Should "gunslingers" be made official?

[Guest Titanium]

Okay, before I get into why I believe "Gunslingers" addon I will explain why I am posting this here in the General Forum.  First I went to the multiplayer forum and thought, well it would effect more than just MP.  Then I went to the Mission editing and realized, well, not everyone comes to this forum.  So I am posting it here in the General Forum where everyone comes and where this poll concerns everyone.

 Now, back to the topic at hand.  If you do not know what the gunslingers addon is, this is what it is.  It is a mission editing tool that allows for a wider range of objects to be places.  Buldings, walls, roads, etc.  Basically its a doodad addon.  It allows for more dynamic maps.  Now, if you aren't the mission editor type person, then you should still be interested.  And if you don't like MP playing as well.  More dynamic campaings, single player missions, as well as MP missions can be created.  Its a reltivaley small download that could easily be encorporated into a patch.  If I am not mistaken, there was some sort of notice that said the gunslingers creator didn't want his program used for profit or something of that sort.  I don't know if this would violate that (becuase it is in a FREE patch after you buy the game), but you can make a loophole and simply progam a new thing for the mission editor using the same principle that allows all OFP buildings/doodads to be added.  This would be great for all kinds of play.

 So the question remains should "gunslingers" or a sort of, spinoff of it should be added into OFP.  This would allow for more dynamic ways to play in SP, MP, and new campaigns.

Well, thats it for now, I'll most likely edit this here and there, grammar you know.  But please vote!

[kegetys 2]

Well, all addons add something new to the game and gunslingers editor addon isnt anything more special than any other... So why should it get this special treatment?

imo. it has way too much useless stuff anyway, it makes the editor object list full of crap that are never used... And I dont understand why the empty objects have to belong to a certain side (like theres west towers and things like that)?

[SKULLS_Viper 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Well, all addons add something new to the game and gunslingers editor addon isnt anything more special than any other... So why should it get this special treatment?

imo. it has way too much useless stuff anyway, it makes the editor object list full of crap that are never used... And I dont understand why the empty objects have to belong to a certain side (like theres west towers and things like that)?<span id='postcolor'>

Ditto.

[Guest Titanium]

Simple. It adds eye-candy. Everyone likes it. True, it adds a lot of usless crap. But there is also a lot of useful crap. And what is useless to you may be usefull to others. And vice versa. Also, since it doesn't truly add anything "new" to the game. It Just adds things that are already there, it doesn't take away what the game develpoers wanted. Nothing new, just explanding the old.

[Miles 0]

Same here, it just adds a load of crap which we dont need-the bases provided are enough, tempory tent campy things can be easily made without needing something that clogs up your screen. Its good work in itself, but it just isn't needed but people still put it in their misions, usuaaly when it isnt needed

[Mister Frag 0]

I also don't like the idea of trying to find a loophole that would supposedly allow someone else's work to be included in a patch. It's immoral at best, and would set a really ugly precedent.

Thumbs down...

[Guest Titanium]

Where I'm from, this isn't close to immoral.  And it's not so much their work, as much as it is simply the idea.

EDIT: Why NOT take advantage of things that are there? There will always be bad things that result from everything. But if you get a good mapper, and full exploitation of game objects. It can make for one hell of a map.

[Mister Frag 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Titanium @ May 31 2002,19:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Where I'm from, this isn't close to immoral.  And it's not so much their work, as much as it is simply the idea.<span id='postcolor'>

Morals are personal standards, while ethics are values set by society. So yes, you could consider the copying of someone else's work perfectly alright -- it depends on your own values.

However, that being as it may, the Gunslinger Editor addon still enjoys copyright protection in the United States and many other places. Even if you do not ask for it by applying to the U.S. Copyright Office in Washington, it would still be protected as an unpublished work from the moment that the work has been created. The primary reason for registering a work with the U.S. Copyright Office is to have it on the public record, which could be crucial in a legal dispute.

So, where you come from, taking the Gunslinger addon or the idea and including it in a future patch may not be immoral, but it is most certainly illegal.

[Guest Titanium]

I still don't really understand how it can be "illegal".  The game is copyrighted by codemasters.  All they would be doing is expanding the in-game mission editor.

[Mister Frag 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Titanium @ May 31 2002,20:31)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I still don't really understand how it can be "illegal".  The game is copyrighted by codemasters.  All they would be doing is expanding the in-game mission editor.<span id='postcolor'>

It's quite simple, really -- if you are using someone else's ideas or work as the basis of your own product, you are potentially infringing on their copyright.

