Coming soon

[Warin 0]

Wow.

So basically the US is giving SOCOM carte blanche to chase down operatives of AQ wherever they may be.

Does this frighten anyone else?

The US is basically saying 'We no longer respect your borders. If there is a citizen of your country we believe to be part of AQ in a significant role, we will come and kill them'

Grand.

I am off to see Signs. Discuss this and I will come read the carnage when I get home

[timmy 0]

i like the idea.

and o yea, signs is good, i just saw it

[Duke_of_Ray 0]

What is so bad about that idea? America is just protecting itself.

[ralphwiggum 6]

whatever.

i'm not surprised that Rummy came up with this idea. this will go down in history as time when idiots ruled cuz fanatics went nuts.

i beieve in 'an eye for an eye'. you do something to me unjustfully, I show you what i'll do to you. simple rule. but a civilized country would respect basic legal limits. so this will be an interesting point.

[MDRZulu 0]

I hope they go to Sweden just to piss Denoir off.

[ralphwiggum 6]

on the other hand, this shows how uncohesive Bush administration is. one time they are talking about defending the constitution and uphold its values.

now Rummy is going against that.

[Warin 0]

I cant wait until some of the more loquacious and garrulous Americans turn up to try to justify this

Except for the fact that it's 4 months and one day after the fact, I'd think this was an April Fools joke.

I thinbk Al Queda has won, even if they never perpetrate another overt act of actual terrorism. They have managed to spook the US so bad that the government is willing to do all manner of stupid and wholely insane things all in the name of National Security.

Please dont take this the wrong way, but I hope some American special ops guys get captured while attempting to assasinate a foreign national in his own country. In fact, isnt there an actual law against this? Then again, Bush seems perfectly happy to ignore anything that might keep him from getting at the terr'ists.

Yes..I am pissed.

[BoonieRat 0]

As if Sept 11th was'nt justification enough!...

I think its about bloody time!. sod justifying it!. do the terrorists stop to justify everything they do?. a cause is'nt justification.

I thought the whole thing about being civilised is the fact that you are cause you can be. not cause you have to be!!. I think any country that does'nt open up its borders for America in this deserves to have their soverenty ignored.

Kudos for Bush!. putting his country before his election spiel!. if only more leaders were more concerned with their country rather than their public image~vote count!!.

Theres a few homilys that spring to mind. an eye for an eye. he who lives by the sword, ect, ect...

Funny when you stop to think about where these originated. its about time they set a theif to catch a thief...

[SCA Jolly 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Warin @ Aug. 03 2002,08:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><span id='postcolor'>

Bush is mad. Anyone against? The US and the triggerhappy generals in Pentagon is trying to domintae the world. If USA isn't stopped soon, something much worse than 11. September is gonna happen. Just wait and see...

-Henning

[second_draw 0]

IMHO, i think it's just a policy to justify the stupidity of a few. eg. Too dumb to realize what it will start a war/confilict.

[SCA Jolly 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (BoonieRat @ Aug. 03 2002,14:19)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As if Sept 11th was'nt justification enough!...

I think its about bloody time!. sod justifying it!. do the terrorists stop to justify everything they do?. a cause is'nt justification.

I thought the whole thing about being civilised is the fact that you are cause you can be. not cause you have to be!!. I think any country that does'nt open up its borders for America in this deserves to have their soverenty ignored.

Kudos for Bush!. putting his country before his election spiel!. if only more leaders were more concerned with their country rather than their public image~vote count!!.

Theres a few homilys that spring to mind. an eye for an eye. he who lives by the sword, ect, ect...

Funny when you stop to think about where these originated. its about time they set a theif to catch a thief...<span id='postcolor'>

Imagine this: some american terrorist group blows up something very important in Norway, like the government or something. Would Bush really allow Norwegian spec ops to take one or more US citizens to Norway to punish them? Without actual evidence?

[second_draw 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (SCA Jolly @ Aug. 03 2002,13:50)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (BoonieRat @ Aug. 03 2002,14:19)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">As if Sept 11th was'nt justification enough!...

I think its about bloody time!. sod justifying it!. do the terrorists stop to justify everything they do?. a cause is'nt justification.

I thought the whole thing about being civilised is the fact that you are cause you can be. not cause you have to be!!. I think any country that does'nt open up its borders for America in this deserves to have their soverenty ignored.

Kudos for Bush!. putting his country before his election spiel!. if only more leaders were more concerned with their country rather than their public image~vote count!!.

Theres a few homilys that spring to mind. an eye for an eye. he who lives by the sword, ect, ect...

Funny when you stop to think about where these originated. its about time they set a theif to catch a thief...<span id='postcolor'>

Imagine this: some american terrorist group blows up something very important in Norway, like the government or something. Would Bush really allow Norwegian spec ops to take one or more US citizens to Norway to punish them? Without actual evidence?<span id='postcolor'>

maybe, cause bush probably wouldn't want to be a hipocrit. Then again, the americans would have already cracked down on their ar$es bu the police.

[Guest]

I'll just say for the record that it has always been a bad idea to give the intelligence community free hands without any oversight. It will just come back and bite them in the ass when the spooks start to make trouble.

I would have thought that Bush Jr. would have learned his old mans mistakes (Contras funding during while Bush Sr. was head of the CIA).

[IceFire 0]

Gimme a break. Our CIA guys hands have been cuffed for way too long. If they were given more independence in the first place, we might not have even had Sept 11.

