FADE

[ConanOfOz 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Psycho1 @ Feb. 07 2002,06:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Care to explain why you think other people in MP can make you have FADE?  I find that VERY hard to believe, I've never experienced any problems whatsoever concerning FADE even though I've seen that "original games don't FADE" message in MP several times.

Concerning trainers.....if the trainers work for single player than their will probably be a way to get trainers to work in MP as well.  OFP already has built in cheats for you to use in single player if you are having a hard time, their is absolutely no reason for you to need a trainer in single player.  You can save all you want in each mission, just hit left shift and - on numpad, than type in savegame and you got an updated position.  I'm pretty sure their are several other cheat codes built into the game that can help you, so I'll have to say again that their is no excuse for using a trainer in OFP.<span id='postcolor'>

I don't use the in-game chets so I don't know from experience, but rumour has it that there *IS* a difference between in-game and external trainers. The in-games cheats do come complete with penalties. Some one even said they could trigger FADE...

...Hey, just repeating what I heard.

FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE... Trainers have NOT caused fade in my game, least ways I've never had that message about counterfeit copies. *BUT* whether or not I use a trainer, I *DO* find that after a few hours of play that the game becomes so disk-bound (ie the hard drive is going crazy) that the whole thing is unplayable. This is especially annoying when an "Updating Retry Position" occurs in the middle of a heated battle or while flying a chopper close to the ground. When control is returned, I'm stuffed. I've been shot six ways from Sunday, or I've augered (or even done a full-on face plant).

The only way to clear this problem is to reboot. Then things are pretty good once more...

[ConanOfOz 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (FetishFool @ Feb. 08 2002,00:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Sorry for the late reply:

Any change in gameplay is a result of either FADE, or a faulty addon.  Either way, your gameplay will be different.

Everything is a sign of FADE.  If your gun doesn't reload after the first time, or if you seem to be running slower than the AI, or if you get lock-ups during gameplay...  Making a list of signs of FADE would be endless.

Psycho1, if you get the "Original games do not FADE" message during MP, then you have FADE.

If you're not cheating, or using any unofficial addons, then you know it has to be a third-party that's causing your FADE.

I just know that people in MP can give you FADE because of my experiences.  

Especially when your PK clip shortens to 30 rounds, and your M60 sounds like an MP5.  This just tells you that someone's addons are changing your game.

And since their minor addons can change the core of your game, they can give you FADE.<span id='postcolor'>

Can't agree with you... These things are hardly "evidence". For example, your clip-size seemingly being reduced can also be because you are reloading before a clip is empty, you've run out of full clips (a common occurence with things like PK's) so when you reload, you have a less-than-full clip available. That's normal gameplay.

[cnskin 0]

well all this is bs fade is fake or doesn't work very well i used to have a downloaded version to try out the game cus the demo didn't show all of the game i liked it so buyed it i had no fade at all.

[Rogue2020 0]

I think it takes allot for fade....I see operation flashpoint all over winMX for download...and I saw a no CD crack for version 4.2.....

[Major Fubar 0]

Why FADE? If the game can detect cracked EXE's or whatever, why not just have the game refuse to start. That way a cracker would know right off his cracked version ain't gonna work, and save all of us legit tyes the hassle of always wondering if the FADE monster is going to sneak up on us and ruin our nice legal copy of the game.

Too much to ask for?

[Rogue2020 0]

Yeah that would be nice but they would be able to hack it....these guys always can.....

[nopulse 0]

I can't see how FADE is caused by using the "internal" cheats. I find that very hard to believe. Programmers often put in "cheat" codes in games so that when the test a level, they don't have to worry about getting killed or restarting.

Personally I think FADE is a spook story like "Keyser Soze"

How can they code something that degrades the game from your HD? It doesn't make sense. Its like saying "hi" we implanted a virus on your machine. If you cheat or alter the code in any way, you will awake the sleeping dragon.

And honestly, I think FADE could be used as an excuse for sloppy coding. Like if there is any kind of problem with the game, BIS can just reply "its caused by fade". And not the fact that they missed up somewhere in the coding.

OPF is a really bugging game. Its no wonder why at least every month there is a new "patch" for it.

