IrishDeviant

lol, well, we'll have to agree to disagree on the 'art' part of it. For ex, I couldn't model a human, or a sculpture, or anything abstract, even if my life depended on it. That's where really good 3-view drawings come in. Calling that art is like tracing a picture and turning it in to your art teacher as if you've mastered the art of drawing. lol I get what you're saying, but modeling mechanical objects with schematic type drawings isn't art, it's a technical process... The art is in the textures, normals, specular, etc. This area is very much about being an artist regardless of what tools you have. Oh, and as for keeping that model, when I get around to modelling an F-5 I'll start from scratch and do it properly. This model isn't worth using. I just kind of rushed through it to make a point. ...Basic outline with low poly mesh, a brief bit of sculpting to get the lines where they need to be, crease the edges where lines need to be sharp, add smoothing modifier, use boolean to imprint outline of cockpit and control surfaces, detach cockpit and control surfaces, done. ;)

--will reduce image sizes in main post-- Actually, it's closer to about 45% in terms of time. The basic modeling of the aircraft is the easy part. The unwrap is time consuming if you're actually trying to do a good job, and by 'texture template', all I mean is a 'render to texture' of the mesh. Just a basic outline for someone else to come in and actually make the texture. ...Of course, then you have the cockpit (which I wasn't including in the LoD1 mesh stated above), and detailing, and texturing, and normals, specular, etc etc etc etc etc ...All that stuff is the time consuming part, the model, well that's easy: Case in point, this took me 45 minutes. It isn't the greatest model in the world, just wanted to show that modeling doesn't, or at least shouldn't, take very long. ...Also, 3D modeling is 10% skill in modeling, 90% skill in using the tools, and specifically the right tools. If you have a good 3D app, and know how to use it well, then you get a lot more done. And what you make looks a lot better.

Yeah, no worries. I just don't want the thread to turn into a hundred pages of 'will you make this for me'. lol First, let me state my priorities. 1: Expand my portfolio, 2: make aircraft that I personally want to use in Arma II. I basically justify my time spent modeling on mods by adding those models to my portfolio of work. And, I'm not really willing to spend this much time modelling an aircraft I wouldn't be interested in flying in Arma II. So, to answer your question, the F-5 Freedom Fighter has a very simplistic shape which wouldn't highlight much of my modeling ability, therefore wouldn't be a significant addition to my portfolio. And, I really wouldn't see much of a use for it in Arma II. The EA-6B for ex, it's an aircraft that I've actually said to myself during missions, "I really wish I had that aircraft right about now". lol It's something that has a purpose and a practical use. The F-5 would just be a novelty aircraft. Having said all of that, I do often get bored with projects while I'm working on them, and will find small side projects to take a break from whatever it is I'm working on. So, I may add the F-5 to my list of small projects in case I get frustrated with the EA-6B. (it's good to take a break from models as they will drive you absolutely insane.) Although, if I model the F-5, it would just be 1 LoD level of the mesh, a UVW Mapping, and a basic texture template. At that point, I'd just release it to the community to do whatever with. Essentially, I wouldn't want to spend much time on it.

The F-14 has been completely decommissioned in the US. As far as I know, there is only one left on display at the Naval Air Station in Pensacola, Florida. Typically, F-4 Phantom's are used as drones for adversarial training due the massive number of them that were produced. (there were 5,195 F-4 Phantom's produced, and only 712 F-14 Tomcat's) Iran still has an unknown number of F-14's in service. Originally they were sold around 80, but as of 2009, they only had 44, of which only 20 were operational. ...The US decided to shred the rest of the American fleet to prevent parts making their way to Iran. After the Revolution, the Iranian Air Force was largely dismantled. There are still a large number of aircraft and able bodied pilots, but it's nothing of what it used to be under the Shah. Of course then, the Emperor was in good (well, decent) relations with the US, and thus had access to much of our technology. ...Now with sanctions and the arms embargo against the Islamic Republic of Iran, the Iranian Air Force essentially has to make due with what they have. Presumably, the Iranians are producing their own replacement parts for the last of their F-14's, but even under the best of circumstances, the F-14 was a very, very high maintenance aircraft. The biggest factor in it's decommission here in the States was the cost to keep them running. So, after a completely unnecessary and long winded history lesson, to answer your question, no I don't consider it to be in Active Service. If any of the Iranian F-14's are still actually combat effective, it's only a short matter of time before they age beyond repair. (at least not without parts, which we're obviously not going to sell them) It's a shame too... The F-14 Tomcat was my favorite fighter jet.

