Touch Off

Spot on Marcai

wow can't believe people are still debating this. I don't believe the game's main issue is going to be addressed from performance point of view at all. 3 years time you'll play the game so it feels fluid and runs well enough on whatever systems are out at that time. They knew what they were doing. It's a business and it's a very clever way of getting money out of people before the official release. It seems to be a trend at the moment. The die hard fans here aren't of benefit to the series. If only people expected more. The game is simply a graphics overhaul. Nothing more than that.

Same rig as you razorman. The game isn't running as well as it should given those spec.. Are you putting say 20-30+ AI down and watching your FPS fall? notice how when you lower the graphics settings there really isn't a huge impact? Same CPU. A very good CPU and it would seem ARMA3 isn't making the most of its power. I really can't see what the difference is with ARMA2 and this when it comes to CPU requirements. Graphically,yes...obviously...but the rest? Swimming? Fish? Animations? I'd probably be happy without the crappy ragdoll that's just poorly implemented and also without the 'improvements' to AI and just leave it as a graphical overhaul of ARMA2. The same highly annoying bugs that were in that (ARMA2) engine are still in this one. I'm sorry to say that these improvements aren't really all they're cracked up to be, for me. You can differ that's fine. I'm just voicing my opinion, like an arsehole that we all have. For me it's just better looking, that's all. nicer lighting. And lowering GPU settings leaves me with negligible difference in performance of the game compared to what I could be running in ARMA2 in terms of AI, with again, very subtle difference, if any, as to how intelligently the AI functions. Voice is better, yes, but not much. In a way I kinda like the stupid voice system of flashpoint. Animations...physics...I dunno, it's all highly overrated as to how much this is a wild improvement over the last game, yes it's early days but I've played this game for 10 years. I play the game how I believe it's meant to be played and create missions for myself and a few others using basic scripting alongside the general availability of what the editor has to offer with a few clicks. I miss a good story behind it, too. I don't think BIS know what the hell this game is meant to be now, evidenced by the seemingly bolted on aspects for improvements. That said............. .My point to this is I hope these are areas they're going to work on and polish and people with even the more moderate rigs that you feel are lacking in juice will be able to find that their systems were adequate, it was just the tweaking at the engine's core that was the issue and the finalising of the endeavour to fulfil their goals to create something special. At the moment, and I don't want money back or anything like that but, I'm just not convinced. nobody else does games like this, but that's where the competition element just might well have been what was needed over the last 4-5 years while this game was in development. Don't buy new rigs yet. Be patient. Mine is a good, mid to high end system and I'd bet money on the possibility that if BIS had reworked major parts of their code without concentrating on what is essentially just eye candy, this game would be running like a dream on these sorts of systems and damn well on lower/near spec PCs, too. How it feels when you're shooting a gun with only a few AI and all the gfx turned down is more enjoyable at the moment than having more AI and a moderate level of GFX. For me, that should be the goal. A balance between the things that make ArmA what it is, the ability to have a decent set up of infantry and vehicles and a visually respectable look and feel. I think they went for look and feel and it didn't quite work out due to the inherent difficulties in working with the engine as it is.

That's where I've been going wrong. Will penne do?

This all should have been fixed.

Good for you. Were the issues with your social life? Do you get out more as a result?

when you lot finish the game for BI, who gets the money?:rolleyes:

Early days? What are you on about? The game is on a engine with the same flaws as the previous titles, and I'm not talking about optimisation of mutli core CPUs. Early days...I appreciate your stance on a few matters, but they don't make sense. BIS are about making money ffs, wake up. Anyway this game isn't alpha. It's just the right word to use to market the game, sounds better than beta, or is that beta than better? Am I the only one who uses his brain? They make games about simulating war and they're a business out to make money. Which is fine.

Just turn it off. It doesn't look good at all.

What is that showing? That when the AI are seen out of cover, there is no suppressive fire, no movement out of there and if these are too much to ask, the soldier on the right is still just oblivious to what's going on and does nothing. Yeah, AI has come on leaps and bounds. I can see where all that processing power is going.

If it had been coded more efficiently, yes. As it isn't, then, no. I doubt your rig will run it smoothly. Unless you set the standard of 'smooth' as others do in these forums, ie load up a blank map, put one soldier down and run for 1 second and say 'yeh, that's smooth'.. Coz that's about as scientific as you need be and from there you will enjoy the fact your rig is perfectly adequate. Just don't put over 40 same old stupid AI down in the editor. This way you'll be able to run around at 60FPS with enough eye candy and nothing going on, outside your mind and in, for you to just enjoy it enough. Again, don't put anything in the editor that will try and use your processor, it's risking despondency.

Gave it a go a couple o days ago, no difference. Your post would have some validity if it wasn't guess work ffs. At the post by the developer. Analyse and fix what? Surely you could have realised this sooner, in the last I don't know, 10 years?

