American blacks seek money and land

[advocatexxx 0]

From MSNBC - http://www.msnbc.com/news/793255.asp

WASHINGTON, Aug. 17 —  Hundreds of blacks rallied Saturday in front of the Capitol to demand slavery reparations, saying that compensation is long overdue for the ills of that institution.

“IT SEEMS THAT America owes black people a lot for what we have endured,†the Rev. Louis Farrakhan, leader of the Nation of Islam, told the crowd. “We cannot settle for some little jive token. We need millions of acres of land that black people can build.â€

      “We’re not begging white people,†said Farrakhan, one of several speakers at a rally organizers billed as “Millions for Reparations.†“We are just demanding what is justly ours.â€

HIGH-PROFILE ACTIVISTS SKIP EVENT

While Farrakhan and Rep. John Conyers, D-Mich., did attend, many major names in the black civil rights movement were absent, including the Rev. Jesse Jackson and the Rev. Al Sharpton.

      “The people on the ground are the ones we want to give exposure to,†said one of the speakers, Hannibal Afrik, 68, of Port Gibson, Miss. “If it’s grounded in the people, it will be victorious.â€

      Conyers, who has proposed a commission to study the institution of slavery for the past 13 years, urged the crowd to pressure Congress.

      “Only the Congress can do what we want done,†Conyers said. Lawmakers are on their summer break until September.

      The reparations movement has gained momentum in the past year.

      Earlier this year, a group of slave descendants sued three companies, claiming the companies or their corporate predecessors unjustly profited from slavery.

The Reparations Coordinating Committee, which includes many prominent lawyers and scholars, is working on a separate lawsuit against the federal government.

      Those at the rally said it was time for action.

      “They owe us. I want justice,†said Antoinette Harrell-Miller, who drove 19 hours from New Orleans with her husband, Dennis, to attend. “They built this country off the free labor of our ancestors.â€

      Jaki Mungai of Philadelphia called the rally “a dream that’s starting to come true.â€

      “Every other group has been compensated for the wrongs done against them. Africans in America — we are the only ones who haven’t,†said Mungai, who heard about the rally on the radio and decided to join in.

      Ken McDouall of Durham, N.C., one of a handful of whites at the rally, said the reparations issue “cuts to the core of the history of injustice of America.â€

      “America likes to pretend there are equal rights for everyone, but look at the history of black people,†McDouall said.

I don't know about you but I'm quite frankly getting tired of this.  If they had any bit of logic left they'd realize that history cannot be "changed" or fixed by asking for money.  In my opinion they are merely using it as an excuse to earn free land and cash.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

This is really, really, old news.

By the way, who is going to be paying these reparations, who is going to be receiving them, and what is the criteria for both?

It will be the most incredibly stupid exercise ever- People who have never owned a slave paying people who have never been slaves for wrongs that were done over 200 years ago, and have already been paid for by and in American blood.

[Guest]

I think it is really pointless. You have to draw the line somewhere.

[Duke_of_Ray 0]

This has to be the stupidest thing I have ever heard! Shouldn't the people who sold offspring back in Africa get in trouble to, and to say we built the nation off slave labor! We owe them nothing, slavery is over!

[advocatexxx 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">This is really, really, old news.<span id='postcolor'>

It is ? Well I found it today on the front page of MSNBC.COM

I wouldn't say a word if it was a group of high school students, but to have educated and accomplished reverends and other adults claim such issues just disappoints me.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Duke, please dont sabotage this side of the argument with yer indistinct ramblings. We happen to agree, but obviously for very different reasons

[Tex -USMC- 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (advocatexxx @ Aug. 18 2002,20:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">It is ?  Well I found it today on the front page of MSNBC.COM

I wouldn't say a word if it was a group of high school students, but to have educated and accomplished reverends and other adults claim such issues just disappoints me.<span id='postcolor'>

Oh, well, the article and the demonstration arent old news, but the campaign for reparations is. Also, having high profile people like Farrakhan and Conyers at the fore is nothing new either

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (advocatexxx @ Aug. 18 2002,20:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I wouldn't say a word if it was a group of high school students, but to have educated and accomplished reverends and other adults claim such issues just disappoints me.<span id='postcolor'>

I think that the problem is that USA has the same constitution as it had back then. This government the direct successor of the one that was during the slavery. That means also that they can be held accountable today for what they did a long time ago.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Denoir, that line of thinking is tantamount to moving away from your old house without leaving a forwarding mail address just so that you wont have to pay the electric bill. Its overkill, its irresponsible, and it only leads to more problems than you had in the first place

[Duke_of_Ray 0]

Denoir you are wrong. We give to much to minorities, why should they get special treatment? The only people who might deserve something are the American Indians, and thats up for debate.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

umm, DOR, he agrees with us. The only thing he is arguing about is our Constitution

[Aculaud 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Tex [uSMC] @ Aug. 18 2002,10:54)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">It will be the most incredibly stupid exercise ever- People who have never owned a slave paying people who have never been slaves for wrongs that were done over 200 years ago, and have already been paid for by and in American blood.<span id='postcolor'>

My thoughts exactly. At best, they would be getting revenge on people who have never wronged them before. Take this fight to the people who are actually racist.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Duke_of_Ray @ Aug. 18 2002,11:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The only people who might deserve something are the American Indians, and thats up for debate.<span id='postcolor'>

This would be the big catch here. Because no part of this country (USA) is justly anyones, back or white. It belonged to Native Americans before we ever thought of coming here.

