Weight impact

[max power 21]

A friend of mine who is in the Canadian reserves said that ammo dumping is a big problem among c6 gunners on excercise. I guess they don't like to pack all that brass around. I can see for or against this issue... If it's something bohemia is interested in doing, I think it would take some doing to keep ai squads cohesive. If you think 'where are you?' is annoying now, imagine when all of your machinegunner units are out of breath 400 yards behind you even before you hit a forest!

[dirtylarrygb 0]

A friend of mine who is in the Canadian reserves said that ammo dumping is a big problem among c6 gunners on excercise. I guess they don't like to pack all that brass around. I can see for or against this issue... If it's something bohemia is interested in doing, I think it would take some doing to keep ai squads cohesive. If you think 'where are you?' is annoying now, imagine when all of your machinegunner units are out of breath 400 yards behind you even before you hit a forest!

Well someone who lugs the real thing points out he has to keep up with his squad. No junk food for you eh?

So making them run slower could be a gameplay fix but isn't realistic.

So a MP balance would be either a accuracy junk, same way CS Joint Op's and BF handeld the problem, not my favorite way as this junks the weapon.

Or a Limit to LMG's users per side, aka 5-10 players for each MG. I would suggest that should also apply to Snipers are you can end up with teams of snipers and gunners in some MP games.

I know you can pick you role, but how are limits set on most servers on the amout of people per role as an average?

[Beagle 684]

Oh... I forgot to mention...running in open areas is not the usual kind of movement in infantrie business...hm...at least it was not 10 years ago.

[dirtylarrygb 0]

Oh... I forgot to mention...running in open areas is not the usual kind of movement in infantrie business...hm...at least it was not 10 years ago.

Depends what's chasing you in MP, be it a sniper a tank a chopper etc. I feel the balance issue of weight effects SP in the sim sense and MP in the gameplay balance sense.

Hence I'm worried we might get a MP LMG accuracy nerf as so many other games impose. Back in the beta days the SAW in CS was awesome, it was the most exepsive gun to buy but a real killer when used right. Nerf after nerf left it, a fun bang bang "stick you head down" toy gun.

BF:2 nerfed the MG36 which was the best gun in the game set to three round burst in just 2 patches.

[Balschoiw 0]

doublepost

[max power 21]

IRL military squads don't sprint for a half an hour to run across an island. They march places they need to get to on foot. If you were walking everywhere in ArmA you wouldn't have the 'Where are you?' problem to begin with.

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]I carried it 20km a day, by night, on assaults, anytime.

I had to keep up in speed with the rest of the squad and I did.

You forgot to add that you didn´t carry the ammo boxes and the barrels.

On combat training you surely SOMETIMES had to march 20 km´s but that was for sure very, very rare and on marches like that the machinegunners often swapped the weapon with their mg2, the one carrying the ammoboxes and the barrels. the jogging we see in Arma certainyl won´t be able with a MG3 over 20 km´s. Don´t tell nonsense.

Quote[/b] ]Oh... I forgot to mention...running in open areas is not the usual kind of movement in infantrie business...hm...at least it was not 10 years ago.

Sprung auf , Marsch, Marsch is still a valid approach, isn´t it ?

On the weight issue:

Very hard to implement on a reasonable level wihout loosing mobility of the team as a whole while proceeding on foot.

Keep in mind that the terrain is huge and so will the mission distances be. I guess as a matter of playability weight will not make into ArAs. If we really wanted to have totally realistic in maps that take 2 or more hours ingame time we would have to take a lot of other aspects into consideration aswell, not just the weight of equipment. Isolating this issue from the rest would be even more surreal than what we have now.

In the end it´s about the mission - creator to balance the equipment stuff. If there´s reasonable limited acess to heavy weapons they will not "overpower" the battles as they are rare.

There are simply not 6 machinegunners in one team if the mission editor sets it up reasonable and limits crate contents and such.

What I had hoped for in Arma was a role specific punishment when you use a weapon you are not "educated" with. Means, if you choose a regular grunt in the mission setup screen you should get a more shaky aim with weapons you are not trained with. Still, maybe this can be scripted as a block an put into MP missions as a template script, just like the spectating script.

