Grid 0,0,0/ Group A.W.O.L / "Gaurd WP" FIX!

[redarmy 422]

A few people in the past including myself posted asking why we sometimes see groups all of a sudden,moving to grid 0,0,0.

This has consistently popped up in missions iv made over the years. Maps with no water such as Takistan,Livonia,would see ground based units/groups and aircraft often going to move to these grid coordinates (0,0,0) or 'bottom left of the map" and just holding.,and maps like Tanoa/Altis seeing aircraft/boats moving there.

 

Iv discovered the cause and want to offer a solution to anyone who may need it as none exists online. I understand not everyone has this issue,because it requires a particular mission set up(albiet not complex,including an all vanilla set up). Also note theres a probability that 3rd party AI mods that share info about enemy will also suffer issues from this problem,VCOM,Lambs,GAIA and depending on settings of those scripts,affect their usage too.

 

Components that cause the issue: High command and Gaurd waypoint.

 

So when using high command(even for one side in sp) upon mission load, 3 entities are created at grid 0,0,0. a blufor HQ unit/opfor HQ unit/ind HQ unit. These entities are "hidden" and sim disabled...however they are still able to "know about" each other(BIS WHYYYYY?!) im assuming its got to do with creating High command markers. One or more of these entities will be deleted sometime after mission start..BUT not always hence,problems start...............

 

So issue is that units on gaurd waypoints are being told about these other units(blu HQ entity telling its side gaurd units about opfor HQ entity). For example you have blufor Attack helo on gaurd wp,it will fly to 0,0,0 to find opfor entity(again even though its set to "hidden" and blufor has sim disabled)

 

SOLUTION:

 

Create any trigger(repeatable for safest results) covering grid 0,0,0 (about a 1000 meter radius to be sure)

 

condition:  OPFOR PRESENT / REPEATABLE

 

ACTIVATION:

{
    if (!(isPlayer _x)) then {
        _vehicle = vehicle _x;

        if ((_x != _vehicle) and {_x == (effectiveCommander _vehicle)}) then {
            {moveOut _x;} forEach (crew _vehicle);

            deleteVehicle _vehicle;
        };

        deleteVehicle _x;
    };
} forEach thisList;

Timeout : ~3 seconds

 

This will delete the opfor entity. If you are using opfor,then delete the blufor entity,also delete IND if they are an enemy or friendly side in mission.

DO NOT DELETE YOUR SIDE. In this case BLUFOR as it will break functionality of High command markers (even when using setGroupIconsVisible [true, false];) and throw up errors . NOTE this doesnt break opfor icon showing on map if spotted by blufor via High command markers.

 

Thats it. repeatable trigger to delete opfor will delete that entity if it ever comes back(havent seen it respawn) and just incase it did and at same time and opfor group on gaurd waypoint got a move order(from gaurd wp function) once it arives in trigger area it will be deleted,vehicle,crew etc.

 

 

BIS - This issue shouldnt be a thing. The only intelligent wp besides seek and destroy you give the AI you manage to ruin by not disallowing knowledge sharing of debug corner entities. Please fix it or assign each entity /side a different map corner for whatever reasons you need them there.

 

Hope this helps someone,only took me 3 years to figure out.

 

EDIT : EXACT CAUSE OF ISSUE DISCOVERED: SCROLL DOWN.

[dreadedentity 278]

In past games sometimes you would have to create a "center" for a particular side in specific instances before you can create units because the center is what allows groups on that side to be made. In Arma 3 all 3 centers are created automatically so this is no longer necessary. However this seems like they are the center units, and able to see 1 or more and target it before it can be hidden. I don't know if what you are seeing is the center units but now that you know a little about them you can see that it is a bad idea to delete them. Since you are able to find the center unit, perhaps forgetTarget will work?

[redarmy 422]

43 minutes ago, dreadedentity said:

In past games sometimes you would have to create a "center" for a particular side in specific instances before you can create units because the center is what allows groups on that side to be made. In Arma 3 all 3 centers are created automatically so this is no longer necessary. However this seems like they are the center units, and able to see 1 or more and target it before it can be hidden. I don't know if what you are seeing is the center units but now that you know a little about them you can see that it is a bad idea to delete them. Since you are able to find the center unit, perhaps forgetTarget will work?

