No oxygen from bis unless u meet thier vision

[Maldita Vecindad 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Gen.Carnage @ Mar. 01 2002,19:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">All this will invoke is an underground modbuilding scene, i'm pretty sure there are application builders amongst the OFP fans!

<span id='postcolor'>

Amen to that brotha!!!!!!

[Matthijs 40]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Angry Radish @ Mar. 01 2002,17:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I was paging through all the posts, ready to put my 2c in, but now I don't have to. This is EXACTLY how I feel. Great post!<span id='postcolor'>

Me too.

I have a load of finished Diemaco C7 en C8 series assault rifles, a P90 submachinegun and a was finishing  a Diemaco manufactured Minimi (SAW). All a waste of (much) precious time now.

Thanks for nothing BIS.

[Mouse 0]

WooT!!! YEAY! they finally killed the MOD scene! Hooray for BIS! or is it BULL? you must be very greedy ppl... dont release the damn thing and watch your game fall into the darkness. it's just plain silly to do this..why dont you listen to the community? the players who play your game? if it wouldnt for them your game wouldnt have been such a hit... sheesh.. i hope you wont get any mods for the game.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Matthijs @ Mar. 01 2002,19:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Angry Radish @ Mar. 01 2002,17:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I was paging through all the posts, ready to put my 2c in, but now I don't have to. This is EXACTLY how I feel. Great post!<span id='postcolor'>

Me too.

I have a load of finished Diemaco C7 en C8 series assault rifles, a P90 submachinegun and a was finishing  a Diemaco manufactured Minimi (SAW). All a waste of (much) precious time now.

Thanks for nothing BIS. <span id='postcolor'>

Most of the people at the Operation Editing Centre dont like what they have done.

[ragnardb 0]

hehe BIS yuo make me laugh, you have only 15 or maybe even less people and there are way more programmers/hackers in this world who like to bring out a tool for adding models you will see just wait a few weeks and it will be there

do you think they care about copyright ?, no way you aint gonna stop a hole community of 10k people to stop using it

its your own choiche BIS you keep tools away from people that have made great models so people start programming with the idea to create even a better tool as oxygen and what do you get for it ? nothing only a lot of years wasted on creating a modelling tool wich isnt word anything when someone release one for free

just my 2 cents

[Guest]

Some person will ahem ***leak it*** So i aint bothered.

[pathfinder 0]

Its to bad about oxy , the main stream pc mags never gave OFP their seal of greatness. So we "the fans" were all BIS had. And now they went and pissed off the the fan base. Whats sad is that there was talk from the mechwarrior commuinty that ppl wanted to make some mech mods when oxy came out,opening up a whole new need for many ppl to buy OFP.

I was looking forward to those mech mods to , fighting a mech with a human would have been cool.

[SoD Max 1]

pathfinder , you may not find too many that will support the idea for mechs in OFP . I for one have thought about it . But I think your right . It would brinmg in wayyyy more people . Microsoft flightsim 2002 fan base has just started bringing new planes into the game . So many that you can have a new plane evrey 2 days ! Now wouldnt that be nice to have new models every week instead of when BIS says we can have it ? Of course it would . But we cant expect too much from gewbers like BIS . Alot of you say that they've been nice . I think not . They released the game with a great editor . In hopes that we would make great missions . Hense the lazy chumps make money off of our time . Why hire someone to make more campaigns when we can do it . That is a idea for profit more than friendship . Anyone that wants to keep a strong base will release tools . I used to think BIS was a real gaming company and maybe at one time they were . Not now , since they have VBS going strong . Keep up the presure guys....

[SoD Max 1]

Heres a lil more info from Murik ,murry , al , hell what ever he thinks his name is . He has listed 5 resons why he wont release it and the fourth reson which should be the first if it was a real reson "4) The tools are result of many years of our work and the tools have very high value. We have serious concerns the tools could be used for some unauthorized commercial products or another acitivity we don't want to support at present stage." = Bullshi.t then

heres number 2

"2) The tools are useless to vaste majority of people because of the complexity of modeling for Operation Flashpoint. Also, the tools in current stage are still not really polished so there's no purpose giving them to general public without some more documentation and tutorials. This is one the things we hope will be developed in conjuction with various MOD making teams. We believe it's much better way to start with more limited number of users now and extend the availability of tools later to wider audience in right time and right form." Ill tell you now Its when we say turd brain . We leave you , and you have no one . Just try and piss us off BIS . WE ARE GETTING MORE PISSED EVERY LAME ASSED EXCUSE YOU USE ! ITS ABOUT MONEY ! DONT LIE ABOUT IT .