lol Well I actually have a list of about 25 or so aircraft that I really want to model. It just comes down to finding the time. However, there are a few Vietnam era fighters/bombers that I've been wanting to model for some time. My focus right now is 'currently in service' aircraft, but I'll eventually get around to the retro birds. Also, I've been taking a closer look at the differences between the EA-6B and the A-6... Typically I don't like doing modified models. Meaning taking one version and chopping it into another version. I just prefer starting from scratch. But, the EA-6B is really just an A-6 with a stretched nose. There are some various little things here and there that are different, but I think I can manage to do both versions fairly easily. Just have to see how it goes.

Updated screenshots in main post: Starting over with new drawings (a special thanks to Gedis for finding these for me) It would have taken longer to modify my existing progress to the new drawings than it will take to start from scratch. And, I didn't have much done anyway. The reason it looks a bit messy is because I have all the layers visible. While working, I hide everything I'm not using. There are top/bottom/side/front/rear, as well as cross sections for fuselage/wings/tail/. I can't thank Gedis enough, these will make a huge difference in the quality of the final product. Thanks again!

Yeah, smoothing modifiers are very useful if you know how to use them. They do have limitations, and they can easily push you're poly count to high, so you have to be careful how you use them. On the tail of that ViperJet, it's a combination of vertex weight and edge creasing. Those are ways of manipulating the Catmull Clark smoothing algorithm. But, that ViperJet is nearly 350k tris. And, the cockpit and exterior are one model. That model meant for graphic design visualization. When it's done, it will get posted for sale on sites like 3DO2.com, and the3Dstudio.com. So, for instance, a luxury automotive company may wish to use the model as an example of a wealthy businessman parking his Merc on the tarmac and hopping into his ultra sporty 2-seat business jet. Or, an architectural firm may wish to use the model to park outside of a new modern hanger design, or for a new airport design, etc. As far as modeling for video games, I'm well aware of LoD's. For ex, on the Prowler, there will be a cockpit LoD for each seat. For the pilot, there will be a detailed cockpit area, but the co-pilot area will have slightly fewer polys, and the rear seats will only have detail where the pilot is able to see by looking over his shoulder. And, the same for the rest of the seats. In all, there will be 4 cockpit LoD's, as well as the exterior LoD's. ---------- Post added at 01:00 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:53 AM ---------- If you're talking about the one in the screenshots posted just above, it's called a ViperJet by Viper Aircraft. It's a private 2-seat jet that is sold in kit form. You either have to build it yourself, or take it to one of the certified builders. I think the total price to have it built is somewhere around a $1 Million.

Thanks for the link. And, yeah, info about our aircraft is everywhere. I actually downloaded the flight manuals and service manuals for the F-16, F-15, and A-10. And, no, I'm not sharing them. As for the smoothing, well, yes and no. It does have a smoothing modifier, but only as a reference to see how the curves are coming together. The base mesh is much lower poly. Right now I'm just roughing out the general shape. For instance, in that last screen shot, the canopy is too flat, the intakes stick out too far, the curves that form the V shape of the nose aren't strait, etc. All that stuff gets tweaked, then tweaked some more, and some more... Once the 'general shape' is complete, then I add a single subdivision of smoothing and collapse the modifier into the mesh. From there, I start sculpting to get all the details into base mesh. Then, I back up the model and start in on a higher poly version for the normals, as well as for use in other more poly-friendly game engines. It's still a long way from being done. I'll try to post an update screenshot every couple days. But, don't expect to see too much any time soon. I'm also working on another project (unrelated to Arma), at the moment, it's close to being ready for textures. Just about a week or two worth of modeling left. I'll post some renders to show you what the modeling on the Prowler will look like when I get it to this stage: http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4123/4812175080_ffee67e63c_b.jpg http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4138/4812175094_086827181b_b.jpg http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4099/4812175112_bdd942bfd3_b.jpg http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4076/4812175114_6ea0491a72_b.jpg

Thanks! I've looking all over the place for better 3-views... Go figure that you have to look to Russian sites to find the best drawings of American aircraft. lol

Progress images updated. Again, really can't do much on it for a couple weeks, but I'm trying to at least get a little done here and there. Expect progress to pick up soon.