Thanks for your input. So you think groups that are "made" after i delete opfor centre,will cause some issues in the scenario? i ran some tests and opfor seemed ok,infact im using a respawn script and those respawning units are sill getting all their saved waypoints,loadouts etc. Nothing seems "broken".

 

But i want to be sure too that it wont break anything,so will thankfully take your advice.

 

How exactly would i go about making those entities at grid 0,0,0 forget about each other?Since im unable to name them. How would i properly label those entities in a "thislist" for a trigger?

 

 btw it only takes a fraction of a second for them to detect each other(quicker than any trigger i can use to delete one,so while my solution,even if it doesnt break anything,isnt ideal)

 

 

EDIT: There is a wiki entry called delete centre:  https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/deleteCenter

 

so i assume its safe to?  Like i said in first post , i think it will only break things relating to high command,as only HC throws up errors when a unit is spawned in "after" iv deleted centre entity. And because im not playing as opfor i assume its probably safe.

[dreadedentity 278]

Like I said I don't actually know if these really are the centers that I mentioned, so I'd recommend some general testing to find out stuff about them, but if they were then your trigger code could possibly be as simple as:

{
    private _current = _x;
    thisList apply {_current forgetTarget _x};
} forEach thisList;

What's nice about this is it leaves the centers alone (maybe not even an issue), and since they are hidden afterward they shouldn't be able to re-spot so if done at the right time you could probably get away with just running this once

[redarmy 422]

18 minutes ago, dreadedentity said:

Like I said I don't actually know if these really are the centers that I mentioned, so I'd recommend some general testing to find out stuff about them, but if they were then your trigger code could possibly be as simple as:

{
    private _current = _x;
    thisList apply {_current forgetTarget _x};
} forEach thisList;

What's nice about this is it leaves the centers alone (maybe not even an issue), and since they are hidden afterward they shouldn't be able to re-spot so if done at the right time you could probably get away with just running this once

Tested with your example,didnt stop a gaurd unit straight away going to grid 0,0,0. my way stops the gaurd unit on mission start going there,so im gona run with that if i find any odd behaviour il come back let ya know and update the title.

 

I ran

deleteCenter east;

in a trigger and it didnt delete the opfor HQ unit so perhaps it isnt representing the centre.

Thanks anyway,i guess these thre little men at 0,0,0 will remain a mystery. My theory is they are high commanders or an entity needed by them to reference HC markers for other units.

[dreadedentity 278]

49 minutes ago, redarmy said:

My theory is they are high commanders or an entity needed by them to reference HC markers for other units.

Nice thought, perhaps they are a proxy unit used to give the HC squads players orders. Could explain weird behavior with Guard waypoint (enemies are known on a group-level, implying the unit at 0,0 was joined or possibly led the HC squad for a short time). Unfortunately it's difficult to find answers to questions like this

[Harzach 2517]

I already told you all of this in your other topic, but you never provided your mission.

 

When I set up HC, I do not get any units spawning at [0,0,0] or anywhere else. I suspect something else is going on. Share you mission so we can see.

[redarmy 422]

1 hour ago, Harzach said:

I already told you all of this in your other topic, but you never provided your mission.

 

When I set up HC, I do not get any units spawning at [0,0,0] or anywhere else. I suspect something else is going on. Share you mission so we can see.

sure,if you want to look,where can i post it?  Are you running High command and zeus to check? 

 

[Harzach 2517]

Upload it to any free file transfer site/service (Google Drive, Dropbox, etc) and paste a share link here.

 

One note - it is ideal in this type of situation to create a repro mission that uses no mods. Create the simplest mission possible that reproduces the issue.

[redarmy 422]

8 hours ago, Harzach said:

Upload it to any free file transfer site/service (Google Drive, Dropbox, etc) and paste a share link here.

 

One note - it is ideal in this type of situation to create a repro mission that uses no mods. Create the simplest mission possible that reproduces the issue.

Theres no need..as i was setting up a simple test to upload for you(my mission isnt heavily modded but had 3 weeks of work in it,so was alot to disect down)

 

I found the exact issue. And yes,it technically is a mod issue.

 

More exactly,its a combination of the vanilla module "support requester" and the mod "Zeus enhanced". Totally confirmed now.

I will ask the author whats up with it.