"We believe it's much better way to start with more limited number of users now and extend the availability of tools later to wider audience in right time and right form." = please wait on us to make our buck so we can get out of the communist housing . You have really messed up turd . Unless I see real repentance Im not coming back , nor will i buy thier stuff anymore .......PISS OFF

Oh and one more thing . The way they end thier comments of how they reserve the right crap . Thats like getting legal with your buisness partner . You do that and you will lose all trust . Believe me , I own my own buisness . The things they are doing isnt right at all . Comment like that make me get REAL ugly . Now if they wouldnt act like that it wouldnt bring the prick in me . Damn u bis I'm super pissed you did this . Shame shame

[ran 0]

max

they didn't say that they only made it four 2 or 3 teams of things wich will become commercial

they'll give the tools first to the serious mod team to evaluate the capacities of the thing , to polish it , and to make somedocumentation ,the only result if they would release it to the public now would be hundred of people losted in the dialog boxes of oxygen , and then every body would cry about the lack of documentation ....... is there any way for you to return on the way of the reason ?? you were way more sympathic and reasonnable on the ofpec before

[TWANG III 0]

late june, how many will care about ofp by then? who knows how many good games will be released along with tools to mod them. right now im enjoying MOHAA online which is far better mplay than ofp is. maybe it doesnt have the missions which take an hour to start up then u get killed with first shot and sit out the rest. and if Bullshit Interactive Studios gives it to a few im sure a massive contract where if you sneeze wrong you will be sued for all yer worth. tip: put marek's head on some soldiers in the editor and have some fun!!!!

[SoD Max 1]

Yes Ran I know I used to be wayyy more resonable . And at the start of the post I was . But the more BIS says we dont owe you . and they are right , they dont . But I consider this to be a friendship in the name of good games . At least I used too . They started as friends but they are getting to big to be friends anymore . Now I hope you understand a lil better ....

[the nothing 0]

Forget what I just said.

[Matthijs 40]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ran @ Mar. 02 2002,01:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">max

they didn't say that they only made it four 2 or 3 teams  of things wich will become commercial

they'll give the tools first to the serious mod team to evaluate the capacities of the thing , to polish it , and to make somedocumentation ,the only result if they would release it to the public now would be hundred of people losted in the dialog boxes of oxygen , and then every body would cry about the lack of documentation ....... is there any way for you to return on the way of the reason ?? you were way more sympathic and reasonnable on the ofpec before<span id='postcolor'>

Hmmm..

I think nobody expected a full blown Gmax-like tool.

Did you ever take a look at the Rogue Spear modelling tools?

I've seen more great mods than complaints about these tools.

And I can assure you: THEY ARE ****ING HARD to master and not quite stable either. Hardly any documentation came out for these tools.

Nonetheless, the Rogue Spear modding community has been huge, now getting overshadowed by Ghost Recon and it would have been dwarved by the OFP community, IF ONLY...

[762WorldOrder 0]

Why doesn't BIS just take a lot of models from the community and put the best ones in a free add-on patch? They can import them themselves so they don't have to release Oxygen to the cheaters, and they can provide a good package of models for people to use without getting everyone's installs mismatched.

I hate trying to get in an online game and getting kicked because I don't have a certain model. If they would release an official patch, everyone would know to get it and we'd all have the models needed to play a variety of different themes and missions.

[madmike 0]

Thats a good idea, give BIS a e-mail about it.

That seems like a very good solution

[SoD Max 1]

Cheating is not even a REAL consern . Remember we all have to have that add-on in order for it to work . When we spot someone doing that , they WILL be delt with . lol If you guys really understood this you would be pissed too . The ONLY real reson BIS has for not releasing is , that its thier stuff (oxygen) . THAT is the only thing I will agree on . The other resons they list are totally lame and they know it . Its about the doe bro . The money you know !?

BTW placebo's post up top about "enough of the complaint threads" hes not saying you cant post here , he means stop starting new threads .

[TWANG III 0]

hey max do you have MOHAA?

[billy22 0]

"Screwed by the pooch again...

I agree with CampKiller... They NEVER should have told us it would be released to ALL who wanted it on 'x' date. Then at the last second pull the plug.

Ive been building models for several EA and ID games for over 4years now. Last year I cooled my engines and basically stopped modelling because I really could'nt find a game out there that turned me on. I even shut down 2 websites, one of which carried over 100 car models for SCGT... I just got bored with it all. Then I discovered OFP... that was about 3mos. ago...