I certainly understand that many people have performance limitations with Arma II. I'm running a Core2Extreme QX-9650 with roughly 13% overclocking, and I still run into frame rate issue during intense battles. So, you definitely have a valid point. However, the EA-6B can be used in smaller, more focused missions. But, the mission has to be designed to include that specific role. In that type of scenario, the EA-6B becomes a cornerstone of the mission. Instead of just being one of 20 support roles, it's one of the primary support roles. In this case, the functionality available in that aircraft aren't fully utilized, but it can still be an enjoyable task for players. Ideally, you want a mission large enough where the Prowler crew are airborne for long periods of time, constantly engaging in various support tasks. But, if you're partaking in a smaller mission, then you don't have to run a 4 man crew. Instead, you could simply have a pilot and one ECM Officer to man the weapons systems, or to man the anti-radiation systems, etc. In other words, focus down the objectives for the aircraft. As versatile as the Prowler is, it is still very effective in each of it's abilities, and each of those abilities by themselves can be useful to ground troops.

Most people who play Arma II, only play ''micro-missions''. In other words, missions with a very clear and precise objective with only the essential AI enemy's to directly effect that mission. For those people, the Prowler isn't for you. For those like myself that enjoy large scale missions will ''full envelope'' resistance, the Prowler becomes an essential asset to the mission objectives. In an 'all inclusive' mission, you have enemy armor, mechanized infantry, heavily fortified bunkers, enemy fighters/bombers, and SAMs/Tunguska's/Shilka's, etc, etc, etc. For those missions, you need to have a versatile and diverse mission strategy. And, part of that strategy is having EA-6B's locating, jamming, and destroying or marking for destruction, enemy radar-based installations. This means that a 4 man crew aboard an EA-6B flies into the area of operation scouting for possible anti-air threats, and eliminating them, or marking them for other aircraft to destroy them. Aside from anti-radar missions, the EA-6B also acts as a forward air observer. The crew of the Prowler can relay air strike requests to available strike aircraft, and prioritize and manage the strikes. As well as keeping track of the available payloads for each of the air units, and assigning strike packages suited to their respective capabilities. These are just a handful of the capabilities that come with an 'ECM' aircraft. Sure, the mission could be completed without one of these aircraft, but the Prowler will add another role for players to engage in. Which is what I'd like to see more of in the Arma community. Having five-hundred different M4 assault rifles is great, but they all do the same thing. For example, a ground based addon pack I'm considering making at some point is the Howe & Howe Technologies: Ripsaw MS2. It's an unmanned ground assault vehicle that's capable of taking on multiple roles ranging from patrol, scout, escort, attack, and localized defense. These types of addons not only add content, they also add new gameplay capabilities. ...Oh, and not that it's relevant to Arma II, but the Mini Rip is at the top of my 'things to purchase' list!!!

I am still looking around for scripters. As of right now, I don't have one (will likely need more than one). However, when I do find one, I will insist on a number of features that I would like included. Some examples would be a realistic radar jamming system, a target sharing system for sending location info on radar installations to strike aircraft, etc. But, I don't want to take any liberties in add/removing functionality from the actual aircraft. Ideally, I would like all of the Prowler's primary systems to be simulated as closely as possible, within the limits of the engine, as well as practical gameplay limitations. It will be a 4 seater, and will require a full crew to get full functionality of all it's systems. As for military branch, that is pretty much just textures, and I will be making a large number of texture for various squadrons, and those squadrons will likely be for both Navy and Marines.