Even very simple ideas can be copyrighted, either explicitly or implicitly. For example, Lotus Development Corporation successfully sued Borland International and several other smaller software companies about the use of the slash key ('/' to activate menus.

[Guest Titanium]

LOL, that like getting a stick of dynamite in the ass to be sued for using the '/' key! But anyway, in the example you used, people created the softwar then programmed it to activate on the '/' key. in OFP's case, everything is already there, before gunslingers was created. Doesn't that count for anything?

[Mister Frag 0]

You're missing the point -- it isn't about the implementation, but the idea.

For that matter, even the current version of the Operation Flashpoint Network Editor Update is based on BIS' work, and thus could be subjected to a claim under both U.S. and international copyright law. But since it adds value to OFP and the game franchise, and doesn't take sales away from it, it is being tolerated.

Codemasters, as software publishers, are certainly well aware of the implications of copyright infringement, and I'm sure that if they wanted to enhance OFP's editor to duplicate ideas and concepts popularized or introduced by the Gunslinger addon, they would clear this first with the creators of the Gunslinger addon.

It would be in both parties' interest to do what you propose and enhance OFP, but this shouldn't be done by exploiting a perceived loophole in the Gunslinger license terms.

[Guest Titanium]

Who made gunslingers. I want to re-dlowalod it and re-read all the agreement terms. But I cant seem to find it.

[Mister Frag 0]

The Avon Lady is hosting a copy of it HERE.

The README file doesn't actually spell out licensing terms, my statements were based on your original message saying that they wanted it to be free for non-profit use. Despite of a lack of any licensing terms in the file, you would still not be able to include it in another product without consent.

[Sheriff 0]

Gunslinger made it obviously. My vote is a concrete no and i'm sure quite a few members would agree that lieing deceiving kid doesn't deserve such recognition.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

I think it should be made official, because I have seen some great and creative maps that use Gunslingers go by the wayside because servers dont want to have to deal with 'unofficial' addons

[Sheriff 0]

What's the point? Offical or not people will continue to use it or not. It's not 100% stable and some of the object conflict with the map, If BIS made this pathetic addon offical they also have to offer support for it. All usermade addons are unoffical and the user takes a risk using the addon. It's adding objects into the editor that wern't suppose to be there thus the editor doesn't always effectively handle most of the objects correctly and that can cause errors.

[Placebo 29]

Moving to ME.

And the fact that Gunslinger sold out to those scummy German "developers" who released a shite unauthorised campaign for sale makes me respond with a resounding NO his addon shouldn't be added to Opf.

[MoosesGooses 0]

I was going to say that no, it shouldn't be, it is very good, but BIS are (hopefully) going to release Wrpedit, and that allows you to put house, roads (that the ai follow) and everything, and you get to put it on your own island.

CMON WRPEDIT!!!

[SKULLS_Viper 0]

Well then, if they make "Gunslingers" an 'official' addon, then think about, lets say, Kegetys, he made a fine Hawk plane, that should be made official to, if they dont, it would be unfair, and it could make Kegety mad.

[Diniter 0]

Ab-so-friken-lutely!!  Not Gunslinger's but their own. It's their code. I can't figure why do they not want to include everything they have in the mission editor?

I want an upgrade to the mission builder.

[Shunt 0]

The problem with Gunslinger's is that it get a hell lot to messy with all that useless crap it adds (Who the hell needs like 40 types of bottles and a dinner bell?). If you just had the most usefull objects included, I would be happy to use it.

[Guest Titanium]

Skullviper, if keygetys made a good plane, then it would be an addon and just that. Becuase its a new thing introduced into the game. Gunslingers merely opens up to things that are already in the game. Its adds nothing new.

[ZizleyBEar 0]

who did talk about some campaign game that was pubished?

i purchase somthing called "between the lines" a few days ago. Has anyone of you played this one? what is it and is it good?

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And the fact that Gunslinger sold out to those scummy German "developers" who released a shite unauthorised campaign<span id='postcolor'>

Is that the campaign you are talking about?

[kegetys 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Titanium @ June 01 2002,20:55)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Gunslingers merely opens up to things that are already in the game.  Its adds nothing new.<span id='postcolor'>

It does add alot of stuff to my editor at least (isnt that the purpose of it?)