... not only are they filtering out the bad modellers and that .. but they are also filting out the talented ppl that havnt showin themselfs yet ....

and one of those ppl could be me  .... and there are bound to be 50+ others aswell<span id='postcolor'>

I know....i'm definitely one of those 50...actually...i wanted to learn 3d modeling with Oxygen...but for the sake of OFP's stability, I'm willing to wait a bit more.

c'mon...please...could you practice abstinence for the sake of simple users like me?

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Garritos @ Mar. 01 2002,06:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">lol ralph I guess my .02 cents did turn into a couple of dollars, too.  and I think there was a point to my huge run-on sentence of a post.  If BIS dosent give it to those ppl will you have your father arrest them, or better yet make them into a police informant     but I do feel for the ppl like minion that could possibly come up with some good stuff, but they will be passed by b/c they are not "name" OFP model editors.  Guess we cant have our cake and eat it too  <span id='postcolor'>

he's busy trying to catch Sideshow Bob and Snake...

and he's busy guarding our beautiful town of Springfield.

However, if BIS doesn't support those ppl, I'll ask my dad to lock'em cuz they are nerds

[Yoshiro 0]

Well having gotten back on I see this argument is still going and will continue for some time. There are both good sides and bad sides to what BIS has dicided to do. As stated earlier I feel it was a bad move on their part, and I would like to hear a complete explination of why they chose to do it this way.

But I would also like to repeat myself from my earlier post and encurage all of you potential modders out their to apply or group to geather with a couple of other independent modders and apply.

And Tigershark, I really want to see your littlebird !

[Tigershark 0]

Nit until you buy dinner and a movie

Oooopps....I think you meant my helicopter...doh!

[DoubleTAP 1]

Although I feel that not being able to release Oxygen sooner rather than later is a blow to the OPF community, ya' can't really blame BIS for it.

They are after all a company, with bills to pay, and lives to finance. They should do everything in there power to profit from such a kick ass title. Since there are works in progress such as Independence Lost and Resistance, it probably wouldn't pay off to release the tools which might allow modders to compete. Why fork over cash for an addon if you can download user made versions of it's content?

Not publicly releasing the tools leaves BIS with control over what mods get made, BIS legally has no obligation to support any mod/the OPF community beyond the Software Agreement.

Personally I applaud their wisdom, they're pretty high speed with patches and free additions, I can wait.

[Yoshiro 0]

hehe in that case I just might skip the littlebird.

[akm74 1]

Money has nothing to do with BIS decision. They will give tool to serious moders with no problem. And ONLY GOOD moders can produce good quality add-on to complete with official add-ons.

Where is the Logic?

It is not money. Something else, but not money.

[Tigershark 0]

Sex...its gotta be sex....time to bend over AKM47 and take one for the OFP community

Who's your daddy?

[Garritos 0]

LMAO @ tigershark      

something just dawned on me and I thought i would share it.  Maybe this little contrevesy is just what the OFP community needed and maybe it was planned out.  alot of old skewlers are popping outta the woodwork about this (even axle online got an update for this one  )  I'll bet today these forums are setting some records today for activity and posts!!  I for one have been a registered user on these boards since Jan 2nd but i didnt make my first post on these forums till tonite.  Maybe you can attribute it to OFPEC forums being down (hell thats why im here) but this has pumped some life back into these forums and you know what they say in the advertizing bizz,      "any publicity is good publicity"

[Peroxide 0]

I still think its a VERY BAD IDEA! Why would BIS be scared of some little no-names that just want to put some fun things into the OFP game! Its SAD, YES SAD that they would be scared to release Oxygen because they dont want someone making models. NO ONE HAS TO DOWNLOAD A MODEL IF THEY DONT WANT TO!!!!!! IF YOU DONT LIKE A MODEL YOU DOWNLOADED YOU CAN JUST DELETE IT!!!!! Lets grow up BIS and quit your crying about someone making models not to your likeing! Valve released all kinds of stuff for mod makers and they are STILL making money!!!!! Oh, and to Antichrist, YOUR A F*CKING IDIOT!!!!!

[Goodspeed 0]

LOL

12 pages about NOTHING  

My offer to BIS is simple: make a new disc with SDK tools and sell it

BTW i untestand that we will get millions of ugly models... And the chaos will begin  

[ale2999 0]

Well I completely agree with Bis in that and cheer for them .

By doing this they are making sure that their game will remain at the same quality as when they gave us nes models with the patches: Bis will probably work closely with those programing and 3d modelers to ensure good quality of products. Probably at a certain point bis will ask skilled individuals to make up a models to implement in game with a patch. They JUST WANT TO KEEP THE GAME IN AN ENJOYEBALE STATUS, cuz as other ppl said ppl will start making missions with all those uselless models and to find an MP game that is compatiblw with urs would be very hard.

I bet that all the mods that are going to come out thanks to this deciscion now r gonna be as good if not better than coldwar crisis.

Afterall all of us are waiting 4 mods like I44, Planet of War, Operation Vietnam, Operation Desertstorm etc and I could bet that all of those dev. team will get the tools! If u r a skilled modeller, just talk to Bis( I am sure Kegetys will get the tools 4 example) and if u r really skilled or a nice idea they will help u. In conclusion I can say that they r not doing these 4 $, becuase if they were huntinh money, they woud just put the tools on cd and sell them for 100$ (and that's legal). So everyone just look at the bigger picture and u will suddenly start to smile

BIS ROCKS

[CamperKiller 0]

The game won't remain at that quality because eventually unofficial tools will be released which allow 'modders' to create sub standard units etc...

[Guest Scooby]

And as creating units with unofficial tools is harder and there is bigger change of fucking up something those poor models will be even poorer than with Oxygen.

As for someone saying that BIS should release tools on separate disk and take money of it thats what they are most likely doing. Putting tools with one of their addon disks...

[ACEJim 0]

BIS - You have messed up.