Edit: This is not an addon request thread. Please stay on topic. I finally have a little extra time to do some modelling for Arma II. I am likely going to do a few more missle/bombs for Myke's GLT Missile Box, however, I want to start in on some aircraft. Ideally, I'd like to make 3 or 4 aircraft for A2, time permitting. I've narrowed down my selection to the following: A-10C Thunderbolt II: I have been considering making a replacement for the BIS A-10. This replacement would include a better looking aircraft mesh/textures/normals/etc, multiple loadouts, realistic damage models, and multiple paint schemes. F-35 Lightning II: As I'm sure most of you know, the BIS F-35 is actually the X-35 prototype. I have been contemplating making the proper F-35, and all of it's variants. (F-35A [CTOL], F-35B [sTOVL], and the F-35C [CV Carrier Based]) F-22 Raptor: I actually started on an F-22 model a while back, but life got in the way of completion. Plus, at the time, hi-res 3-view reference images weren't available. Therefore, I'd be starting fresh. I will include multiple loadouts, paint schemes, etc EA-6B Prowler: I have wanted to model this aircraft for some time. It isn't a mass murdering ground pounder like the A-10, or a 'king of the skies' air superiority fighter like the F-22, but it is a great looking aircraft that offers a wealth of strategic enhancement to just about any mission with it's electronic warfare capabilities. RAH-66 Commanche: The RAH-66 is actually fairly low on my priority list as it never actually made it into active service. It is true that the prototype is fully functional, and if it weren't for lack of funding, would likely be playing an important role in the US Army and US Marines. However, due to not being an active service aircraft, I doubt I'll be making it any time soon. B-1B Lancer: The B-1B is another aircraft fairly low on my priority list due to the fact that it would over-power the relatively small game world of A2. It's take-off would be unrealistic due to the short runways in A2, and until larger maps are made to support such a high speed/large payload bomber, I just don't see it being required as an integral part of the typical mission. (but, it is on my list of eventual projects) AC-130 Spectra: I'm not adding this to the vote because I'm under the impression that this aircraft is currently not possible. (engine limitation) However, if scripters would like to work on a way to implement a realistic weapons system (complete with animations of all cannons), then I would gladly model this aircraft for the community. Actually, who am I kidding, I'd be modelling this for myself. (I can't wait to be able to get a Spectra in game.) lol For all aircraft above, I will be modelling as many variants as possible. Include multiple textures/skins, and would also like to include static objects for populating air bases. (such as removed engines on carts, a static GAU cannon for display, etc.) Also, I am only a modeler. I dabble in scripting, but not on the level required for a realistic integration of an aircraft. Therefore, I will be looking for addon creators to work with me on creating the in-game scripting for these aircraft. I know that most of those who I would like to work with (such as Rock from RKSL, and Myke from GLT), are currently working on other projects. However, hundreds of hours go into making a high quality aircraft model, therefore, I'll likely be needing a scripter (or Mod Team), sometime within the next couple of months. If you're interested, please contact me. Although, I already have a very good idea of what I'm looking for in terms of features, and will expect that scripters working on these models will at least make an attempt at adding the features and functionality that I'm wanting for these aircraft. (I'd rather not simply hand off 200+ hrs worth of work and not have a say in how it's implemented) I have added a poll for the Arma II community to vote on the aircraft they would like to see started on first. I likely won't be able to start modelling for about 2 more weeks (sometime early Oct), so there should be time for plenty of people to vote before I get started.

Well, it would seem that the Prowler has the most support, so the Prowler it is. (Understandably, the poll has only been up a day or so. But, I'm bored and want to get started. lol) However, it will be a couple weeks before I'll have any meaningful progress to report. I started this page here for everyone to follow the progress.

The EA-6B Prowler is an "Electronic Warfare" aircraft. It is capable of carrying the AGM-45 Shrike and it's successor the AGM-88 HARM (both are Anti-Radiation AG Missiles), and it uses these missiles to take out SAM installations and Surface to Air mobile targets. However, it's primary role is that of a Command-and-Control Forward Observer. It's like an FAC in the air. Much like the AWACS to a degree, but with higher speed capabilities, and the ability to strike targets on it's own. It really will be a valuable asset to have in any mission which requires air craft. The Prowler is also capable of jamming enemy radar (such as from a Tunguska or a SAM site), and is able to relay positions of those radar installations to strike aircraft (like the F/A-18 or A-10, etc), or is able to engage those targets itself. In Arma II, this could be represented by simply adding a 'persistent lock' to those ground targets so that strike aircraft pilots can easily identify their location. Obviously much discussion will go on with the scripters that I work with to fine tune it's abilities into something that is not only realistic, but also gameplay friendly. But, you get the idea. The Prowler is a support aircraft to other aircraft. Not a heavily armed 'Army of One' type aircraft. War is a team sport, and the Prowler is the Quarterback. (For those outside the US, the quarterback passes the ball off to others to score the point, and sometimes runs the ball in himself)... Analogies just aren't as fun when you have to explain them. lol

This is not an addon request thread. Please stay on topic.