I understand that making a game is not easy and a lot of time and effort goes into it and it won't be perfect when its released.

[Major Fubar 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (nopulse @ Feb. 12 2002,01:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And honestly, I think FADE could be used as an excuse for sloppy coding.  Like if there is any kind of problem with the game, BIS can just reply "its caused by fade".  And not the fact that they missed up somewhere in the coding.<span id='postcolor'>

Right on the money.

I love OFP, and it's honestly the best game ever, but FADE sucks @$$!

[ufo_hk 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (nopulse @ Feb. 12 2002,01:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And honestly, I think FADE could be used as an excuse for sloppy coding.  Like if there is any kind of problem with the game, BIS can just reply "its caused by fade".  And not the fact that they missed up somewhere in the coding.<span id='postcolor'>

Put a little more thought and research into this !!!

Why have BI released:

1.1 / 1.2 / 1.3 / 1.4 / 1.42 and yet have not yet used the excuse you raised. It's because they support their product and are trying to give you the best experience possible.

Why do they have a post in the trouble shooting section which specifically stating inaccurate m/g are the result of fade? (yet brought out three patchs after they posted this info). If you think about this gives you the answer to your question: "How can they code something that degrades the game from your HD?" - you simply make different data calls based upon a specific situation.

Fade is something codemasters wanted - not BI.

Also fade is easy to confirm - load two PCs on a LAN from the same CD (then multiplay), and watch the message warning. Then do the same with two different copies, notice any message?

If you're using legal copies you have nothing to fear.

If you think you're experiencing fade using legal setup - BI have said contact them and they will look into it. Funny that no one posts.

"Hey I have FADE - but BI won't help me." and show supporting evidence.

Stop worrying about Fade and go enjoy the game.

[Sith 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Why FADE? If the game can detect cracked EXE's or whatever, why not just have the game refuse to start. That way a cracker would know right off his cracked version ain't gonna work, and save all of us legit tyes the hassle of always wondering if the FADE monster is going to sneak up on us and ruin our nice legal copy of the game.<span id='postcolor'>

You just answered your own question...

"That way a cracker would know right off his cracked version ain't gonna work"

FADE is every crackers worst nightmare, simply because you cant just 'start cracking, test it a bit...see if it works or not, and then release the crack'.

FADE would require you to make a crack, test it for atleast several weeks, only to find out that it's still in there...

Well I think you can understand that most crackers dont wanna spend 2-3 months just testing and adjusting their 'work' over and over again to see whether they got it right this time. The guy that came up with the idea for this system is one smart dude

[Rogue2020 0]

It starts to piss me off....because shit at times I WANT TO CHEAT....and you just can't do it.....

[ufo_hk 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Rogue2020 @ Feb. 14 2002,00:22)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">It starts to piss me off....because shit at times I WANT TO CHEAT....and you just can't do it.....<span id='postcolor'>

And that makes me happy - good work BI on knocking the cheats. (not the pissing off Rogue)

[Rogue2020 0]

Yeah and you know what happened when I wanted to cheat and I couldn't?...I quit the game and haven't played it since............

What's the point?...why go back through the game when it's going to be the same thing over and over again.....

All these people that say cheats suck are just multiplayer freaks....they don't play single player enough to even go through the game enough to want it to be different.....I tried elite force online the other day and one guy said he has never even played single player before....and the multiplayer was one of those cheap ass super fast moving running around picking up weapons and shooting people.....lots of fags jumping up and down...........

[nopulse 0]

I agree entirely with Rogue2020, why bother playing the game again if you can't use cheats to pound the crap out of the computer.  I haven't played the single player missions and campaign missions since I've beaten both the Cold War Crisis and Red Hammer.  It sits on my shelve collecting dust.

Personally I think it was a bad call on BIS part for having FADE activated if you use "cheat codes" or "trainers".  I mean whats wrong if you want to cheat in single player missions only.  Say if your stuck on a particular mission and you've tried playing the mission 100 times and you still can't beat it, you use a cheat code or trainer to get by that particular mission.  If you can't use cheat codes or trainers to help you get past the mission, you get super frustrated and don't ever play the game again.  