And would you acknowledge the issues relating to performance on above average/high end systems in the feedback section and a future sitrep? We'll see Have you built upon the same engine that suffered the same inadequacies over the last 10 years? Yes I would just like some honesty from a company I've paid money to, really. I'm concerned that as you haven't acknowledged the issues that I can't recommend this game. I had hopes that you would be creating a game that corrected path finding, invisible walls and most of all the optimisation that is needed to allow for a more fluid and stable experience. Other than getting to the end of the game's life span for newer generation technology to finally have an impact on the way the game feels and plays, are you confident you can optimise the engine so we don't have to run 5GHz overclocked CPUs etc etc and can manage larger battles of AI, say 50 a side, without the audio stuttering and huge impact on framerates? Will the game eventually be able to utilise the resources that are on mid range PC, like a 560 series nVidia GPU with a previous gen SB CPU or even a 460+ series GPU with Core2 technology CPUs? Or will we have to face the music and understand that from your point of view there is nothing that will change the performance of the game in future other than hardware upgrades? I mean to say, while things may look nicer, with features added, will nothing change the issues with the current ARMA3 Alpha engine in terms of the invisible wall issue and seemingly poor performance with high specification computers? Would you clarify your intent to endeavour to optimise the game in this regard? Optimisation normally comes at the final stages of development I feel that this needs addressing. No acknowledgement for this issue is a sign for me that you are either incapable of making these things better, knowing how long you've had to resolve certain flaws in the game that have long been discussed in these forums, or would rather ignore what many of your customers are reporting? Neither looks good at the moment and this is why I feel you'd be best off to issue some kind of statement, if possible? So, would you clarify what we can expect to be addressed in the near future, before the game reaches Beta or the final release, in terms of graphical performance and the utilisation of multi core CPUs more efficiently and the AI issues as mentioned? From my point of view, I love what you make and have been a long time fan. However I for one had been under the impression that A: You would be creating a game that was entirely built on a new engine. Not true, misleading articles and possibly conjecture bolstered this opinion on my behalf... B: It as such wouldn't suffer some of the game breaking issues with the previous titles. Path finding, poor AI use of cover, lack of suppression system, walk through walls and lastly the inability to utilise the cores on more modern CPUs more efficiently. From what people are saying, the way that the devs have built the code to utilise processing power in calculations necessary and what we see in system monitoring software isn't the clear picture of underused CPU power as it may lead us to believe

Yes, good faith and good customer support. Or they just rely on know-it alls to do their dirty work for free? The others issues that I've spoken about that were in ARMA2 and never resolved, they're not important to you, right? Guess they can count on your cash for future upgrades?

No, you don't understand.

As long as your moral compass is ok, I'm good with that. But if you learnt to read properly, I stated the reasons why I wanted that honesty. It wasn't necessarily to do with spending 20 quid. I bought the game with a high percentage of my intentions given to the fact I am loyal to purchasing games from BIS as a sign of support. It's not a huge amount of money but nonetheless it depends how you look at it. I've bought flashy twice, ARMA twice, ARMA2 twice and it's DLCs and I bought this game because I do enjoy it and the future it will hopefully have. When one pays money for a product and they have concerns for how it functions, that customer has a right to have a say. Sorry you don't feel like that. Good luck to you. It is free to my friends who I'll be sending invites to, but not to me. I made the choice to pay money for a title I believed would be enjoyable because I wanted the benefits of the non lite version. Can you understand that? In your world where everything that costs has a risk, although feel unable to justify any demands for a resolution if needed, it must get tough when something breaks or isn't fit for purpose or sold as advertised? Maybe this is why there are so many exploitative businesses and services out there because the consumer is just a voiceless cash dispenser. Certain people never feel like they can complain because, well, it's embarrassing or awkward or they just don't know why they should. I always try to make my feelings clear to any service I pay money for if I'm dissatisfied with the outcome. That way I achieve piece of mind knowing that I'm not someone who just keeps getting taken for a ride. Maybe that's not you, though and I digress. My point here is that I have, or possibly had high hopes for this title given the amount of time BIS have had at their disposal to rectify certain issues with the series. It is possible that it may well be the case that for all the eye candy and fairly shallow improvements to the game, there are still some rather outstanding faults that are now seemingly unlikely to be addressed. For me it's a concern but, not one that is held without understanding of the current alpha situation. More to the point, it is clarity and ownership of a given situation that every customer of a service should feel like they can expect. On the contrary, sometimes a forum can be an arena for people with some strange appropriation toward a pseudo moral high ground stance of defending a business no matter what happens, or what doesn't. Conversely, showing signs of critical thinking and higher expectations so that the money customers spend and the support they offer isn't taken for granted is of far greater importance to a business that wants to be successful. The feedback tracker is a symbol of this intention and it is why there is a growing significance that they reply to the many questions and concerns in a more specific and thorough manner that many of their customers are voicing. I'm not here to promote the game for BIS nor discredit their endeavour. I would like, if at all possible, for the developers to acknowledge these issues as repairable or fixable, or whether they don't believe there's a problem with how the game currently functions at a root level. Thanks, buddy. @ Myke. That makes sense to me and hopefully will be the case. I'm somewhat playing devil's advocate as I object to the dismissive comments from members who feel they have to defend what isn't necessarily in question. Make your own minds up as to what I mean by that, as you will. I have a decent rig and can get the game running at around 60-100 fps on whatever settings I chose, fine, and when starting a mission with 20-30 AI I'll drop to the mid 30s-70s in the more detailed areas. Game looks decent and the feel is adequate for me. I personally can't accept the game play when around mid 20fps and this can occur when adding another few squads each side, pushing the 50+ AI count. Lowering all graphics settings with 50+ up to 100 AI and seeing my system struggle with that is what I'd hoped wouldn't have such an impact, but I guess that the overhaul of the AI is to do with this and subsequently could be polished at a later date in order to allow performance to benefit. We'll see, I suppose and I can accept this but I'd like to think there can be improvements made, especially as currently I see only small difference with how the AI behave compared to ARMA2. I'll be patient and look toward seeing the progression with the performance side of things along with the rest of the features as they come. My main gripe is really to do with the AI walking through walls when constructing a base in the editor, among other stupid things the AI do, I'm disappointed that this still happens.