Dually noted. I agree with both of you that we already have a wealth of US aircraft, and not many Axis aircraft. However, I prefer to model American. And, the F-4/F-14/F-15/F-18 models aren't exceptionally well made. They work, but if I actually cared to fly any of those aircraft, I'd probably re-model them. I don't mean to downplay the work their respective modelers put into making them. But, I have a high standard of quality that I like my games to meet. ...And, yes, I will consider making a Mig, but not the MiG-25. That thing is a piece of shite! It weighs far more than it needs to, it's engines are unreliable, it's airframe might have well been made from toothpicks, and all of it's so-called record breaking stats... It is only able to achieve those high mach numbers and altitude for short durations. Any actual combat scenario would preclude the pilot from taking advantage of the higher end of it's performance envelope due to priority of survival being higher than that of speed. ---------- Post added at 11:10 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:06 AM ---------- Hey Myke. Yeah, I'd definitely consider the E-2, but not at the moment. Will probably add it to my list of aircraft to model this year, though. As for the KC-10; If I were to make a refueler, I'd really only want to make the KC-130 Stratotanker. Which then falls under the same "too big for Arma" category as the B-1B. But, would still consider it.

I did say in my descriptions that the B-1 would be difficult under current game world conditions. If a large world addon is made, then it would be a more practical aircraft. I added the B-1 to my list because it's a personal favorite of mine, and missions could be made to realistically support the B-1, It just wouldn't be used very often. However, because I live in Wichita, KS, and have spent most of my life listening to B-1B's from McConnell Air Force Base blast over my house and rattling shite off of my walls, I've kind of grown a love/hate relationship with them. As for the F-35/F-22, the F-35 is already in game, I'm just considering replacing the existing BIS model with something more accurate, as well as with additional features and functionality. And, the F-22 would be a complementary aircraft to addons such as the Su-33, that have already been made for A2. Fighters play an important role in many A2 missions as Air Superiority is a key element to winning many battles. As for the A-6, same issue I have with the RAH-66: Though a cool aircraft, it is no longer in service. The A-6 Intruder was retired on 28 February 1997. It's role was moved to the LANTIRN equipped F-14 Tomcat. And, after the Tomcat's retirement, all F-14 roles were moved to the F/A-18 Super Hornet. I would prefer to focus my efforts on aircraft that are currently active in the US Military. I may at some point work on retired aircraft, but not likely at this time unless there are enough votes for the RAH-66. And, the only reason I would consider the RAH-66 is because it fills a role that currently does not exist within any military. The argument for de-funding the project was that UAV's were a lower cost alternative. However, UAV's don't pack the punch of an AH-1Z in addition to it's stealthy recon capabilities. (the MQ-9 Reaper comes close, but is a fixed wing aircraft with little armor to protect it, though it doesn't have human lives on board, human ground troops depend on their air support for survival) I don't mean to sound combative, but please fully read posts before commenting. I acknowledged all of you're points, with explanations in my main post. A-6 Intruder: like stated above, it is no longer in service. AH-1: really doesn't interest me as a modeler. A-4 Skyhawk: Was retired in 1998 by the Marines, and 2003 by the Navy. UH-1: I am somewhat interested in the UH-1. I actually game with a bunch of guys who love those aircraft. However, the UH-1 in game serves it's purpose well, and it's not really an aircraft that I fly very often. Typically, I'll only model something if I have a personal interest in seeing it in game. ...Thank you guys for your comments and votes. TRexian, I usually just take people's comments with a grain of salt, so don't worry about sounding argumentative. You made some sound points, but I had already covered them in my post. Though, the further explanation will likely help other readers. P.S. EA-6B already has the lead.

Ok, so a couple people have said they had issues getting the 'extract pbo' to show up in their shell menu, but I haven't seen an answer as to how to fix it. I've ran the cpbo.exe and it does add the 'create pbo' to the shell for folders, but when I right click a pbo, I don't get 'extract pbo' in the shell. I'm running Win 7 x64. Also, I checked the reg entry, and it seems to be showing up the way it supposed to. Any help?

