Indoor Environments/better unit placements for buildings

[Gunter Severloh 4065]

Hey Guys,

I got this idea this morning about the possibility of having islands that have a combination of large outdoor environments

like we have know but... with indoor environments that you can go into. I dont want to compare and thats not what I'm

trying to do, I'm just providing an example to help create an association for this idea.

An example of what I'm talking about would be like farcry, you have this vast large otdoor environment, and then you

have a combination of cave systems, and or bunkers, warehouses, shops, whatever you can go into, even large ships.

Coming to mind another game Wolfenstein being used as an example of course, you have an urban setting with varies

areas of access to sewers, underground bases, bunkers ect.,

Pretty much what were we have been playing is all outdoor, with your occasional indoor, inside a house, or garage,

or warehouse, but those are fine, but not what I talking about.

It would be an interesting aspect to have more versatile islands, where you can have outdoor and indoor, islands

would give you the option of mass scale battles, MOUT, CQC, infiltration, patrols, and many more.

Most of the game is revolved around outdoor settings, and the thing that bothers me is you have all these buildings,

towns, even cities, and if you think about it most of them are really just environmental obstacles, or visual details,

there are no real serious objectives all your fighting is done all outside, and around these buildings.

In the editor being able to place units, being soldiers, and maybe even vehicles in indoor enviroments would be an interesting,

new types of missions are very possible. The thing with the editor is that everything is 2d, I know there is a 3d editor

for Arma2 but I dont think anyone really uses it. placement I think should upgrade to 3d, so you can place, rotate ect.,

Realistically, and correct me if Im wrong the vast majority of military combat is done outside,

and can see how BIS Games portrays that very well.

Indoor combat would make for an interesting twist like in farcry,

or other games.

Your thoughts.

[CarlGustaffa 4]

Well, the game is very much outside oriented. The first major thing that would have to change would be AI's use of indoor space, and awareness of editor placed objects. The second is placement, and I suggest the OFP DR way of using floor levels and just use pageup/pagedown in the editor to cycle through them. The last thing is waypointing, where we need to be able to set floor level (or altitude) and make them distinguishable from waypoints at different levels.

I would love underground (or mountain) bunkers, but an important question is: Do we want special maps that endorse this specifically, or make it for general purpose (outdoor) maps as well? These things would need to be highly populated by objects to be interesting. Large exterior combined with several fairly large interiors I expect would have a heavy hit on performance. A cell like structure, like Oblivion dungeons and buildings, would really not be ideal. Not sure how FarCry solved it, is it some kind of transition zone between outdoor and indoor?

I support this, and would love it. But there would have to be some serious changes for it to be possible. Ooh, all the new bugs :p

[froggyluv 2136]

The first major thing that would have to change would be AI's use of indoor space, and awareness of editor placed objects. The second is placement, and I suggest the OFP DR way of using floor levels and just use pageup/pagedown in the editor to cycle through them. The last thing is waypointing, where we need to be able to set floor level (or altitude) and make them distinguishable from waypoints at different levels.

This.

The one thing that impressed me in DR is when I approached a window from the outside with a known enemy in the room behind it, he promptly shot me in the face as I went to take a peak. They seemed to have an awareness of windows to some extent. I tried to recreate that in Arma in one of those airport houses, but the enemy just laid on the floor prone, unable or unwilling to take a shot at me. I then spent about an hour trying to get my squad to target/Engage that lone house squatter, but they were never able to successfully go after him and spent much of the time circling the building or running to a nearby hilltop.

Hopefully some ramped up level of interior awareness and maneuvering is in the works for Arma or a future release.

Edited October 23, 2010 by froggyluv

[Gunter Severloh 4065]

The first major thing that would have to change would be AI's use of indoor space, and awareness of editor placed objects.

Agree, their pathing I would assume would need to be more precise, or narrowed so that they can traverse smaller areas,

have a more sharper sense of movement, and not get stuck on a box or door, and be standing their spinning

around like you see in some older games with crap AI.

The last thing is waypointing, where we need to be able to set floor level (or altitude) and make them distinguishable from

waypoints at different levels.

Ya, there is already a somewhat path for AI, as for example when you are in command of a few, and you look at a building that

you can enter the curor changes based on level, or spot on a floor, and the AI will move there, I dont think in a way that would

be to much trouble to get situated. I know in Arma with GL3 you'd be on the top floor, and the freakin AI would scare the shit

out of you coming up the stairs cuz they usally dont do that, so it def possible.

Do we want special maps that endorse this specifically, or make it for general purpose (outdoor) maps as well?

we could do both, why be limited to 1 type of map.

A cell like structure, like Oblivion dungeons and buildings, would really not be ideal. Not sure how FarCry solved it,

is it some kind of transition zone between outdoor and indoor?

In red Orchestra, I did alot of editing for my realism unit, and the thing with the unreal editor was to make a building you would

create a cube, and the subtract the inner part of the cube and thats how you had the inside, but then for a doorway, and windows,

it was almost the same process, except you had to place a small like teleporter or something, i forget the name, but it

allowed you to enter and exit the room.

I dont know how the modeling works for the Arma2 engine but those that build maps would only know if it were possible to

create such a map with an outdoor environment, with either cave entrences, or maybe a bunker that with a door that leads to

like a massive installation of connected bunkers, ect.,

Im leaning towards maybe better performance inside vs outside, as inside if your going down a corridor the only thing visible is

the walls and whatever else, its not like a view distance of 2000 meters plus your trying to render, unless of course it was

a huge corridor, or open area.

They seemed to have an awareness of windows to some extent.

Ya that is rather neat though, as you described the AI in Arma2 cant see in the building which is weird, but if you think about it,

Ai will shoot at you if you are in the building looking out, maybe theres something with the Ai where they are

target biased human vs AI, IDK sounds stupid, but surely theres an explanation of what causes that.

[KCIV 10]

Sweet! I would love some awesome CQB fight! maybe swat style?? LOL :)