Thats why games like Half Life, MOHAA, RTCW etc get good reviews because there is no FADE garbage to worry about.  And if your struck, you can use the cheat codes that the game developers left in the game to use.

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love OPF.    I think its a wicked game since you can fly jets and helicopters, drive tanks, boats and jeeps and be infantry.  There is no other game like it.   I think its the best game ever and I can't wait for Independence Lost to come out.  But if it wasn't for the multiplayer option, it would be sitting on the shelve.

But how do you know FADE is real?  I'd like actual proof.  Its like saying the government is always telling you the truth. ufo_hk made a statement that run 2 legit copies on 2 different systems and then run 2 "illegal" copies on 2 different systems and compare.  But lets not forget that not all systems are built equally either.  I mean a lot of people I play online with that have legit copies of them game have had a ton of problems with OPF especially running win98.  Where as I've only had the occasional problem in Win XP.

As I've said before, Personally I think FADE is a spook story like "Keyser Soze".  Its to deter hackers from making an illegal copy of the game.  I've bought the game an since day one, I've seen the " Remember: Original Games do not FADE".  Explain to me why I get that msg when I have bought a legit copy of the game?

I just hope that they fix a lot of problems in Independence Lost before its released.  Especially the horrible interface for multiplayer.  I lot of people are now calling OPF, Operation Chatpoint, or Operation Waitpoint because you practically wait like 30-60mins for a game to start because as soon as everyone is "greened up" someone else joins the server and you have wait.  Or theres people that are AFK.  I hope they seriously change it and make it more like RTCW or MOHAA where you can join in any game at any point.

But Kudos to BIS for OPF.  ITs a great game never the less.

[Lupus23 0]

I do not believe fade exists.

I have a legit copy of OFP. But my old CD-ROM hated safedisc. So I was forced into using no cd hacks to play my legit, bought and paid for CD straight from Best Buy.

The game runs flawlessly on my system, it has 01/05/02 at 15:21 PM which is when I bought it.

The only problems I have had is in the CD detection. I was able to patch from 1.20 to 1.40 normally. It detected the CD properly.

But, then the game would not run. So I had to find and download a no cd patch. This worked great for me.

But I then could not patch to 1.42, because it would not properly detect the CD. So I was able to find a hacked version of the 1.42 upgrade, I used that. I then got a new 1.42 no cd patch. That worked great to.

I just got a new CD rom today, so hopefully I won't have problems with Safedisc games anymore. I haven't tried any of them yet without no cd patches.

But, that's not the point of my post. The point is I went through all this trouble, use all the hacked patches and everything went fine. I've never had any game play issues, and the game has NEVER crashed on me. Not ever. OFP is easily the most stable game I own. Everything always works great.

So, 1 of 3 things is happening here.

#1 Fade is a myth to scare little kids away. (Which I am sure it doesn't BTW. The hackers would have figured out FADE is bogus in the first 48 hours after release.)

#2 FADE doesn't work worth a crap. The hackers have patched it as easily as fixing the CD detection.

#3 BIS lied and FADE is tied to the serial number not the exe. To install I used the serial number that was on the last page of the booklet that came with the game.

I have yet to hear one creditable story of FADE. Everything that I have hear is just common problems that are more likely the result of non-compatable hardware or software/driver issues.

FYI, my syetem specs are such:

AMD Athlon 1900+

Soyo Dragon+ MOBO (Using onboard c-media sound)

512MB DDR

Geforce3 Ti500

If you do have a creditable FADE story I'd like to hear it.

[Lupus23 0]

Sorry for the double post. But, I have in one instance used an internal cheat too. The one that automaticly get's you through a mission. Don't remember what it is off hand, but it did not cause FADE either.

[Major Fubar 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">You just answered your own question...

"That way a cracker would know right off his cracked version ain't gonna work"<span id='postcolor'>

OK, I see the sense in that, and that's fine, but can BIS guarantee me 100% that FADE will NEVER interfere with a legal installation, even if addons and such are applied?

If they can, then I fully retract all of my complaints about FADE.  