I posted this in the addon request thread, however, after doing some reading on scripting, I think this is probably the better category for this. Also, I think with a little bit more guidance I might be able to do it myself. I mainly just need to know where to start, and maybe some tutorials or example scripts to work from. I'm not a scripter/programmer, so I'm really only able to reverse engineer existing script work to decipher and implement the stuff I need. Alright, I'm trying to add Custom Weapon Selection in aircraft. I don't like having to press the weapon 'toggle' button and have to 'cycle' through weapons while I'm in combat. For ex, coming in on a target with an A-10, it'd be nice to be able to press a Num pad button to select rockets for killing infantry around a vehicle, then pressing another Num pad button to switch to AG missiles to take out the vehicle. Basically, I'd like to have at least 5 or 6 of the Action keys under Custom Controls that I could map for individual weapon selection for aircraft. (or anything else for that matter) I posted a thread in the General Discussion forum about this and I was referred here. However, Defunkt posted some code, and said it could be used in a mission init.sqf mission file. I'll post the code below. He said that the code might be able to be used to select specific weapon classes or types. (I think this snippet of code is just the key binding, but dunno) However, I think this means you would need a key for each and every weapon available for all aircraft. So, all the AGM's, AA's, Rocket Pods, cannons, etc. And, obviously that wouldn't be ideal. So I was thinking something more like an addon that merely attaches a key binding to select a position of the weapons 'array'. Basically the 'slots' of all the available weapons for the vehicle you're in. For ex, cannons are usually the first slot for aircraft. When you hop in most aircraft, the cannon is the default first selected weapon. Then, when 'switch weapons' is pressed, it cycles to the second position for rockets, AA missiles, or whatever. So, a key binding to 'jump' to a specific point in the cycle is what I'm looking for. I understand that if made this way, each key wouldn't always be the same weapon when using separate aircraft. For ex, weapon slot/key binding 3 on an A-10 isn't going to be the weapon as, lets say, an F-16. This really doesn't bother me that much since I can just make key cards for each aircraft that I can use as a reference. Also, this really needs to be a universal client side addon so that it will work on all aircraft, stock BIS or addons. Ideally, I'd really like to have an addon with the source available so that I can look at how it's done and add more features to the Custom Controls too. For now, I'm only needing this weapon selection addon, but would like to be able to tie action menu items to keys as well. I really don't like stand alone toggle keys. They're useful, but I still like having individual select capability. For ex, in most FPS's, your mouse wheel cycles through your weapons, but you can still use the number row above WASD to select a specific weapon. Anyway, here is the code that was suggested to me. But, again, I think this was just a mission script, and would be limited to only being able to select a specific weapon class/type. Therefore, wouldn't likely be able to work on all aircraft. At least without having a few dozen key bindings. _kdeh = -1; while {_kdeh == -1} do { _kdeh = FindDisplay 46 DisplayAddEventHandler["KeyDown", "_this Call keypress_hook"]; }; keypress_hook = { _code = _this select 1; _done = false; if (_code in ActionKeys "User15") then { _done = true; }; _done; }; Any ideas would be welcome. Possibly some more code snippets that might be useful, or existing scripts that might be able to be modified for this, etc. In fact, just explaining how to try to implement the code posted above would be a good start. Also, I'm really a fan of the "/// explanation" stuff scripters put into their scripts. For idiots like myself, it makes life much easier. ;) Thanks

Just wondering if there is a way to add the ULB action menu item while inside a vehicle. Also the UAV. For example, allowing the gunner of an Apache to control the ULB to target and destroy targets at range. Or, being able to control the UAV while riding in the back of a HMMVW Terminal. It isn't very realistic to have to be 'outside' of the UAV/ULB terminal (sync'd vehicle), to use those support items. The whole point of having an HMMVW Terminal vehicle is so that it can act as a mobile communications and support hub. While outside of a vehicle controlling a UAV, you're completely exposed with no idea what's going on around you. Also, I've been trying to add multiple ULB's to my mission, however, it would seem that I'm not doing it properly. I originally wanted to have 3 ULB's, each sync to 3 specific AH-64's, but controlled by a single UAV Trailer. However, I couldn't get that to work as only one action menu item came up for the ULB. So, I tried a completely separate ULB Module/ULB/AH-64/UAV Trailer, and gave them all unique names, but that didn't work either. Any suggestions on this as well would be appreciated.

:: Deleted and moved to another thread ::

Thanks man, appreciate the help