The Iraq Thread

[foxer 0]

I heard about the scud attack about at 4am america time.I think their websites are falling behind.

[foxer 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HK (HunterKiller) @ Mar. 20 2003,11:35)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Well, don't you think it's possible that he may have recorded a few of these speeches mentioning todays, tomorrows and a few other days dates, plus today was his deadline day etc he doesn't seem to mention times or any other information that would be concrete that he is alive. Personally i think your probably correct, but just a thought..<span id='postcolor'>

Hmm,you know you do have a point.He did know the attack was going to come tonight,or atleast thought it was.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,12:31)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Fox and BBC have just now mentioned the scuds for the fist time while the attack was 1h 30 minutes ago.<span id='postcolor'>

Can't be. He doesn't have any.

[theavonlady 2]

Conflicting reports. According to one AP wire I saw, these were Al-Samoud missiles.

You know - the little rinky-dinky ones Blix came upon.

edit: Correction/Confusion:

Reuters says there were both Scud and Al-Samoud attacks.

[foxer 0]

Small aircraft crash near iraq border

http://www.foxnews.com/

Is it a drone ?

I wonder if it's iraq,if it is.Is it the one that US been talking about that can be filled with chemical weapons.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 20 2003,11:46)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Conflicting reports. According to one AP wire I saw, these were Al-Samoud missiles.

You know - the little rinky-dinky ones Blix came upon.<span id='postcolor'>

Yes, both scud and Al-Samoud. If it really turns out that US servicemen died, then it will be the first casualties that come as a direct result from withdrawing support for the inspectors. They were destroying the Al-Samoud missiles but never had the time to complete the work. Good going Bush!

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,12:59)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">If it really turns out that US servicemen died, then it will be the first casualties that come as a direct result from withdrawing support for the inspectors. They were destroying the Al-Samoud missiles but never had the time to complete the work. Good going Bush!  <span id='postcolor'>

Gibberish.

1. They didn't even know of there existance beforehand.

2. Even if they destroyed the ones they found (and they were being destroyed very slowly), who says he doesn't have plenty more elsewhere?

3. You forgot to mention that the inspectors never found the scuds. Iraq never admitted having them, as required by the UN.

4. From the latest wires I've seen, there were no causalties, though this could flip around again.

5. Iraq played Cat&Mouse with the inspectors too long. Giving them more time meant giving Saddam more time to clown around as well.

[//relic// 0]

6. If not al samoud, I'm sure Hussein would have simply attacked with another type of theatre missile.

[Guest]

4--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 20 2003,124)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,12:59)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">If it really turns out that US servicemen died, then it will be the first casualties that come as a direct result from withdrawing support for the inspectors. They were destroying the Al-Samoud missiles but never had the time to complete the work. Good going Bush!  <span id='postcolor'>

Gibberish.

1. They didn't even know of there existance beforehand.

2. Even if they destroyed the ones they found (and they were being destroyed very slowly), who says he doesn't have plenty more elsewhere?

3. You forgot to mention that the inspectors never found the scuds. Iraq never admitted having them, as required by the UN.

4. From the latest wires I've seen, there were no causalties, though this could flip around again.

5. Iraq played Cat&Mouse with the inspectors too long. Giving them more time meant giving Saddam more time to clown around as well.<span id='postcolor'>

1) Yes they did. The UN tracked all 120 missiles that were produced.

2) They were not destroyed slowly. 68 of them were destroyed in less then two weeks.

3) Your point being? That Saddam is dishonest? No shit.

The scuds would have been found sooner or later.

4) Conflicting reports.

5) He was cooperating and progress was being made. Weapons were being destroyed. Those other 60 missiles that the inspectors never got around to destroy will be used either against US troops or against Israel.

