SeXyWombat

I have a simple question with a probably not-so-simple answer: how did the Liberation 1941-1945 Mod tank damage system exactly work? I would love the idea of reapplying it to modern armor, but I can't find any documentation etc. whatsoever. I tried to mimic it with my own project for ArmA, but the results were far from what I've seen in LIBMOD and I wasn't exactly pleased with that. So - any possible hints? What was the scripting/config solution they used? I don't want to steal their scripts, I just want to become aware of the solutions they used and work with them to create some new content for our beloved game.

PreAlpha version of the M1A1 vs T72 demo is almost done. I'm currently going to do some bug testing and if everything is fine I'm going to make a release in a few days as promised. Stay tuned. EDIT: Played a few games just to check it out. At one time I made something like a battalion sized T-72 force (36 tanks) attack an M1A1 company (12 tanks). The attacking force was obliterated with only two Abrams tanks burning in the end (and some crews disembarking due to battle damage). I know it wasn't exactly Desert Storm, but... take that, vanilla ArmA!

It would be nice, but I don't know if there's any way of getting the angle of impact from the game. Using the angle between the projectile and the tank doesn't really do it justice, as the point of impact is not always the center of the tank (actually, it's a weak point of this system, as selections seem to be not reliable enough to determine if rear/side/front armour was attacked and it has to be calculated based on the direction the tank is facing in relation to the projectile - so if the tank has exposed side and a little bit of front armour and you hit the front part, side armour value will unfortunately be used in determining if a critical hit has occurred).

Yeah, but since incorporating it is going to be like adding 2 lines to the script I don't believe it's an issue really. If it's important and released it's probably going to be there.

It's not like there are tons of tank addons and tank types taking part in combat irl anyway. And I hope that each release is going to include the best tank addons the community has produced - but that just depends on getting the permissions.

.50cal and the like round hits will cause armour checks for vehicles like BMP and may result in penetration (so yes, you will be able to kill the crew if you fire your M107/M2 at a BMP). It's v1.0 stuff though - the demo will include only M1A1 and T72.

Nothing groundbreaking, at least in the demo release. Basically applying the stuff that's already been done (like in MAPFACT_AirPack) to tanks.

In the first (demo) release - no, no way. Demo is going to be just the basic scripts and basic features. Basically, it's going to be M1A1 vs T72 themed with a few missions to play around with and no compatibility claims with other units whatsoever. In 1.0 hopefully you will see T-series tanks' turrets blown off and some custom hit effects. The system will cover all the vanilla ArmA units and some user created ones if I get the permissions by then. Just remember it's not an eye candy project. The focus is on changing the damage system and creating a more realistic environment for armored combat in ArmA.

aaaaah, good to hear ... _demo/betaRelease = random 7 _v1.0Release = _demo/betaRelease + random 21 (and that's a very rough estimate) _finalRelease = when I say it's final. Pleased? But seriously, I don't want to feel any pressure. Nevertheless, the scripts and config guidelines are mostly done, so if you're interested, you're going to get your hands on this stuff rather sooner than later.

I'm currently working on a new damage system for ArmA vehicles. Basic Features: * Basic IR devices for tanks that irl use them. * New config entries - BIS damage system will effectively work only with turrets and tracks; knocking out a tank no longer means it explodes. This means much more mobility kills and weapon kills and less explosions. * New penetration system - tanks may receive critical hits from rounds that irl can penetrate their armor; penetration will be calculated based on side from which tank was hit (front/side/rear), type of damage (kinetic for rounds like SABOT, chemical for HEAT and explosive for, well, explosives), penetration capabilities of projectiles and, in relevant cases, distance; the system will take different armour resistance to different ammo types into account. * New critical hit system - penetration will result in crew casualties, engine damage, ammo destruction, weapon systems malfunctioning etc. Each tank will have individual critical hit table. Features planned for further releases: * Functional ERA. * Functional ARENA system. * MPAT and HE-FS simulation. * T-x turret pops up when the tank explodes. MP compatibility: unknown, but probably should work. Final Release: when it's done. Demo/Beta: probably soon.

Addons will have to be modified to work with the system, but the process is not going to be very complicated (nevertheless, a little time consuming). The initial pack will include some quality addons modified to work with the system if I get permissions from authors. MP compatibility will not be tested before the first release. If it works, it works - if not, I may try to do something about it later. No guarantees here.