Since then Ive spent atleast 4hrs. a day working on models in 3ds. just for OFP and the anticipated release of Oxygen (as PROMISED mind you.) and now I feel as tho this has all be a HUGE waste of time... why?

1) Im not building a "MoD"!!!!!!... just a few cool addon's

2) Im not a professional modeller- I like to come and go as the wind blows. I don't need a job a BiS.

3) Im new to the OFP community... and don't have my nose buried up anyone's arse here.... yet:)

So in a phrase.. "The odds of someone like me getting Oxygen are laughable at best."

This is not what we were told... this why so many are angry.

Good thing it was not a bone you were offering my dog... MEDIC! I guess I can go pull my web-site down now eh?

But am I really suprised? NO! I've been a portfolio manager for 7 years now. I had a sneaky feeling this would happen. The real story is right here:

Currently, a Betaversion is ready to be released for non-commercial projects only and subject of written agreement between Bohemia Interactive Studio and anyone interested in using the tools.

Plain and simple... BIS is looking around and seeing these MoD's ppl are prepairing, they realize the $ potential of these MoD as an addon CD. You (BIS) get these ppl to sign an agreement, profit shareing/whatever... you give them Oxygen

they create the MoD... you (BIS) have to do nothing but market the MoD when it's finished and reap the profits.

Think about it if you were BIS you would do the same thing...

The only reason they told us (strung us along) last month they were going to release Oxygen... is that several of the good MoD creaters at the time were pulling the plug on there project because BIS would not say when or if they were going to release Oxygen.... Soon as the letter came out mentioning the end or Feb...... whooosh all the sudden everyone was full steam ahead again.

What really yanks my chain is there dishonesty. The truth is what I have said above.... but BIS would like to you believe it's all for the good of the community not to release it thereby keeping crappy MoD out of the box... (as if there are not ANY foalting around out there now...lol)

Jesus H. Christ that is SO... lame... your right BIS... I have been using computers since 1992 and I still have'nt figured out what the hell that DELETE key is for...

P.S. ...they are also scared someone will try and sell there MoD, of course they could easily sue... but why go thru all that when all you need to do it not pass out the big O. "

I think you nailing Bullshit right there. Dont worry my friends just rememeber that Bullshit wants our vote(money). Like dishonest politician just dont vote for that person again. There are plenty of choice out there i hope

[Matthijs 40]

It just hit me: Maybe it's not BIS who are the assholes...

It might well be that the people @ BIS are a bunch of simple tech'ies, like us, that got fucked by Codemasters...

---

Think of it, a couple of friends start out programming their wildest idea's, much like David Braben did when he started programming the game Elite.

After a few years of contstruction in their spare time, they find out that to finish the game, they will need to put some serious time into it. They needed a sponsor. This is where Codemasters comes in. Codemasters buys the intellectual property of Flashpoint and puts the BIS people on its payroll.

Apart from that, they give BIS a deadline, because Codemasters is going to get the PR machine rolling. This is where the first problem arises. The peoples of BIS are just a bunch of enthusiastic tech'ies that don't have any real experience in planning or PR. The game gets packaged rather quickly, because the deadline is actually a bit too short - the main reason for the many bugs in OFP.

The world dances in joy as Flashpoint comes out. BIS drinks champaign over the succes of their little pride and joy 'OFP', and Codemasters sees the cash flow in. Everyone seems happy, until one bad day...

After releasing some free models, BIS decides they want to leverage the succes of (what they think is) their game by bringing out a bunch of modding tools. Without conferencing with Codemasters, they put this up on their boards. Suddenly Codemasters comes in: "Sorry, it is not your game, it's our game. And we say, you are not releasing modding tools!

BIS being tech'ies and not having any clue of how to address big crowds (they only know how to make good games), makes the tradional mistakes: not telling the public, trying to convince Codemasters otherwise and only at the last moment, when they just can't do anything else, say 'we will not etc.'

Quite a classic example of bad communication, tech'ies getting fucked by sales people and the wrong party getting blamed for the shit.

BIS can't just put up a fight with Codemasters. After all Codemasters legally owns their game, and with BIS being on Codemasters payroll, Codemasters basically owns their very ass.

---

Could this be the case?

Let me know what you think...