(You only need to look around these forums at the number of threads raised with complaints about FADE too see how concerned people are...and not ALL of them can be using hacked versions, so that means there are plenty of legit game owners out there who are worried!)

Oh, and for the record Rogue, I'm right with you on cheating...as long as it's not multiplayer, there's nothing wrong with it. It's just a bit of fun, and can help if you get stuck in a game. (I guess to all you hardcore nuts that makes me seem lame, but if it does, it's YOUR problem, not MINE! Jeebus, it's only a game!) :

[nopulse 0]

Lupus23 Posted on Feb. 14 2002,07:03 </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">But, that's not the point of my post. The point is I went through all this trouble, use all the hacked patches and everything went fine.  I've never had any game play issues, and the game has NEVER crashed on me. Not ever.  OFP is easily the most stable game I own. Everything always works great.

So, 1 of 3 things is happening here.

#1 Fade is a myth to scare little kids away. (Which I am sure it doesn't BTW.  The hackers would have figured out FADE is bogus in the first 48 hours after release.)

#2 FADE doesn't work worth a crap. The hackers have patched it as easily as fixing the CD detection.

#3 BIS lied and FADE is tied to the serial number not the exe.  To install I used the serial number that was on the last page of the booklet that came with the game.

I have yet to hear one creditable story of FADE. Everything that I have hear is just common problems that are more likely the result of non-compatable hardware or software/driver issues.

<span id='postcolor'>

Exactly. Well put. As I've said all along, FADE is either or both

A) A spook story to deter people from making illegal copies of

the game

B) A scapegoat for BIS so they can blame all the problems

people are having with the game on FADE. They can blame

the fact that they missed something in the code on FADE

and not own up to the fact that they screwed up some

where in the coding.

If this so-called FADE exists, then explain to me why people with legit bought copies are getting the FADE msg? Doesn't make sense if people have legit copies. Its like Microsofts illegal operation error you get in Windows. The reason why the error pops up is because Microsoft simply forgot to finish the code and the illegal operation error translated means: oppps we messed up in the coding, we didn't expect you to do that and we forgot to code that part into the OS.

But what really bothers me is the fact that using trainers or add-ons can cause fade. What a joke. Whats the point of including tools to make add-ons or maps if they cause FADE. It defeats the purpose. As I've said before, what makes a game great is the fact that you can keep adding to it. Like The Sims, you can create your own people, houses, objects etc. You don't have to keep using the same boring stuff that games with the game. You can download new things.

I've noticed too when someone makes a poll on what BIS should fix or include in the next patch etc. They close the poll extremely fast. Or they never comment on anything or explain why things happen. They simply ignore questions. EA, ID soft, Janes etc have all wrriten me back with solutions to some problems. Honestly why have a trouble shooting section in the forum if BIS never responds. Maybe its because they don't know the answers.

[Sith 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I've bought the game an since day one, I've seen the " Remember: Original Games do not FADE". Explain to me why I get that msg when I have bought a legit copy of the game?<span id='postcolor'>

Because all players on a server get to see that mssg when some1 is using an illegal copy (often followed by that person getting auto-kicked). It's actually quite funny when it happens...

"Remember: Original Games do not FADE"

"Player_X disconnected"

I've seen it happen tonnes of times....more than enough proof for me. I've seen the other FADE elements in action too...lousy MG accuracy (you wont be able to hit shit at 10 meters), locked vehicles (while they should be open), etc, etc...

Now you can call me a liar or whatever you want....but I'm just telling you what I've seen happen to illegal copies. And no, they're not bugs being covered up under the excuse of "Fade", cuz we all know the aforementioned symptoms are not bugs.

As Lupus said, there are ingame cheats you can use to skip missions and stuff, so there's no need for trainers that usually mess up most games (even the ones without Fade).

[Gorgi Knootewoot 0]

I agree,

[Sith 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Whats the point of including tools to make add-ons or maps if they cause FADE.<span id='postcolor'>

ROFL!!