I managed to so to speak say goodbye to default BIS system to a large extent. No more one shot kills. I modified armor value to a very high number, while setting armor value to specific selections at values like 0.02/0.01. That way parts that make the tank go boom, like engine and hull require 5 M289A2 SABOT hits and 10+ T-72 SABOT (whatever was its name ;p) to go. I run a script, that has "thickness" values for parts like front/side/rear/turret (only one value for a turret possible until I find a better way) and checks them against the penetration of any attacking round capable of hurting the tank. It it doesn't penetrate - well, tough luck, no effect. If it does penetrate, there's a critical hit (call to a tank specific script, which chooses between crew kills, engine destruction, weapon system failures etc. based on selection that was penetrated, ammunition used and a "dice roll"). The problem is that due to multiple selections being affected by each round, and the less critical selections relying on BIS system (cause it's not so bad when it works with the turret, gun and tracks alone) we get a "track destroyed" mobility kill when a turret is hit by a powerful SABOT round. I'd love to root out this imperfection, but even if there's no way to do this, this system is already producing some very nice results. Nevertheless, the multiple selections problem messes a little with the critical hit system, so please elaborate on how can I get the "most dammaged selection" out of the game in a script - that would really help. Anyway, if there are no huge bumps hiding on the road ahead, we might very well finally be getting a more realistic tank warfare system.

Ok, I did manage to get some (well, even more than "some") progress going, but there's a problem. Every time I fire a round (even like NWD M289A2 SABOT) into an NWD M1A1 tank, multiple selections are hit (as registered by "dammaged" eventHandler), and sometimes a single selection is hit multiple times (by a single round !. One of these selections is almost always left track or right track (or both). While I can live with almost every strong HE round causing a mobility kill and sometimes weapon damage (which is somewhat realistic and exactly what happens right now), I'd rather get SABOT rounds to work like they should - ie. inflicting a lot of damage on a single selection. The question is: how do I change weapon/ammo config to make it happen (yes, I do know about indirectHit and indirectHitRange and no, it's not working)? If it can't be done like this, is there a possible scripting workaround? It'd be nice to get some help, because the way this system works right now, there's no more tanks blowing up, and somewhat realistic damage, but way too many mobility and/or weapon kills. Thanks in advance.

Isn't the lack of visual input after hitting a target in-your-face? Isn't getting more non-resolved engagements than clear victories or defeats in-your-face? The things I mentioned all make a game more simulation-oriented and more directly inaccessible - just like the 1-shot-kills you mentioned. The thing is, that probably most faithful ArmA players want as much in-your-face stuff as they can get. And as for the coding part and design choices - the "good enough" HP system is not good enough for me, especially since there are so many other options with warying degrees of complexity - some of them really easy to implement (and I mean "give me the attacker's ammo type in -dammaged- eventHandler and it's done" easy) and really shifting the balance of the game towards the realistic experience I'd like to get. I have a right to this opinion. I believe many ArmA fans would gladly welcome more realism in the next game, especially if it could be easily achieved (and please consider the fact that everything would be an improvement over this battlefield-like vehicular combat). You used the phrase "combat sim", and many people believe that ArmA would like to be exactly that - but please tell me, is the exact same damage model as the one used in games like C&C fitting for a combat sim? I understand that business is business, but a part of this business is the simple fact that different customers want different features and ArmA isn't aimed at the same market as, say, CoD4. Keeping things like hit points in seems to be at least a little schisophrenic - it's not going to please realism buffs, while the game by its nature is not going for the mass audience. So perhaps we should shift our attitudes from "supportive-no-matter-what" to constructive criticism. After all, wouldn't you like to see a better implementation of armored combat in ArmA2, or ArmA3 if that's not possible? Don't ArmA players jump mods like ECP and SLX to get the realism enhancements vanilla version does not offer?

ArmA vehicle combat is pretty arcade'ish due to HP system and whatnot. Ok, here's the idea: Let's change armored vehicle configs setting their HP values really high (so that no hit will damage the vehicle using the BIS system). Let's change ammo configs so that they have very different damage values to identify the ammo type when the vehicle is hit using the "dammaged" eventHandler. When the vehicle is hit, we use a script to "roll a dice" in a table corresponding to the ammo used, vehicle selection and type of vehicle we get from the EH to determine the effects. That way we could get all the realistic sorts of results, ranging from ricochet/no effect through killed/wounded crew members and/or mobility kill to ammo explosion. Since my ArmA editing knowledge is somewhat limited in some of the required fields I need your help. 1) Is there a way to damage a specific section of the vehicle through a script? Like setdammage directly to engine/main gun etc. 2) How exactly does the BIS vehicle damage model work? Is the damage inflicted by a given type of ammo a constant, randomly generated or something else? 3) Are there any good tutorials on editing armor/HP/ammo values? Links would be very much appreciated. And finally 4) Is there any reason why this idea would not work? Thanks in advance.