NavyEEL

Nor does calling them "women" or "children" imply that they were NOT fighters. If a woman is helping to try and kill you, is she still innocent? What about children? What is their definition of "children"... anybody under 18? There are plenty of teenagers willing to take up arms against Americans, which would therefore make them the enemy as well. The media exists to hype up events and make them sound interesting--you can't take these numbers at face value. Americans would not target what you like to call "civilians" without reason. Don't you find it odd that your calculations put the deaths at 50+% civilian casualties? My guess is that most of these people were not "civilians" at all. When does a civilian stop being a civilian? Does he have to wear a uniform and run around proclaiming his Anti-Americanism before he is no longer labeled as a civilian?

What else would you call people who dismember peoples' bodies? Â If they were radical Christians, I'm sure they would be called savage Christian terrorists. How about showing me where we don't care? Â We try to minimize casualties on both sides as much as possible. Â Who are the ones currently being attacked in Iraq? Â Oh yeah that's right, we are--in fact, that's how my friend's brother got killed on Monday. Â Do civilians die in war? Â Yes. Â Do soldiers die in war? Â Yes. Â Does that mean we should treat their deaths as unimportant, just events to be expected? Â No, because that's when real chaos will set in--when the value of life becomes unimportant to people. Do we sit in our houses and constantly weep for the dead? Â No, not at all. Â But does that mean we do not care? Â Certainly not. Â And does it mean we should disrespect the deaths of American soldiers just because we disagree with US foreign policy, or because of the fact that they were soldiers and "are expected to die"? Â I hope not. I don't know about you, but I certainly did not sign up to die, nor did my grandfather and father before they were killed. Â And if I do die, I pray that people will not treat my death as insignificant simply because I was a soldier. Â Otherwise, what's the point of giving your life for your country?

If they want a memorial fund, why don't they establish one? You guys are so heartless when it comes to Americans dying. You think because he was not a civilian, that his death should be expected, and no one should have sympathy for his family? Just because we care about the death of a fellow American does not mean we don't care about the deaths of others as well.

Hey don't try to pull "us yanks" into it. This movie has the potential to be as realistic as Pearl Harbor. And we all know how good of a movie THAT was! Aside from Top Gun, I was never much of a Cruise fan anyway. "You guys are dangerous"

Just in case nobody else from West Point responds... we actually have a center dedicated to the combating of terrorism and aspects of urban warfare. I haven't taken any of those classes yet, so I can't give you any first-hand experience. Starting last year, we are taught basic CQB and MOUT skills (to include reflexive fire) as part of our military training programs. Someone from our Combat Weapons Team or Infantry Tactics Club would probably be best available to answer your questions regarding UW--they train for it quite often doing CQB live fire training. On a side note, yes I am aware my name says "Navy" in it, but don't let that fool you--I am 100% Army. Hooah!

Returning fire with individual and collective weapons, requesting armor support (even if it's in the middle of an urban area, the command should be able to attach a few infantry squads to the tanks as support. If the shit really hits then fan then you call in CLOSE air support (a gunship or any armed helicopter). If those aren't available? And there happens to be a friendly aircraft nearby with attack capabilities? I don't think we can accurately assess the situation without being there, but an airstrike should not automatically be ruled out simply because it seems "overpowering".... especially since we do not know exactly what kind of resistance our soldiers were facing. I agree 100% with your assessment that returning fire with individual weapons, armor, and CAS would be most effective and preferable in this situation. In addition, I know that the majority of other US soldiers agree. This is why I do not believe that a bomb would be needlessly dropped into a city, knowing the collateral damage it would cause. American soldiers, especially officers who are the ones giving commands, are not even close to being that incompetent. Do you think that someone would be trained on how to call in an airstrike without undergoing training on when it is appropriate to use such a strike? I certainly do not.

An airstrike is bound to have collateral damage, just as a war is bound to have collateral damage. Â I'm glad you can see that people dying and property being destroyed is not a result of American aggression or lack of respect for Iraqis, but it is simply a by-product of being involved in war. Â If calling in a precision airstrike is not an acceptable way to protect your troops when they come under attack, then what is? Â

So genocide it is? Â NavyEEL: Nor a very credible story. I don't know if you saw pictures from the fighting but from what could be seen it was indiscriminate. And I'm talking about both sides. The resistance wildly firing RPGs all over the place and the US troops responding by calling in air strikes smack in the middle of urban areas. I'd be surprised if even 10% of the dead were more than random victims. It was not random bombing though. It's not like we carpet-bombed the city. Considering we have guidance systems that can precision-guide bombs and missiles to land just about anywhere we want them to, do you honestly think we would just indiscriminantly drop a bomb in the middle of a city unless there was something in particular it was being dropped on? If we are being attacked "smack in the middle of urban areas," then of course airstrikes will be called "smack in the middle of urban areas." Where our tactics differ is in that we are selective of our targets and strive to eliminate both collateral damage and the death of innocent life.

Looks like they´re going in. Good idea ? No. Too many worshippers still in town. Too much symbolism. This is what the TBA calls a precise strike: I don´t want to know what an unprecise US strike looks like 50 percent failure rate at least. No good way to make friends in Iraq. The rate is to be considered even higher as not every male in a certain age group is with the fighters. Poor performance. Very poor. This should be investigated. Not by the US but by independant organizations like HRW or others and the ones responsible for giving orders should be taken to justice. War´s over, don´t forget that. At least that´s what GWB tries to tell us. I´m looking forward to his speech today. I am sure we will hear a lot of "terrorists" again. How many of those "women, children, and elderly" were armed? You can't really trust the media as far as statistics regarding civilian casualties are concerned... remember, the media is designed to ENTERTAIN. Saying that American troops killed 1,000 Iraqi soldiers with no civilian casualties doesn't make for a very interesting story, does it?