So now our Spec Ops can go and start hunting AlQuada freely, and you all think it is a bad idea???

Democracy doesnt apply to national defence or war. Just in civil/domestic matters within the country concerning the citizens (because the US is a democracy).

Havnt you people heard of the old saying "Alls fair in love and war"? War is the complete embodyment of "no rules exist". We have enemies out there that want to kill us who are lean and mean and are willing to do whatever it takes to kill us, and we need to be just as lean and mean to stop them.

How can you apply rules? Can you trust the enemy to abide by theirs?

We'll do what it takes to kill the enemies. Why on earth you woulnt even want AlQuada dead is beyond me.

[IceFire 0]

Oh, and as for the the negative effects of us giving our Spec Ops free reign? I really dont think this would cause some huge unforseen backlash. After all, we would just be doing what we have been doing the last few months. Only with complete freedom to do it how we see fit and where we see fit.

[Paratrooper 0]

This is just a PR stunt. America knows it would need the co-operation of the countrys they intend to operate in.

It looks good saying: "We are giving our boys a free hand to get these sons of bitches". The fact is the 'War on Terrorism' is going nowhere and they know it.

[Guest]

Letting the intelligence agencies to run amok gives good short-term results but can have very nasty and unpredictable long term effects. Like when they arm another terrorist group to fight AQ and then everybody gets surprised when that other group turns against the US. Or when the intelligence community decides to take out your president (Kennedy, anybody? )

Also, it is very questionably by international law what right the US has to operate on another country's soil without permission of that country. It is a very good way to alienate your allies and make new enemies that will seek revenge on USA.

[Paratrooper 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also, it is very questionably by international law what right the US has to operate on another country's soil without permission of that country. It is a very good way to alienate your allies and make new enemies that will seek revenge on USA.

<span id='postcolor'> The attitude America has towards much of the rest of the world is why they are in this mess in the first place. They are not hated by much of the arab world for no reason!

[IceFire 0]

Well, I don't think any of our allies are really going to go berserk over this.

And this is just SOCOM that has been given this freedom, not the entire intelligence community.

And it makes sense. It is the best, and probably the only way to find the terrorists. They can be hiding in any number of countries.

This will allow us to get in any country and sniff them out without tîpping off anyone who may be friends with AlQuada.

Now we can be anywhere, and noone will know it.

It's not like we are just going to go in guns blazing killing whoever in sight. No, we can lay in wait for weeks or months spying without anyone knowing and get in really deep in any country.

Much safer for regular civilians if you ask me because we have so much more control over the situation and we can follow them anywhere.

And who knows, we may be able to secretly help deal with this whole palestinian mess.

[IceFire 0]

Oh, and paratrooper, when you say the "rest of the world", do you really mean the "Arab" world?

Because most Europeans that I know and talk to all agree that we have good reason to be so hell bent pissed.

[ran 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IceFire @ Aug. 03 2002,15:06)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Now we can be anywhere, and noone will know it.  

It's not like we are just going to go in guns blazing killing whoever in sight.      No, we can lay in wait for weeks or months spying without anyone knowing and get in really deep in any country.  <span id='postcolor'>

erm ..... after seeing some of the fuck-ups of some socom units these past years and decades ......... i start to fear for my life

[Sam Samson 0]

In the last USNews I read about the bounty hunt for Bin Laden. The jackpot is at $100 million of private and public rewards. SoFs have flooded Afghanistan.

The going currency is heads and ears. (FBI turned down a guy with a head and said it wasn't Bin Laden's top aide as the mercenary claimed.)

Should the Pentagon encourage those off-the-shelf private armies?

I don't think so. Rather use spec ops.

think of them as the surgical knife of a doc. no pretty sight when it goes in, bloody while its there, a mess when it comes out. but if the surgeon sticks to his objective (the cancer), the whole body (nations, in this case) is better off.

and, my righteously indignated leftist east coast intellectual treehugging hochiminkissin buddies, the us is reacting to an attack, not merely foisting itself on the world like europeans traditionally do when they feel they're right and have the power.

anyway.

a power like the us can't just tuck tail and whimp out.

and besides:

I believe President Bush can do whatever he wants, it will never please most of you folks here, simply because he's on the wrong side, politically.

if he'd be a democrat you'd be kissin up to him no matter what he'd do. (remember lyin' cheat'n clinton and how much you liked him anyway?)

[Sam Samson 0]

by paratrooper:

The attitude America has towards much of the rest of the world is why they are in this mess in the first place. They are not hated by much of the arab world for no reason!

yea.

that's like saying it was the jews fault that the nazis didn't like them.

c'm on now.

I believe in cause and effect, all right. but don't get carried away. leave the market in the square.

the real problem is this islamic political religion that divides the world into dar al islam and dar al harb (house of war), not the prez's policies.

[Paratrooper 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Sam Samson @ Aug. 03 2002,15:24)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">by paratrooper:

The attitude America has towards much of the rest of the world is why they are in this mess in the first place. They are not hated by much of the arab world for no reason!

yea.

that's like saying it was the jews fault that the nazis didn't like them.

c'm on now.<span id='postcolor'>

That is a pointless comparisson. America running roughshod over smaller countrys is why they are hated in some parts of the world. Nothing like Nazi anti-semitism! Pretty galling comparing yourselves to the Jews of the 30s and 40s!

[IceFire 0]

Anyways, the point is that letting our Spec Ops guys have complete freedom is a good idea, not a bad one.