Oligo

OFP: Band of un-related military nutcases Anyway, Mark Knopfler is the best guitarist, IMO. (Se rulettaa ihan sikana. )

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Longinius @ July 19 2002,09:50)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Or maybe you want the crime to happen first and then punish whoever did it?<span id='postcolor'> That's the way, a-ha a-ha, we like it...

Everything is either black or white, good or evil! This is the naked truth! Kill those evil child-molesting bastards! Praise the LORD!

Same goes for Finland and Sweden also. We do a lot of peace-keeping. Even as we elongate this moronic thread, there are soldiers from our countries keeping peace somewhere (Kosovo for example), just like there are soldiers from U.S. and so forth. The arguments always follows this track: -Euro: WTF you U.S. always attacking Iraq and shit? -U.S.: We do it for peace and democracy. -Euro: BS, you do it for oil! -U.S.: No we do it for peace and democracy! -Euro: If you do it for peace and democracy, why the fuck aren't you keeping peace and democracy in China and Africa and such? -U.S.: Why the fuck aren't you euro mice sending your troops to keep the peace and democracy? Our poor U.S. soldiers always have to die for peace and democracy, because you won't do it! -Euro: We fucking keep the peace all the time! -U.S.: Yeah, with our goddamn money! We run NATO almost completely alone! -Euro: But you evil fucks don't pay your U.N. debts! -U.S.: Maybe that's because we give all this fucking money to all these fucking poor countries! -Euro: But we fucking give more money per capita than you goddamn do! et cetera ad infinitum

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (LauryThorn @ July 18 2002,10:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">i agree with that. Russia is so large country that it can give couple of thousands miles and then strike back.<span id='postcolor'> The scary part of it is that Stalin was preparing to attack Germany! That's why his troops were in an attack posture on the border. Imagine what would have happened if the russian might had been left roll across Europe unchecked by a german pre-emptive attack... They would be singing the Soviet anthem in Paris. "In one of his speeches about the attack on the Soviet Union, Hitler stated that the Soviets had placed a huge number of divisions along the German-Soviet border. What I saw when traveling through that forest were huge masses of well-camouflaged tanks, artillery, trucks, and other war materiel. Slonim was then only some 30 km. from the German-Soviet border and I must believe Hitler when he speculated that he had taken the jump against the Soviets because a few days later, they would have attacked. To judge from that much war materiel, I am inclined to believe Hitler. Remember: the Nazis were not the only ones who lied through their teeth." From a recollection by a german panzer trooper

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (xmurderx @ July 18 2002,10:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">4) shut down of alot of major factories causing a slowing in the production of russian amaments.<span id='postcolor'> The factories were empty. All the machinery had been removed and moved way back to Ural. Sometimes they even set them up under the naked sky!

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (LauryThorn @ July 18 2002,10:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">19 miles is nothing, at least when compared to the thousand miles they pushed their troops into Russian territory. Don't just stare at the numbers, look at the "big picture".<span id='postcolor'> The german attack at Moscow culminated (ran out of momentum) at 19 miles from Moscow. That was still outside the outmost of the three consecutive prepared defensive fortifications around the city and it was the high-point of german offensive to russia. A well prepared russian counterattack then struck the germans and the russian armoured spearheads penetrated several hundred kilometers to german-occupied territory. Moscow was not even THAT important. Stalin had already moved almost all industrial production way back to Ural. So if the germans had managed to take Moscow (another city-fight like Stalingrad I bet), the imminent russian counterattack would have hammered them back anyway. My hypothesis is that Germany could not have won the war against Russia even if the war had been fought one on one.