Edit: From the newsfeed, Bloomberg News report that 15 minutes ago two big explosions have occured in Kuwait City and that the air raid sirens are sounding.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,13:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Those other 60 missiles that the inspectors never got around to destroy will be used either against US troops or against Israel.<span id='postcolor'>

The Al Massouds don't reach here. Only the Scuds do.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (foxer @ Mar. 20 2003,12:51)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Small aircraft crash near iraq border

http://www.foxnews.com/

Is it a drone ?<span id='postcolor'>

No. See Debka.

We can take guesses. Maybe it was an Iraqi pilot/general/politician trying to escape but the embargo prevented him from ever getting his hands on a copy of OFP to train for flying the Cessna.

[Guest]

Iraq's minister of information, Mohamed Said al-Sahhaf, denied that Iraq has fired Scuds on Kuwait, saying that Iraq does not have Scuds. / Bloomberg News

Well, I suppose this could be either way. I doubt that the reporters present could differentiate between a Scud and a pink flying elphant. It's likely that they saw a missile and just said Scud because it's associated with Iraq in the past.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,13:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Iraq's minister of information, Mohamed Said  al-Sahhaf, denied that Iraq has fired Scuds on Kuwait, saying that Iraq does not have Scuds. / Bloomberg News

Well, I suppose this could be either way.<span id='postcolor'>

Brits previously reporting knowledge of Scuds. So has/does top military echelons in Israel.

Latest Reuters report on Iraqi missiles fired today.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 20 2003,12:34)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Brits previously reporting knowledge of Scuds.<span id='postcolor'>

Was that from that grad student report? I'm sorry but British intel is not high on my credible source list right now.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Latest Reuters report on Iraqi missiles fired today.<span id='postcolor'>

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">In a slightly conflicting report, a British military spokesman said Iraq had fired just one Scud, which was brought down by a U.S. Patriot missile defense battery.<span id='postcolor'>

My point exactly. AFP reported 5 missiles.

Edit: AFX/PD - The Kuwaiti ministry of defense confirms that Iraq fired six scud missiles of which two were destroyed by patriot missiles.

Welcome to the wonderful world of war time information.

[CosmicCastaway 0]

One of the first casualties of war is the truth.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,13:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I'm sorry but British intel is not high on my credible source list right now.<span id='postcolor'>

Neither is Iraq's minister of information on mine.

[Balschoiw 0]

Excellent work CIA ! Once again you showed us that your intel network in Iraq is one of the finest on this planet...

[irony]

"Did you kill Saddam Hussein with the cruise missiles ?"

"Yes. We have confirmed CIA evidence that he was killed."

"But who has ordered the missile attack on Kuwait then ?"

"CIA intel reports an Iraqi terrorist linked to AQ to have pressed the button."

"Err...Are you sure ?"

"Yes we completely trust in the CIA sources"

"Ah yes. Ok thanx for your time."

[/irony]

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Balschoiw @ Mar. 20 2003,13:49)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Excellent work CIA !<span id='postcolor'>

So your OFP site is responsible for all this!

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 20 2003,12:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Mar. 20 2003,13:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I'm sorry but British intel is not high on my credible source list right now.<span id='postcolor'>

Neither is Iraq's minister of information on mine. :D<span id='postcolor'>

Can't argue with that. :-)

So, here is a recap of the missile attacks on northern Kuwait so far. The times are CET.

10:30 Two Iraqi missiles hit near Kuwait City - AFX/MSNBC

10:50 Mass panic in Kuwait City after missiles launched. US military confirms that the missiles did not do any damage and did not contain any "unconventional substance" - AFP

11:00 False alarm in Kuwait City triggers mass panic. Senior Kuwaiti defense official confirms that three US and one Kuwaiti servicemen were killed in the Iraqi missile attacks. -Reuters

11:20 Kuwaiti officials deny that anybody got hurt in the missile attacks. US officials confirm that several more missiles are inboud. -AFX

11:45 The missiles that struck northern Iraq were Scud and Al-Samoud missiles. - Reuters

11:53 Two large explosions are reported in Kuwait City - SKY/AFP

12:09 No scud missiles were fired on Kuwait - Iraq's ministry of information

12:24 - Kuwait's ministry of defense confirms six missiles from Iraq - AFX

[theavonlady 2]

Meanwhile, back in Afghanistan..............

