Help me understand.

[Badassdom 0]

if Bush were to make arbortion ilegal how big a part of votes would he need?

[shinRaiden 0]

And what do you term to mean illeagal?

The pro-abortion arguement is that Government has no compelling right to interfere in an inherent 'human' right to one's own body and body components.

The problem is that there is no significant 'human rights' specified in the US constitution, rather a framework of legal rights granted or managed in regards to the determined citizenry. Current legal wranglings in the US are drawing on international laws and theoretical musings to determine the applicability of 'human rights'.

In reading the majority opinion of Roe v. Wade, the court found that as science, philosophy, and such has no consensus on when 'life' begins in a physical, metaphysical, or legal circumstance, the court is also not qualified to make such a determination. Therefore, they ruled that the only significantly determinable factor was the mother, that that would carry the day.

Now, to change this securely would require a constitutional amendment, similar to the amendments that corrected the initial injustice of legally defining blacks as property and not human, therefore not potential citizens, and extending full voting rights and responsibilites to women.

However, this opens the entire case of legislating a 'human rights' amendment package. It would not be fair or competent to attempt to address these issues seperately, so they need to be lumped into one big package because of the common philosophical and scientific foundations:

* Abortion

* Gay marriage

* Euthanasia

If you attempt to split them up, you are not effectively addressing the fundamentals of the issues. The question before the people is "what is life, and who is entitled to it, and who is entitled to determine it?"

Unfortunately, we don't have a serious quorum of representatives and senators who are capable of considering this. There is too much intrenched politicking and establishment to make waves to decide this one way or another. This results in the legally dangerous position of evangelicals throwing legislative barbs at the judiciary's darts, and the continuity, applicability, and respectability of the law goes right out the window.

That said, this shouldn't even need to be an issue. As a democrat said yesterday in a debate, every (partial-birth) abortion is due to some form of human tragedy. Ironically, she also said government has no business being involved in healthcare. It's too bad that that does not track with all her other statements.

[shinRaiden 0]

As for Boeing and Airbus, Boeing continually beat Airbus in sales despite the subsidies, until Boeing chose to self-destruct. Boeing is currently in the process of voluntarily shutting down commercial jet production. Why? Not because they were competative, but because they weren't interested. By closing operations, you kill head count and can write-off the expenses. That looks good on paper to the screwed-up analysts machines.

Boeing instead is choosing to focus on government pork projects. However, the new management, which drove several aquired subsideries into the ground, has embarked on a path of corruption as bad as Enron and Worldcom. Fortunately, various people in congress have been alerted and they have been putting the brakes on as best they can.

While I personally think that the subsidies != contracts, us vs. them is not a good arguement. Sadly, this problem is not unique to Boeing.

[Katrician 0]

Bar none, I can personally testify that the majority of the reason why morons get elected in the U.S. is because most dumb ass Americans are too lazy to find the "facts", not listen to just ear pleasing spin and biased "truths".

They put blind faith in individuals before gathering the facts, analyzing them, then making a serious and informed political decision on who they would vote for.

I feel Americans got what they asked for, some idiot in the president's chair who was not experienced enough in domestic AND not experienced enough in responsible foreign policy. *** Notice the word, responsible.

They think that if they hire someone conservative that is not really charasmatic, mostly just very sociable to his base. ***Just because someone appears like a "good guy" don't mean shit in the world. *** Too many Americans expect almost a "normal guy" image but a "emperor" qualities with a touch of dictatorship leadership.

I even asked a fellow 25 year old man why he supports G W Bush? ***He couldn't give me a direct answer why, only saying that he's a strong leader and tough on terror.

That explaination wouldn't sell a bananna to a chimp, much less to an citizen adaquately informed on U.S. politics.

I guess I should have asked for a more specific reason then, but I just sighed in annoyance.

/My two cents here:

I swear U.S. political elections will eventually turn into a high tech cow herding-like facility, and coax people to enter them. ***Then group them up and almost brainwash them with simple messages to reinforce control over individual reason. ***Sounds like something the Republicans would kill for, literally. *** ***

/End of My two cents.

A good percentage of Texans really hated him as governor there. ***He seriously F***d up in certain areas in Texas, sadly he moved up into the presidency.

Not enough people did their homework before election in 2000, so don't look for others to blame when you vote for someone that just might look nice and have some/many common values on the surface.

That's why the issue of abortion and stem cell research is such of a big issue, a president's job is to protect, defend, and obey the U.S. consitution, not add religious context or religious interpretation of policy and law into the government. ***

Laws and policies must be fair and equal to all, no matter what your beliefs are. ***

I believe abortion is wrong in all aspects except maybe in the mother's life at stake. ***However, if woman doesn't believe in abortions, don't have one. ***Just because Jesus or God believes it is wrong doesn't make it right to stop a Buddhist, Athesist, or a Hindu to have an abortion.

The day mainstream religious beliefs gets away with breaking the U.S. consitution and continues to do so regularly is when Americans might have to start hoarding supplies and guard your firearms with your life.

Religious Extremism in America is not impossible, far from it with the tensions high between those with the liberal and highly conservative sides of society. ***Soon these sides will definitely clash on a large scale, then chaos will have a new meaning.

At first having read the first post where an American (32 male FL) complained about America beiing hated I thought this was not the case until I stump upon knowItAlls euros, I quoted your rant amongst others to explain further....

You dare to say "morons" get elected in the U.S and label Americans has "too dumb ass and lazy" are you for real?? do we have genius politics in EU?? are we smart and elitists?? or the E.U politics are so forgiving to be focalized exclusively in the U.S so called "wrongdoings"; how many "euros" knows who are their representatives in Brussels??

Third how one can enjoy a game depicting U.S troops thus playing himself as a "U.S soldier" and come here to says how the U.S of A hurting his high morale ground...grow up kids!

[ProfTournesol 956]

At first having read the first post where an American (32 male FL) complained about America beiing hated I thought this was not the case until I stump upon knowItAlls euros, I quoted your rant amongst others to explain further....

You dare to say "morons" get elected in the U.S and label Americans has "too dumb ass and lazy" are you for real?? do we have genius politics in EU?? are we smart and elitists?? or the E.U politics are so forgiving to be focalized exclusively in the U.S so called "wrongdoings"; how many "euros" knows who are their representatives in Brussels??

Third how one can enjoy a game depicting U.S troops thus playing himself as a "U.S soldier" and come here to says how the U.S of A hurting his high morale ground...grow up kids!

Why digging out such an old thread :confused:

[ben_s 11]

wow, Old thread is understatement.

[Zipper5 74]

Please do not dig up threads older than 4 months, let alone 6 years.

Edited November 7, 2010 by Zipper5