On the other hand I already hear people complaining that they have a shaky aim with weapons they are not educated with.

I guess it´s simply hard to satisfy everyone with a game like Arma.

[Beagle 684]

Sprung auf , Marsch, Marsch is still a valid approach, isn´t it ?

In basic infantry training yes, but even in manouvers you want to minimize the need for situations that force you to do so.

btw.

1st. Yes you share the Load with your second gunner, but keep in mind that you don't play a single ArmA mission for 2 hrs.

2nd.

I was a member of a spezialized competition squad trained for the, at that decade, annual "Boeselager" international recon-forces competition.

I had 5 of this 20km Leistungsmärsche including those as a reservist and I carried the MG 2 times the for whole Distance.

And that was never such a problem since in RL you and your squad are not zipping around the places.

that's more of a typical FPS behaviour.

PS: found something, I'm the nice one...;)

I think such a feature would make sense only in missions lasting for more than two hours.

[monkeyboy27 0]

I reckon the guys with the heavy loads should get fatigued quicker, but thats it. Their walking and jogging speeds should remain the same, just they get tired faster if they sprint too much.

This way everybody would move the same speed when the infantry is in formation, but if somebody is using the sprint too much, then some of the squad will get left behind.

[Beagle 684]

No two man are the same, one can run with a heavy Weapon as long as another with a light one.

For a game this means, that factor ist negligible or you have to do it in the H&D RPG like way where the charakter choice is a key feature to each mission.

[kestrel7e7 0]

Yeah, let's make it like CS.

"What do you mean, why am I holding a knife? I run faster with a knife. Everyone runs faster with a knife. " PP

[hokum15 2]

All sing along now!

Whats that coming over the hill is it a "M9 bunny hopping suicide squad" is it a "M9 bunny hopping suicide squad"?

OK Troops, you three with the M249's crawl to this position and lay supressing fire.

You three commence running around like jack rabbits on crack and take the enemy from the left flank...

Though i get the idea, i think that all the difference that the game should do is make those carrying heavy gear tire faster than those with out.

[max power 21]

I think that's all that anyone advocating such a thing is saying... but when soldiers get tired in ArmA, their maximum movement rate decreases..

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

I am a freak of reality, but what I want is even not in VBS2. Of course soldiers getting exhausted by heavier load and longer distance in VBS2 (at least is is written in the feature description).

What I gently wish is the implementation of weight, simplified volume/shape, inertia, mechanical resistance. Many strange behaviour we see currently is due to the much more simplified design of the physical engine.

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]

What I gently wish is the implementation of weight, simplified volume/shape, inertia, mechanical resistance.

You´re basically asking for a complete redesign of the engine, the units used and the physics compartment of Arma.

[dirtylarrygb 0]

Quote[/b] ]

What I gently wish is the implementation of weight, simplified volume/shape, inertia, mechanical resistance.

You´re basically asking for a complete redesign of the engine, the units used and the physics compartment of Arma.

I'm pretty happy with waht we have got.

I finally got alot of MP done today, and as I suspected LMG's in ARMA are as powerful as real life. The fire Support, Suppresion accuracy and sheer killing power make them very deadly weapons. They are not currently nerfed as LNG's in virtually all other shooters.

Yes they are baalanced by clever tatics or just armour comeing at them or a clevel sniper. But I can imagine amny people will complain for HOLD style BF2 ARMA MP people will whine for a nerf.

Till them I'm enjoying sprinting round setting up arcs of fire and racking up kills. Like BF2 PKM seems better than the SAW

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

@Balschoiw: Yes, I do, but for Game2. I guess the global design for physics is almost the same for OFP and ArmA since we fight with exactly the same problems.

[Barry the baldy 0]

IRL A team only moves as fast as its slowest member, so you'd have to consider slowing teams

[Beagle 684]

IRL A team only moves as fast as its slowest member, so you'd have to consider slowing teams

very good point...!