[Sith 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">But am I really suprised? NO! I've been a portfolio manager for 7 years now. I had a sneaky feeling this would happen. The real story is right here:

Currently, a Betaversion is ready to be released for non-commercial projects only and subject of written agreement between Bohemia Interactive Studio and anyone interested in using the tools.

Plain and simple... BIS is looking around and seeing these MoD's ppl are prepairing, they realize the $ potential of these MoD as an addon CD. You (BIS) get these ppl to sign an agreement, profit shareing/whatever... you give them Oxygen

they create the MoD... you (BIS) have to do nothing but market the MoD when it's finished and reap the profits.

Think about it if you were BIS you would do the same thing...

The only reason they told us (strung us along) last month they were going to release Oxygen... is that several of the good MoD creaters at the time were pulling the plug on there project because BIS would not say when or if they were going to release Oxygen.... Soon as the letter came out mentioning the end or Feb...... whooosh all the sudden everyone was full steam ahead again.

What really yanks my chain is there dishonesty. The truth is what I have said above.... but BIS would like to you believe it's all for the good of the community not to release it thereby keeping crappy MoD out of the box... (as if there are not ANY foalting around out there now...lol)

Jesus H. Christ that is SO... lame... your right BIS... I have been using computers since 1992 and I still have'nt figured out what the hell that DELETE key is for...<span id='postcolor'>

Dude....you're getting upset about your own little rumour here

What you're suggesting is simply bullshit. MODs are NON-COMMERCIAL products. They're made by fans just for the fun of it, no cash involved. If you check out Marek's first post on this matter, you'll see that anyone with commercial plans for the tools has to contact BIS about it and then they'll look into it seperately from the MOD requests.

If you dont believe me...just go ahead and ask any MOD team about this matter. I can assure you that 99% of them will NOT agree with their project becoming a cash-cow for BIS just to get the tools.

[colt 0]

@ Matthijs.

You've made an excellent point, I mean it is BIS after all that that has been posting news and answering questions. Has anyone seen a Codemasters statement?

Also is it a bad idea that hardcore modders are going to get a BETA version of Oxygen ? I'm sure that one of the main problems was in translating the commands and documentation that Oxygen uses. By doing this, BIS will get constructive feedback from experienced community modders who can say " we don't quite understand this command " or " we don't really need this, but this could be more accessable ".

And when the general public is eventually given access to a refined and well documented Oxygen - there will already be modders who can provide help without everyone hounding BIS on how put in a simple cube.

The OFP environment seems to be quite complex ( correct me if I'm wrong ).

I include myself in the above as well, because before this game i had no interest in modding or 3d models. Yet I found myself nearly downloading various moddling apps - and I can just imagine some of the more " basic" questions I would have asked. Now multiply this by thousands and you can see how chaotic it would have been.

BIS said they would TRY to release the tools but unfortunately they haven't been able to. How many of us have been in a similar situation when we have tried our best to do something but regretably had to change our mind because of other factors and not because of ÅÅÅ.

[Goodspeed 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Dude....you're getting upset about your own little rumour here

What you're suggesting is simply bullshit. MODs are NON-COMMERCIAL products. They're made by fans just for the fun of it, no cash involved. If you check out Marek's first post on this matter, you'll see that anyone with commercial plans for the tools has to contact BIS about it and then they'll look into it seperately from the MOD requests.

If you dont believe me...just go ahead and ask any MOD team about this matter. I can assure you that 99% of them will NOT agree with their project becoming a cash-cow for BIS just to get the tools.<span id='postcolor'>

Please dont tell me that Operation Vietnam or Invasion 1944 will cost nothing...

And take a look on BTL They were sold campaign without any objections from BIS or Codemasters as i know...

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Please dont tell me that Operation Vietnam or Invasion 1944 will cost nothing...<span id='postcolor'>

IF they do then you will have a reason to be upset but dont even bother to try and presume you know what they will do.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And take a look on BTL They were sold campaign without any objections from BIS or Codemasters as i know...<span id='postcolor'>

Editor was released without any real terms and conditions..I believe/hope you will have to sign some sort of terms and conditions whereby you cant sell anything you create.

[ran 0]

i don't know if you know about it but , the guys of xmp.de made a ampaign for ofp ...... and not for free without the approval of bis .............. i can say that the campaign was very difficult to find 3 days after the date of the release

and no , i know the i44 team leader , and it will be free as long as the i'44 team will be involved in the project so , we won't pay for it until a very long moment ( maybe the eternity so .... )

and why every body think that they will pay for the mods ?? the result of a rumor launched by a dickhead on these forums maybe