People are selfish. U.S. is a sovereign country full of selfish people and the leaders of that country are also selfish. The leaders want more for their people, but even more for themselves. The result is a controlling system in which the good given to the common people is optimized to a level to shut them up and of course most good is funneled to the leaders. All actions made to get the goodies are justified by the hammering indoctrination of the media, which starts when you're a child and goes on for the rest of your life. There is NO WAY that anybody in U.S. can have an unbiased opinion, because of this conditioning. Even if you think you're unbiased, you're affected. EU is a loose union of sovereign countries. The leaders of the EU organization are selfish, the national leaders are selfish and the people of each country are selfish. The result is a controlling system in which the good given to the common people is optimized to a level to shut them up and of course most good is funneled to the leaders. All actions made to get the goodies are justified by the hammering indoctrination of the media, which starts when you're a child and goes on for the rest of your life. There is NO WAY that anybody in any EU country can have an unbiased opinion, because of this conditioning. Even if you think you're unbiased, you're affected. When these two systems brush against each other, exchanges like this thread occur. What both parties should see is that they don't even really speak the same language because of the different indoctrination they have received during their lives (such differences in mindscape also exist between the people from different U.S. states and different E.U. nations). You speak to each other, but cannot really HEAR each other. Ever wondered why the people from China can seem a little... strange, like you're not quite on the same wavelength? Look above, there's the reason.

Anyway, I guess that's that. I doubt that Morocco is going to try to make a counterattack.

These just rule. Meindl Tunturisusi: Meindl is a german company, so I think the shoes are available around europe. The outer surface is made of tough leather and there is a Gore Tex membrane between the leather and the inner lining.

So those guys are now POW? Or are they going to be trialed in front of a mock military tribunal like the U.S. likes to do.

Haven't you guys read the guide in Thespark.com called: "How to get your ass kicked in such a way that the other guy goes to jail." It has all these neat tips. My favourite one is this: "Take your wallet into your hand and approach the opponent, making faces to piss him off. Offer your head in such a way that he can easily achieve a headlock. While he is pounding your face with his fist, slip your wallet into one your opponents pockets. Now his charge is going to be mugging instead of mere battery."

I think people are so scared nowadays, because of the very very efficient media. Every little incident is reported to the max in real time. I'd just love to know how our times are more violent than the past times. At least we don't have white VALPO shooting reds on the streets with military issue machine guns or read VALPO shooting whites on the streets with military issue machine guns like happened many many times in the center of Helsinki just about 60 years ago. People forget fast.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Satchel @ July 16 2002,18:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Standard issue Bundeswehr Kampfstiefel (Combat boots):<span id='postcolor'> LOL! I went hiking with my friend. He was wearing Bundeswehr Kampfstiefel boots and I was wearing my trusty pair of Meindl Tunturisusi boots. My friend treated the boots well, he even applied this water-proofing boot-polish every evening in camp. It was raining a lot. The result was that his feet were soaking wet all the time (he was pissed), whereas my feet were nicely warm and dry inside my boots. Goddamn I love those boots! I can only say like the officer in some Vietnam movie: "Do me a favour and keep your feet dry. That Mekong river can eat the flesh right off your legs."

Yeps, I remember some moron accidentally blowing himself up, when he was trying to set up a bomb to blow some other criminal to bits. Quite lame.

Combat Mission is THE best strategy game around. It manages to take all the good things from turn-based and real-time games, leaving out the bad things. Together this makes the closest approximation of battallion-size engagements I have seen.

Here is the finnish summer combat boot: Varsikenkä M91. Here is the winter boot: The summer boot is decent. Quite light, but requires good socks to be comfortable. The winter boot is heavy as hell, but it is also very warm. I survived 40 degrees freeze with those ones like a dream. But if I ever go to war, I'll take these babies: Meindl Tunturisusi I bought them a couple of years back with 200 euros. I have trekked with them for quite a while now and I have no complaints. Water-proof and breathing, fit like a dream, I love those boots.