I told you last year, they will pull out to get another battle going elsewhere. (otherwise they will jsut pull out and stop there for a while) What do you think? Â Do you think it 's normal to talk about handing over power in July? Â To whom exactly? Â No they will simply leave what they can in Iraq in the next dozen months. It's necessary to hand over power in July, or at least some time before the election. Not only is it important to give the Iraqis power and self-government as soon as possible, but the President has no choice. If he delays giving power back to Iraq and he ends up losing the election, then the new President could choose to pull out of Iraq, thus defeating our entire purpose there. Handing over power does not mean abandoning them entirely--it just means giving them control so that, in the event that a new president chooses to withdraw entirely from Iraq, at least they would have somewhat of a government already pre-established.

Beautiful pics! I was wondering if that Longbow is a released addon, or something you just made up for yourself? It really looks great, and I especially like the 16-hellfire loadout.

With the current article... how can there be such a variance in the number of deaths? Â Reports as "low" as 12 and as "high" as 130... seems like quite a difference to me. Â If it was something like "death toll is between 10 and 20", that would seem more reasonable, but a range of over 100? Â What's the deal? Â The reporters really bad with math, or what?

Holy %^@#.... it looks so REAL! Â Lee, what apache is that? Â it looks awesome! Â great pics, as always. Â EDIT: oops forgot... no quoting pics heheh.

Where do you suppose those troops come from. Majority of trouble seems to come from a few cities. Hi billybob2002 The countries that started the war will have to provide the troops. I have little doubt the draft will be brought in both in the US and unfortunatley soon after in the UK. The Choice is Stark. Stablise the country or surrender it to Al Qiada. The world is in already the worst it has ever been for terrorism. Imagine the educated Iraqi population being turned to it and shuder at that thought. The effect on the surrounding middle east has already sent oil prices soaring, as the busnessmen stock up in expectation of the effect on the surrounding oil producing nations. The surrounding regimes in Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, the UAE , Baharain etc. could all fall like a house of cards. The use of undisaplined mercinary troops in a recipe for disaster. It is a result of the retreat in to the bunker mentality. It is plane in the videos the troops in the Sunni triangle have given up the towns and streets to the terrorists. The complete strategic failure of TBA and TBA2 has given away the hard won victory of removing Sadam. Saddened Walker The draft will not be reinstated in the US. Unless we are attacked and become involved in a defensive war in which we are underpowered, the military will remain an all-volunteer force. That is what makes us both strong and professional--because we are composed of people who want to be here for one reason or another. Iraq will get better, and so will Afghanistan. Is terrorism currently the worst it has ever been in the world? Probably yes. But, that's simply because it's the latest type of warfare and the best way for radical groups to get their point across. "Terrorism" as we know it in its current form will eventually subside, and they will develop some new way to harm and intimidate other people. We will always be fighting "terrorist" groups of some sort... just as there will always be murderers, robbers, and other types of corrupt people in the world. However, that does not mean we should simply stop fighting. We must remain aggressive and stay ahead of them, attempting to stop them before they have a chance to wreak havoc against us. Also, the use of "mercenary" troops has become necessary, and they are far from being undisciplined. We do not have the manpower to have half of our military constantly deployed or preparing to deploy to Iraq for the long-term. We are not there to babysit or safeguard them. The idea is to train their military so they can become self-sufficient and defend themselves. There's a saying that goes something like "give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. teach him how to fish and he can eat for his life." or something to that extent. I can't remember the exact words, but you get my point--we are there to free, stabilize, educate, and train the Iraqi people so that they can work for themselves and won't have to depend on us.

i dunno, but the trailer looks awesome!

Wow... that last shot looks real, Mr Burns. Simply amazing!

haven't been able to d/l yet, but from the pics I would say they are just US Army light infantrymen.

I was wondering if there was a good MRLS/MLRS (I can never remember how to spell it...) addon out? I searched but all I could find was a beta that was released about a year ago. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

thanks guys, i really appreciate the help!

OFP2: Military domination at your fingertips

they fold the flag and put it in their pockets to be less conspicuous

same here. i can never d/l from their ftp, which is unfortunate since they always seem to have the latest and greatest addons on their site.

Not sure about other armies, but here is the layout for the US: A battalion is composed of 4 or more companies, with roughly 400 to 1000 members. A company is composed of 2 or more platoons, with about 100 to 250 members. A typical light infantry company consists of three rifle platoons and a headquarters platoon. A platoon is composed of 2 or more squads (usually 4 squads) and has 16 to 50 members. (39 members for a typical light infantry platoon) A squad is composed of two or more fireteams and usually has 9 members (for a light infantry squad). A fireteam is usually 4 members.

Arrrr..... PIRATES!!!! You're Madagascar! Lots of people don't really know anything about you, making you buried treasure of the rarest kind. You love nature, and could get lost in it whenever possible. You're remote and exotic, and the few people who know you value whatever they share with you a great deal. For some reason, you really like the word lemur.

You need to brush up on your reading skills http://denoir.ma.cx/ofp/gdp2.jpg And take a look at the 2002. Well if you base arguments on this data table, then what is the big deal? Â It is clear to see that the ratio between the USD and the EURO currencies have fluctuated quite a bit over the past decade. Â Just because the dollar is at a low at the moment does not mean our economy is crumbling. Â It appears to me that, as usual, an event involving the US economy has been taken to an extreme. EDIT: Â Oh, and if I'm totally wrong on this, somebody please correct me. Â I could be reading this table wrong. edit:ralph: please do not quote images.