[Duke_of_Ray 0]

Maybe what we did to the Indians is a bad thing, again its up for debate, butI guess thats how the world works.

[Aculaud 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Duke_of_Ray @ Aug. 18 2002,11:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Maybe what we did to the Indians is a bad thing, again its up for debate, butI guess thats how the world works. <span id='postcolor'>

Well, it IS deffinitely a bad thing. I mean we systematically drove a nation of people off their own land, and then set up camp here ourselves. On top of that, we took another nation of people off their own land, brought them over here and used them for slavery.

Like it or not, America is an Empire.

[Paratrooper 0]

The case sets a very dangerous legal president in my opinion; People suing other people for crimes they did not commit and they weren't the victims of.

[Warin 0]

Whats next? Should I trace my ancestry back to Anglo Saxon land owners in England who were dispossesed when the Normans invaded in 1066? Come on, I need a wad of cash for that, Queenie!

Its too bad that there seems to be this inane need to beat ourselves up for things we really had nothing to do with. If there were living folks who had been slaves in the US, then I can say they would deserve reparations.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Tex [uSMC] @ Aug. 18 2002,20:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">umm, DOR, he agrees with us. The only thing he is arguing about is our Constitution<span id='postcolor'>

Yes and no. I agree with you, but I am not arguing about your constitution. I am just asking the question of how long the responsibility of the actions of a government lasts. The answer in Europe is simple, we just say: It is not the same government and not the same constitution. In USA it isn't that simple just because the core of the political system is the same and the current government is a direct successor of the old one.

[Aculaud 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Paratrooper @ Aug. 18 2002,11:54)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The case sets a very dangerous legal president in my opinion; People suing other people for crimes they did not commit and they weren't the victims of.<span id='postcolor'>

Not to mention the fact that its not like they are the only ones to ever endure that kind of hardship.

An old friend of mine is half Jewish. He'll tell you all about what happened to the Jews durring the holocaust. Hitler didnt have any interest in slaves, he just wanted to kill them all in the most hideous ways he could think of.

[Paratrooper 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Aug. 18 2002,20:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Tex [uSMC] @ Aug. 18 2002,20:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">umm, DOR, he agrees with us. The only thing he is arguing about is our Constitution<span id='postcolor'>

Yes and no. I agree with you, but I am not arguing about your constitution.  I am just asking the question of how long the responsibility of the actions of a government lasts. The answer in Europe is simple, we just say: It is not the same government and not the same constitution. In USA it isn't that simple just because the core of the political system is the same and the current government is a direct successor of the old one.<span id='postcolor'>

I think Hitler proved that new constitutions are no assurence of liberty. We have no constitution here in Britain, this means we are not bound in any way. What matter is not the constitution but the health of democracy. The people have the power to remove bad governments.

[Espectro (DayZ) 0]

I would like to have a big fat check from Germany, since they killed numerious of danes during WW2...

...

Where is the world going? Did they completely get the craps overthere?

[ran 0]

in france , the people have the right , the duty to overthrow a bad governement

[Paratrooper 0]

5--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ran @ Aug. 18 2002,215)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">in france , the people have the right , the duty to overthrow a bad governement<span id='postcolor'>

And in every functioning democracy!

They don't have the right to overthrow legal government however, otherwise we would have anarchy.

[Guest]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Paratrooper @ Aug. 18 2002,21:00)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I think Hitler  proved that new constitutions are no assurence of liberty. We have no constitution here in Britain, this means we are not bound in any way. What matter is not the constitution but the health of democracy. The people have the power to remove bad governments.<span id='postcolor'>

Really, no constitution? Hard to believe... How do you regulate the form of the government then? Where is it defined that the parlieament has any power? Where is it defined that you are a monarchy?

[Paratrooper 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Aug. 18 2002,21:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">0--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Paratrooper @ Aug. 18 2002,210)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I think Hitler  proved that new constitutions are no assurence of liberty. We have no constitution here in Britain, this means we are not bound in any way. What matter is not the constitution but the health of democracy. The people have the power to remove bad governments.<span id='postcolor'>

Really, no constitution? Hard to believe... How do you regulate the form of the government then? Where is it defined that the parlieament has any power? Where is it defined that you are a monarchy?<span id='postcolor'>

We are a monarchy according to Magna Carta. The Queen grants Parliment the right to use her power. She signs all laws. She can dissolve parliment at any time. This in its self protects from tyrannical governments. But if the government is just bad we vote them out. The house of Lords also is required to consent to bills.

The voter removes bad government at the ballot box. If we were to get reall lunatics in government we have the security that the army is loyal to the Monarch.

[Paratrooper 0]

And something does not have to be written down for it to be.