"If a Swede would build a Viking Center in Saudi Arabia, it would not be branded as racist. Actually there are a lot of Swedish schools in the world intended for Swedish people only." Like the goddamn Ĺbo Akademi here in Finland. The mission statement of that university is to further the place of swedish language in Finland. If some other university declared to further the place of finnish language in Finland, it would not be approved, ever. All universities here have to be either two-languaged (finnish and swedish) or swedish. Oh, talk about minority oppressing majority. All Finns have to learn swedish in school, it's mandatory. "Honestly though, if only muslims use the labs its much easier for muslim terrorists to actually abuse the labs. If it was in an ordinary school you'd have lots of people around who could take notice and report it. In an isolated center that is not the case. And no, I don't think they referred to ordinary school labs. If it was ordinary labs they wouldnt even have mentioned it." It's funny how people think that labs are some kind of magical places where much trickery can be performed. A typical lab does not differ much from a typical kitchen. Evil terrorists could build secret labs in any basement with ease, because all it takes to make a lab is some special equipment which anybody can purchase with enough money, no questions asked. Register your basement as a biotech company (anybody can do this) and you can order whatnot without any suspicion. What it takes to make a biological or chemical weapon is SKILL, which does not just grow in a lab. And normal labs are very easy to abuse, too. I have done it myself. Nobody ever asks any questions. I could grow Anthrax in the corner and people would notice only after they start dropping...

Definitely. That site is really funny.

Why should JWL be punished even if he had picked up a weapon and fired upon the U.S. soldiers? He was wearing the "uniform" of the opposing side and could thus be easily identified as the enemy by U.S. troops. If anything, JWL should be a POW, because he clearly abandoned his loyalty to U.S. and took up a new one. He did not fool anybody with any acts of still being loyal to U.S. (an act of treachery or treason).

The same pages say that a finnish infantryman should be trained until he can score a hit to a 20cm circle from 150m with a 80% propability, that is, pretty much consistently. I doubt that only one in ten people even has potential for such accuracy, so they surely have set their aims high considering that we have conscription in Finland. Oh well, I guess that I should be pretty proud that I got the gold marksman badge when I served.

Okay, I did some research. The Finnish Defence Force pages claim that a new RK62 makes a 10cm grouping from 150m. Thus you'd have to be a very good shot indeed so that the accuracy of the gun becomes the limiting factor.

Mistreating, right. He didn't intentionally fill the gun with sand, you know. It's just that we had to crawl through all this crap before firing, so his gun was not the only thing filled with sand. There was sand in our boots and inside our jackets and in our kitbags. If a gun cannot survive a little movement in cover, what's the use of the gun? And no need to be sarcastic. The inner black target area of a standard 150m rifle target is around 40-70cm. I just cannot remember for sure, it's been a while. About one in ten of our company could consistently hit that area with a RK62 (including me). A few people of our coy could consistently hit the inner half of that target circle (the size of a big dinner plate). Pretty impressive, I'd say, but nothing phenomenal.

But how much accuracy do you need? Everybody is not a marksman, you know. If you take a sample of serving men, how big a percentage do you think even has potential to fire a smaller grouping than say AK47 can make due to weapon accuracy? There were a few good marksmen in our company. These people could consistently slam all their rounds inside an area of a dining plate from 150m with a RK62. Now if your head was the target, you'd be dead every time. And who shoots to the head, anyways? All I'm saying is that AK47 has enough accuracy to kill humans with and almost more reliability than the soldiers themselves. It also has the massy 7.62mm bullet to punch through bushes and twigs without deflection. And I'll believe it when I see a SIG manufactured assault rifle survive being fire housing full of sand.

Now this is a really hard question. I'd love to say M16, because it is a really beautiful piece. All the controls are nicely thought out and the accuracy is good or so I have heard. But considering the conditions on the field, I'd have to say that the best rifle around is the AK47 and the good variants. This thing is reliable beyond any doubt. You can take a shit inside the housing and it will still fire without jams. I have seen a SAKO RK62 (AK47 variant) being fired with the housing full of sand. The bullet left the barrel, but the slide got jammed half-way (no wonder). The firing person just popped the housing cover (a press of a button), poured out the sand, reattached the cover and cocked the gun. And he was back rocking and rolling, no hassle. It's still accurate enough as well. With the 7.62mm bullet, at least I managed to easily drop man-sized targets at 300 meters. During my military service, our whole company experienced practically no jams whatsoever that I heard of, except for the one where the gun was fired housing full of sand. The reason I appreciate reliability over everything else is the conditions on the field. You always have to crawl through sand, mud and shite, so you would not want your gun to be made of sugar.