[Guest]

Ooops:

13 : 02 Turkey sends troops into northern Iraq - AFX/NTV

Turkey has decided to send troops in to the by Kurds controlled norther Iraq according to the Turkish vice PM Mehmet Ali Sahin who describes the action as "a humanitarian mission".

And here it begins...  

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Longinius @ Mar. 20 2003,11:57)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I find it amusing that Bush claims that God is on his side, while the Pope is against the war.<span id='postcolor'>

Bush is an Episcopalian. Pardon my ignorance but is the Episcopal Church under the authority of the Vatican?

[vade_101 0]

Even if you disagree with the sentiment, its still a very moving and powerful speech

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"We go to liberate not to conquer. We will not fly our flags in their country, We are entering Iraq to free a people and the only flag which will be flown in that ancient land is their own. Show respect for them. There are some who are alive at this moment who will not be alive shortly. Those who do not wish to go on that journey, we will not send. As for the others I expect you to rock their world. Wipe them out if that is what they choose. But if you are ferocious in battle remember to be magnanimous in victory. Iraq is steeped in history. It is the site of the Garden of Eden, of the Great Flood and the birthplace of Abraham. Tread lightly there. You will see things that no man could pay to see and you will have to go a long way to find a more decent, generous and upright people than the Iraqis. You will be embarrassed by their hospitality even though they have nothing. Don't treat them as refugees for they are in their own country. Their children will be poor, in years to come they will know that the light of liberation in their lives was brought by you. If there are casualties of war then remember that when they woke up and got dressed in the morning they did not plan to die this day. Allow them dignity in death. Bury them properly and mark their graves.

It is my foremost intention to bring every single one of you out alive but there may be people among us who will not see the end of this campaign. We will put them in their sleeping bags and send them back. There will be no time for sorrow. The enemy should be in no doubt that we are his nemesis and that we are bringing about his rightful destruction. There are many regional commanders who have stains on their souls and they are stoking the fires of hell for Saddam. He and his forces will be destroyed by this coalition for what they have done. As they die they will know their deeds have brought them to this place. Show them no pity. It is a big step to take another human life. It is not to be done lightly. I know of men who have taken life needlessly in other conflicts, I can assure you they live with the mark of Cain upon them. If someone surrenders to you then remember they have that right in international law and ensure that one day they go home to their family. The ones who wish to fight, well, we aim to please. If you harm the regiment or its history by over enthusiasm in killing or in cowardice, know it is your family who will suffer. You will be shunned unless your conduct is of the highest for your deeds will follow you down through history. We will bring shame on neither our uniform or our nation.[regarding chemical/biological weapons] It is not a question of if, it's a question of when. We know he has already devolved the decision to lower commanders, and that means he has already taken the decision himself. If we survive the first strike we will survive the attack. As for ourselves, let's bring everyone home and leave Iraq a better place for us having been there. Our business now is north."

Lieutenant Colonel Tim Collins,

Royal Irish Regiment <span id='postcolor'>

[Longinius 1]

"Bush is an Episcopalian. Pardon my ignorance but is the Episcopal Church under the authority of the Vatican?"

They are both Christians, worshipping God. No matter what branch / sect you belong to, you still worship the same God. And he cant very well be both with and against the same thing.

Furthermore, my point was that the Pope is an official representative of the Lord. Last I checked, Bush wasnt.

Still, this is not the place for religious debate if I remember correctly. I still find it amusing though.

[hellfish6 7]

It is always possible that Iraq launched FROG missiles as opposed to SCUDs. If I remember Soviet-style doctrine, all divisions have 4 short range theater missile launchers (FROGs or SS-21s) for use on high-value targets like FARPs, HQs, artillery, etc. FROGs are very similar to SCUDs, save for their smaller size and short range. It would be easy to confuse the two if you were watching it on radar.