Dragunov scope's rangefinder curve line

[theavonlady 2]

As I've recently been testing out the official and some unofficial sniper rifles, I noticed something about the Dragunov scope that I didn't realize until now and which I don't believe accurately reflects how the scope works.

Refer to the images below.

I positioned myself exactly 750 meters away from a civilian target. When I used the curved rangefinder line to measure his distance, it registered closer to 600 meters than to 750.

However, as in the pic, when I lined the target up between the rangefinder's bottom horizontal line and above the curved line, to where the lower part of the vertical range markings lines (under the 2/4/6/8/10) themselves end, it indicated a range of 750 meters and indeed, a single shot to the head was - er - dead on.

BIS, isn't the curved line supposed to be used to measure a target's range and not the vertical range number lines above that?

[Speeeedy 0]

I like picture 4

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Speeeedy @ Mar. 03 2002,17:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I like picture 4 <span id='postcolor'>

Yes ......... nice sweater, isn't it?

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

oh yes ...i think i see what you mean, how do the arrow shaped marks work, do they go down in threes (try answering without referring me to the FAQ for once )

i dont often use the Druganov (and i just estimate usually)

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 03 2002,17:22)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">oh yes ...i think i see what you mean, how do the arrow shaped marks work, do they go down in threes (try answering without referring me to the FAQ for once )<span id='postcolor'>

Well, if you would search The FAQ for "dragunov", you would see that each chevron (those triangles) are set for target distances at 250 meters (top chevron), 500, 750 and 1000 meters.

[Mo-- 0]

Nice shot.... lets see you do that a 1000m away....

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

eek... yes i meant 3 hundreds so i almost got it right, i actually DID go to your FAQ but then it crashed my browser

250- i see

are you quite certain its not the bottom of the vertical line? as i seem to remember reading that somewhere...

admittedly it wouldnt be a very good system in that case

(having to estimate between lines)

ok yes i really should try again to visit your site....

[Guest]

Ahhh interesting thread, I never really worked out how the SVD scope works. I see your point also. However, what are each of the arrow heads ranged for?

Also, what is the procedure for when shooting dwarves?

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 03 2002,18:07)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i actually DID go to your FAQ but then it crashed my browser<span id='postcolor'>

Search The FAQ for "wimp".

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Armourdave @ Mar. 03 2002,18:16)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">However, what are each of the arrow heads ranged for?<span id='postcolor'>

I already answered that. They are set at 250 meter intervals. The first chevron is for a range of 250. The 4th is for a range of 1000 meters.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also, what is the procedure for when shooting dwarves?<span id='postcolor'>

Stoop to their level.

[Damage Inc 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (theavonlady @ Mar. 03 2002,18:45)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">7--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 03 2002,187)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i actually DID go to your FAQ but then it crashed my browser<span id='postcolor'>

Search The FAQ for "wimp". <span id='postcolor'>

I tried that but it didn't find anything.

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

try 'Damage Inc is stoopid'

Avon-

how did you verify it was 'exactly' 750 metres from target?

(using the editor ?(marker or trigger -750 metres long)

are the measurements in the editor in metres ? i seem to remember they are units of 128 [or something] making up a map square

im probably wrong though)

when i tested ,it seemed accurate (the measurement system) out to 600 metres or so but after that i couldnt work it out,

+ the people get very small

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 03 2002,18:58)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">how did you verify it was 'exactly' 750 metres from target?<span id='postcolor'>

Created a map with myself, the target civilian and an EAST teammate.

With the AI teammate, I could select him, point my scope at the target and get a reading of MAN 750M.

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

Ah yes

[theavonlady 2]

I should mention that I also tested firing from 750 meters away on the assumption that the rangefinder's reading of 600 is what should be used. That is, I set aim for the target between the 2nd and the 3rd chevrons (btwn 500-750). I only managed to inflict a leg wound and not even enough to keep the target prone.

[ralphwiggum 6]

YOU ARE SICK AVONLADY!!!!!!

YOU SHOT A CIVILIAN!!!!! SHAME ON YOU!!!!!

ok..here's a possible explanation. You used civilian, not a combatant. Civilian stands straight up. combatant doesn't. Could it be the fact that this might attribute even a little bit?

take a look at my darn Geocities pix.(Here)

Using civilian, you will be aiming at target that is 10cm higher than what scope is made for. Now this can be a trivial one, and maybe even unrelated.

Second problem I see is with the thikckness of the scope lines. the line's thickness seems to be a significant factor. Take alook at the first pic. the head is just below the line, somewhere around 600meters.

take alook at second pic. this poor resistance guy's head is within upper limits of the measurement line, but it's close to 750meters(mine was 750.220meters)

so, it could be that the line was intended for someone with a rifle, in combat, rather than standing still(like that poor civilian you shot), and the thickness of line could be the problem. BIS? any comments?