Do you honestly think that the tools BIS will release (soon) will trigger Fade? Dude, only unofficial tools might cause Fade (only of they change the core code). This is one weak argument.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I've noticed too when someone makes a poll on what BIS should fix or include in the next patch etc. They close the poll extremely fast.  Or they never comment on anything or explain why things happen.  They simply ignore questions.  EA, ID soft, Janes etc have all wrriten me back with solutions to some problems.  Honestly why have a trouble shooting section in the forum if BIS never responds.  Maybe its because they don't know the answers.<span id='postcolor'>

Errrr....excuse me??

The BIS I know answers more questions than ANY other developer out there I've ever met (and trust me I know alot of them).

You know why some of those polls get closed (not by BIS but by the mods)?

Because we often have 10 polls/threads concerning the same issue on the same forum....forgive us, but we think that's just a waste of forumspace. If there's a usefull post about what should be added, or changed, or whatever...we'll leave it...I'll even point BIS to those threads if it's really interesting (trust me, they read it). But if I see 10 new threads "Where are my ^%&*$% OFP tools???" or "BIS promised us 100 players online and now I order them to make it possible!!", I will delete them.

If you go to the TroubleShooting forum and ask a question, it'll be answered like 99% of the time. In the very rare occasion that there isnt a direct 'cure' for your problem, BIS will very often take note of this problem and will try to fix it asap.

[nopulse 0]

Sith,

I apologize Sith. My bad.

[Lupus23 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">

Because all players on a server get to see that mssg when some1 is using an illegal copy (often followed by that person getting auto-kicked). It's actually quite funny when it happens...

"Remember: Original Games do not FADE"

"Player_X disconnected"

<span id='postcolor'>

I don't believe this. I often play muti-player games by my self. Usually when I am setting them up and testing for missions that I am making.

I almost always, if not always get that that message. But there have never been any locked cars when there shouldn't have been, or poor accuracy or anything.

The FADE message is just a scare tatic.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">

Now you can call me a liar or whatever you want....but I'm just telling you what I've seen happen to illegal copies. And no, they're not bugs being covered up under the excuse of "Fade", cuz we all know the aforementioned symptoms are not bugs.

<span id='postcolor'>

I won't call you a liar, but I don't believe what you saw was fade. The fact of the matter is for whatever reason you are a moderator of this board, and therefore you are affiliated with BIS somehow, and anything you do say can be considered dis-information.

Honestly nothing personal, but as far as I know, one of the rules to being a moderator here is that you must support the FADE myth.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">

As Lupus said, there are ingame cheats you can use to skip missions and stuff, so there's no need for trainers that usually mess up most games (even the ones without Fade).<span id='postcolor'>

Right, I've read the in game cheats can trigger fade. Which is really idiotic. I mean no matter how you look at it. The idea of it is idiotic. If BIS really did it, it would be idiotic.

In any case, I am going to stick to my guns. FADE does not exist.

I have another computer here. It's an old K6II 500 with a Voodoo Banshee card, but if I get really motivated I might go ahead and do some tests to see if I can trigger fade on it and my base system here.

But I am guessing even if I went through all the trouble I wouldn't be able to do it.

Anyone have suggestions on official things that BIS has said will trigger it? Like I said in my last post I'm already using a modified exe. And that did do it.

Anyways, time for dinner.....

[ufo_hk 1]

Lupus - what is your point

In the same posting you say FADE is a myth - it doesn't exist.

Then in your last line you say you used a modified exe file and you implied that it triggered FADE.

If you know it doesn't exist - why are you even thinking of testing on your base system and why are you asking for what the FADE triggers are. Is it because you don't really know.

Quote - "I mean no matter how you look at it. The idea of it is idiotic. If BIS really did it, it would be idiotic." / Quote

It's actually how "you" look at it, maybe "you" just can't latch on to the reason Codemasters/BI might have for doing this. Can't you see the association between modified exe (no cd patch) and file/game distribution over the internet.

Anyway I've gone a game to play ...... stuff following this debate any further.

[Major Fubar 0]

All I want is a definitive BIS release stating what will and will not trigger FADE, and if triggered, EXACTLY what the effects will be (not just some nebulous offhand remark about "degradation").

I'm sure legit owners out there, who have put their hard earned cash into buying a copy of OFP, would like to see this release. I know I sure would. It would end this FADE debate once and for all.