Not one of these posts means a bloody thing! Don't you realise? None depict a scenario and a true representation of what FPS they get. Pointless thread. Like the one above. Smooth? What does that mean? Medium? How many AI, or what rock are you staring at? EDIT: Sorry wrong thread.. But still...

I really hope and believe BIS will manage to focus on this and know where they're going wrong. I have trust in them. The same guys who bought flashy to me 12 or so years ago won't want to see this game fail. I could be cynical and believe that they released this game as alpha to make money early on, knowing that they've got a big problem with the code they've used for this new engine but, I really don't believe they've got it that wrong. I hope that they truly want the support of the community to resolve issues and create a game, somewhat in partnership with their fans, that is the best they've ever accomplished. It already looks very good, feels nice at times and when fighting with a few AI after sorting out an adequate setting of eye candy that still feels good but offers stable/high fps on my particular PC, you can tell there are some good if not great improvements. Are there enough? It's difficult to say, obviously but, patience is a virtue and without the frustration of AI walking through walls and the much lamented poor performance with MP (which I haven't tested) or SP then it is difficult to see the bigger picture, if such a picture exists, of course. I really do hope it isn't just a better looking game with the same problems as ever. I think it's unfortunate that there are those who played early on who possibly started instantly thinking 'wow, this is good enough for a release candidate' as it obviously has muddied the waters with regards to the overall consensus and in my opinion is based on how the game looked without the awareness of the series' history. Being somewhat pessimistic as to whether BIS have sorted out some annoying aspects of their previous titles allowed me to just question what it was they've done, at times a little too despondently. When it comes down to it, the frustrating 'it's alpha' response, although tiring to read and pointless when discussing possible issues with the game based on previous experience, is still valid. I don't believe anyone here forgets that. It is, of course, not finished. BIS, I'm sure would agree, would also say it's nothing up to the standards they'd want to us to believe is their finished product...yet. Like Eagle Dynamics, and although the Black Shark1/2 element was a dodgy part of their business model, they still show us that with every update there's progress and every issue that's discussed, they are aware of and look to resolve. I'm sure this takes time to do well and having patience for their work is a necessity but, not a hopeless endeavour! I do believe they (BIS) value our feedback and do have hope that they not only want to make money and be successful as a business but also achieve something with integrity. I don't think 'take the money run' applies. That said, however, I knew I would only spend £20 on this game instead of the more expensive options because I for one do not want to see the same issues that held ARMA2 back and ultimately saw me venturing elsewhere to enjoy gaming/simming on the PC. If these issues are still there upon release, I'm moving on. If BIS manage to get this bug sorted out soon, by Beta release or soon thereafter, then I'll be a very happy customer because the game has so much potential. I just hope BIS and the team involved want to see their plan to create a cutting edge military simulator come to fruition and want to show us what they're capable of. Their market has grown and they must know that their customers aren't all building the latest systems to play their game. With that in mind I hope that the optimisation, if and when it comes, is evidence of a refined and polished title that is accessible to many people whose PCs are within the specifications of the game but also shows how things have progressed with BIS's vision of their ARMA series venture. Good luck! I hope you manage it!