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

How could a dumb ass like Ralph Wiggum come up with a good point like that?

[LBGS_Stewart 0]

this isnt to much about this but it dose seem like a good spot to put this. on avons ladys game it seems to render 750 mine only renders 600 on a flat serface to be able to see the target. how dose thhe game tell how far to render to what the player can see and if one person can see a man father then what another person game can wouldnt that seem alittle unfair in mulitplayer because one can shoot farter then the other because one cant see the target??? because after 600 M the guy just disapers

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (LBGS_Stewart @ Mar. 03 2002,21:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">this isnt to much about this but it dose seem like a good spot to put this.    on avons ladys  game it seems to render 750   mine only renders 600 on a flat serface to be able to see the target.     how dose thhe game tell how far to render  to what the player can see  and if one person can see a man father then what another person game can  wouldnt that seem alittle unfair in mulitplayer because one can shoot farter then the other because one cant see the target???  because after 600 M the guy just disapers<span id='postcolor'>

actually, this is not graphics limitation.

in the INIT field of your soldier, place "setViewDistance 15000". what this will do is it will remove the fog you see in OFP missions to certain distance. It's not going to be some disadvantage.

actually, this consumes some amount of graphic card's ability, so it might be unfair, but this value can be changed, so not a big prob.

try it! go to mission editor, place your self somewhere, another person 750meters away, and use setViewDistance command as described above.

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (IsthatyouJohnWayne @ Mar. 03 2002,21:07)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">How could a dumb ass like Ralph Wiggum come up with a good point like that?<span id='postcolor'>

eh...just some speculation.

BIS's explanation would be best

[-Puma- 2]

To shoot a soldier from distance of 1000 meters with the SVD, by Puma.

1) Lie down and relax.

2) Make sure the target is at 1000 meter range (give or take 20 meters)

3) Make the enemy soldier wear that last chevron like it were a funny hat.

4) Stabilize the sight with the mouse or by pressing the free look button. (when not moving the mouse the sight "swings" a little bit, but when moving the mouse it stays steady. So move the sight over the target by either lowering it or by raising it to the correct position, but do not "hover" over the target. You can "hover" over a target by moving the sight a little bit from left to right. This is much more efficient than the free look thing, in case the target moves, as it allows faster aiming, firing and target aqusition.)

5) Pull the trigger

There seems to be a bug that makes the sights show too much to the left while shooting downwards. So when sooting from high ground, you have to aim way to the left.

I was going to write a detailed html OPF-sniper guide, with pictures and example missions, but due to the bug I didn't bother.

[ralphwiggum 6]

I just wanted to check if the rangefinder was correct, and surprisingly, for 200 meters, it was way off. but for 400 and 600 meters, it was correct, and the top of target's head was in fact, touching the upper portion of the upper lines.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (RalphWiggum @ Mar. 03 2002,20:45)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">You used civilian, not a combatant. Civilian stands straight up. combatant doesn't. Could it be the fact that this might attribute even a little bit?<span id='postcolor'>

Precisely. A western or eastern soldier won't stand straight and they may not still if fired upon and missed.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Puma @ Mar. 04 2002,02)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">There seems to be a bug that makes the sights show too much to the left while shooting downwards. So when sooting from high ground, you have to aim way to the left.<span id='postcolor'>

I do not have this problem. My Dragunov is right on the mark, whether shooting at a level terrain target or on an incline or decline.

Now, I did encounter this problem with Toadlife's Barret addon, which was a combination of the Dragunov rifle with the M21's scope. However, it did not affect the official Dragunov model in any way.

You can see the testing I did by going through this OFPEC forum thread.

So now I'm curious whether you might have installed an unofficial addon that's corrupting the original Dragunov's behavior.

[theavonlady 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (RalphWiggum @ Mar. 03 2002,20:45)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">take a look at my darn Geocities pix.(Here)

Using civilian, you will be aiming at target that is 10cm higher than what scope is made for. Now this can be a trivial one, and maybe even unrelated.<span id='postcolor'>

This is an interesting theory. It could indeed be that BIS developed the model looking at somewhat bent over soldiers rather than at those standing with their weapon over their soldiers.

Here's a quote from the English version of a real Dragunov manual (available from The FAQ - here - in PDF format):

"The upper (curve) line is calculated for a target 1.7 m in height"

This tells us 2 things:

1. The curve should be used to determine target range and not the lines above it.

2. This is based on targets that are 1.7 meters tall, i.e., 6 feet tall.

If hunched soliders in OFP are 1.8 meters high or about 6 foot 4 inches, we should start working on a basketball mod, using that Tossers addon that was put out a week or 2 ago.

Seriously, I feel it's important that a sniper rifle addon should represent the accuracy of the real thing it's modeled after.

It would indeed be appreciated if BIS could comment on this. I would like to see the BIS model adjusted for the accuracies mentioned above.