Realistic gun fight movies?

[Tex -USMC- 0]

well that kind of killed the conversation, didn't it?

By the way, a guy (Kamai) in USMC was part of the MEU that got deployed to Somalia, and he was very adamant that your version of the story is bullshit, Balschoiw. He was out on the line at Mogadishu's Airport, and several times they had Somalis firing at them, going through the wire, and generally not being helpless or starved. You can talk to him to get an authentic version of the "invasion" as you put it.

[Warin 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Tex [uSMC] @ Nov. 28 2002,20:51)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">well that kind of killed the conversation, didn't it?

By the way, a guy (Kamai) in USMC was part of the MEU that got deployed to Somalia, and he was very adamant that your version of the story is bullshit, Balschoiw. He was out on the line at Mogadishu's Airport, and several times they had Somalis firing at them, going through the wire, and generally not being helpless or starved. You can talk to him to get an authentic version of the "invasion" as you put it.<span id='postcolor'>

Fair warning:

If someone wants to create a thread talking about the geopolitical situation in Africa, feel free. As long as it is rational and relatively flame free, it will even stay open.

Please stop hijacking this thread, or I will cleanse it so that it stays on the original intent.

[Balschoiw 0]

Only to clear this. I have been to Moga. I have seen things with my own eyes. I know there were multiple killings of unarmed people. I know there was a growing opposition towards UN troops in general and US forces in particular, cause of the unmotivated and unfounded attacks. I still remember a group of 3 US tanks, located at the beach that shot into town every week only to make sure Somalis wont forget that US are still there. These were the original words from one of the crewmembers. When I asked him if they target specific threats , he said no. Just putting some fire into town.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">including armor<span id='postcolor'> there was plenty of armor within the UN camp...

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">He was out on the line at Mogadishu's Airport, and several times they had Somalis firing at them, going through the wire, and generally not being helpless or starved. <span id='postcolor'>

I have been there too, after I had done my time in Belet Huen camp. Ever asked him why they wanted to go through the wire? Most cases were cause of looting. You are right if you tell that they were not actually starving, but hunger and lack of essential food killed a lot these days. Moga at this time was a town that got totally ruined by civil war and Door gunner trainings. I attended a door gunner training there on a UH and I know "abandoned" town sections were used for it as the "tank farm" near Belet was. Been to both places.

Again, the warlord Aidid certainly did not like the presence of UN troops, but he appreciated the food donors and the presence of World Food program and other charity organizations. But the killing of innocent brought up the somali people. You also might want to check the this post I have written in the Nato topic.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">That was one of my first impression when I got to that huge camp. I went into my tent that was heavily fortified with sandbags nearly 180m high and each tent had it´s own shelter cause of the mortars. I asked why the tents have so many holes and the other soldiers told me that I will see at night. At night several mortars bumped the Airfield wich I was "sleeping" very near at. So the shrapnels went through the tent leaving some more holes.

It was always like this:

Mortar or gunfire,Kiowa from USS Inchon that was hovering over the camp the whole day and night tracking source of fire and handing over data to circling Apache. Apache went in, sent Rockets or gunfire into town and it was calm for the next hour. Than the procedure started again. I really got mad with the officers that decided to put the camp on such an exposed spot, but I guess they wanted to block the harbour and have minimum distance to sea based forces.

I have some nice pics of the plane and helo dump in Moga. That was really "United nations" as all kind of military planes and Helos that were shot down or had technical fails were just put on a large dump.

As for the hollywood funstuff: FORGET IT !

They never showed cut off heads lying in the mine grave every morning. Gives you a good feeling after breakfast, when you enter your station and have to clear the grave where weapons, mines, body parts, charges were put in overnight.

Furthermore I did not experience any of that crappy heroism in any mission I took part in. Put this to fiction and movies but be assured reality is very different. <span id='postcolor'>

I agree that some things are hard to believe, but I also only can tell what I have actually seen and experienced. There is no need to put this into a conspiracy content. I furthermore did not bash the US, but added first person experiences from my own knowledge that I collected when I have been there.

Some facts maybe non conform with your thinking, but that does not make them untrue.

Warin sorry, but I felt to add this.

[MrMilli 0]

I had started to post some stuff, but denoir did a good job with

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Consider yourself permanently banned. Racism in any form will not be tolerated in these forums.<span id='postcolor'>

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I know there were multiple killings of unarmed people.<span id='postcolor'>

Under what circumstances?

[madmedic 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Balschoiw @ Nov. 28 2002,22:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">there was plenty of armor within the UN camp...

<span id='postcolor'>

Yes,...U.N. armor.

Clinton's administration denied U.S. forces the use of armor in their missions to capture Adid.

That is why mechanized forces had to be "borrowed" to rescue Task Force Ranger.

I would NEVER sit here and tell you that ANY movie is 100% accurate...and as for the "heroism" of Black Hawk Down...it is based on a BUNCH of different events that happened to a BUNCH of different people...but it is condensed into a FEW characters.

NOW, BACK ON TOPIC....the firing/advancing tecniques portrayed in BHD are realistic

The HEAT  shootout is a great scene.  except for one thing: (the golf ball sized holes being punched through the police cars by the 5.56 ammo.

The only scene I have ever witnessed from Way of the Gun showed a guy firing a 7.62 rifle with one hand, holding it like a pistol....(sorry,,,WRONG) I didnt see the rest of the movie.

Band of Brothers, and Saving Private Ryan accurately depicted WWII weaponry.

[Balschoiw 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Under what circumstances?<span id='postcolor'>

already posted:

daily gun battles and bombing raids in heavily populated neighborhoods.

Actually a lot of people died there cause Helos sent in rockets into residential areas, from where fire was spotted. Did make no difference if it was gun- or mortarfire. So in order to get one or two they killed 20 or more.

[Warin 0]

Obviously trying to keep the thread on topic didnt work