Voted, Tested. Seems like there could be inherent performance issues with the engine. I sincerely hope not but I'm losing faith, really. Editor- 5 squads each side, all GFX on low and my 3570K can't cope. GTX670, 8GB 1600 RAM. That's 50AI infantry. Doesn't seem good enough.

Ah cheers, Myke. Well, we just took out the scripts for UPS and Random house pos script and it still does it, but maybe it's more to do with after respawning. I'll test with vanilla now. If you've heard no issues with vanilla then I'd have thought more obviously it'll be more likely to be a mod.. Oh well, back to troubleshooting. Spend all my days troubleshooting recently. (had a mobo that blew recently..) jeez

Hi, in the latest BETA and using a few mods, me n a mate have come into some issues with the enemy AI not shooting back. I've seen a post on armaholic that says there is the same issue but seems to think it happens after 3 minutes. We're using this as a startup: beta;expansion;@rh_aks;@RH_M4;@CBA_A2;@CBA_OA;@CBA;@JSRS;@len_l119;@CSLA;@Blastcore_Visuals;@RH_SMG;@DutchArmy;@MBG_Celle;@SG_Modern_FSB;@SG_Krinkov;@sthud;@sg_morpeh;@tpw_ai_los;@JTD;@SG_GRU;@tpwc_ai_sup.bat Does anyone know if any o these have problems like this? I think the mission is using UPS. There is also a house position script. We'll test without a few o these mods/scripts, just wanted to bring it to attention. Any ideas?

Over at Eagle Dynamics they've just released the long awaited upgrade for DCS Black Shark bringing with it graphics updates and improved AI among other things. Great simulator and well worth a look! ED Forums

Some o' you lot need to chill tf out. Have some sex now n then? Go outside and breath some fresh air or summit. $20 is worth it, if you don't think so then just don't buy it and stfu. Support these devs. Don't criticise them with your bitter, tight-arse drivel.

When you've downloaded patch 1.08, hopefully the full patch as described here: http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=109862 Which links to the page here: http://www.arma2.com/index.php?option=com_rokdownloads&view=file&Itemid=20&id=426%3Aarma-2-update-1-00-1-07-to-1〈= At 323 MB in size, that download will take your installed version, presumably V1.00, up to 1.08. When the file is downloaded you should use a tool like winRAR to extract the download as it is in a compressed form. http://www.rarlab.com/download.htm Click the download option at the top called: WinRAR x86 (32 bit) 4.00 beta 7 OR if you are on a 64 bit version of windows then download the one called: WinRAR x64 (64 bit) 4.00 beta 7 Download winRAR and doucle click it to install it. Once winrar is installed you should notice that when you right click on a .rar file, like the update for arma2 you've just downloaded, you should see an option to: Extract To ARMA2Patch_1_00_to_1_08 Clicking that option will alow the download to be uncompressed into a folder with the same name. From there, after that folder has been created with the uncompressed files within it, you will find two files called: ARMA2Patch_108_readme and ARMA2Patch_1_00_to_1_08 Double click the application or exe file and your ARMA2 will be updated after a short while. What version of windows are you running? To find out if you need the 32 bit or 64 bit copy of winrar, although both will run fine, check by right clicking 'Computer' in your start menu and then click 'Properties'. Scroll down and look for where it says 'System Type' Hope that helps. Sounds to me like you're trying to drag the file you've downloaded onto your CD/DVD RW drive where you might have placed your ARMA2 DVD? Don't do that!!! Just follow my instructions, once you've clicked the update application "ARMA2Patch_1_00_to_1_08" (not just the readme file, although you can read that if you like) the installer will search for where you have ARMA2 installed and will commence updating. You won't need to do anything until it finishes.

There is a parallel universe where people who play ARMA are viewed as junkies. They often don't wash, they are always out begging for money for their 'bus fare home' (really it's savings for a TrackIR or a new CPU) and schools have ARMA awareness days, hoping to show those kids that they should JUST SAY NO! There is a 'war on ARMA', it doesn't work though, it just pushes sales onto the seedy backstreets. Dirty copies of Arrowhead getting sold as just a DVD in some clingfilm, bits of dirt all over it. The good stuff, the ones in a box with a knock off manual, can fetch big money. But boy, if you're caught with one of those... It's hard to find a good dealer sometimes. Copies with scratches, files missing, all sorts, just so the dealer can make a fast buck. Don't even think about trying to play online. Most of the servers are clandestine operations constructed by the local law enforcement. You have to be really careful. Heroin addiction is a gateway drug, they say. It won't be long before someone offers you a hit of ARMA and it'll be the road to ruin. Stories of MPs having a quick shot in the toilets on a laptop, pop idols getting caught looking dishevelled after being up all night 'partying'...You can see the glazed look in their eyes, the red sores around their wrist from moving the mouse around and around and around. Just hoping that the next time they 'left click', the high will be just like it was before.