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miles teg

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Everything posted by miles teg

  1. miles teg

    Ul_trike ultralight for a great solo

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (andysim @ July 21 2002,22:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Co-vert OPS mission , I talking about the ultralight you can get from planetrainbowsix.com/atwar/ofp ,,,,altough I cant get a link to work from that site you will have to find it your self,,,sorry Its Called ul_trike.zip its a slow aircraft that could be used for recon and when you shut the engine of It glides for miles and is very quiet for the perfect solo or duel insertion. Would this be used in real life? ,I dunno but it is fun. Andrew.<span id='postcolor'> I haven't heard of ultralights being used for covert ops although I'm sure such a thing might be possible if covert extraction is needed. However they're noisy and slow so they don't quite work as well for a quick extraction. That's where something like a MH-60 Pavehawk (fast and heavily armored) usually is a safer method of extraction. However Special Operation units do train using parasails...those are basically large manueverable parachutes that are used in high altitude jumps. The soldiers can be dropped many miles away from the landing zone and they simply glide to the target area. However it doesn't work well if there is any wind to speak of. For that reason a motorized parasail might be practicle...or just disposable ultralights. I also seem to remember someone making a military ultralight with a kevlar bottom lining to protect it from small arms fire. But I haven't heard of anyone using it. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  2. miles teg

    Aliens apc

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (rat @ July 21 2002,19:59)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">looking good just one question... door...isn't it on the left side of the apc? and the turret....how about a cutscene.... if the idea of an animation for the turret posn. is not possible.....when the action turret to fire posn. is selected it triggers a cutscene...maybe an internal shot of the cabin with the noise of the motors moving the turret...a little shake and clang as the turret locks in and then end the cutscene..... the problem could then be solved with 2 models....turret stowed and the other in combat position<span id='postcolor'> Cut scenes are done in the mission editor, not in the addon itself. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  3. miles teg

    New sa80 is already out

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (vade_101 @ July 20 2002,16:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">the troops are from Bibmi's rather excellent UK paratroopers addon (available from www.ofpeditingcenter.com). they do look very, very good with the SA80. if the guy has just vanished i might just upload the thing and put a note in the readme saying who actually did the work. Dave<span id='postcolor'> That would be cool if he's not around anymore to respond. At least you would be giving him credit which is the right thing to do. Oh by the way. Does the Bibmi British Marine units and Paratroopers work on Resistance for you? I tried them with Resistance and they all have the white medic arm band on them now which really sucks. Does yours do that or did you fix that problem also? Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  4. miles teg

    New sa80 is already out

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Major Fubar @ July 20 2002,04:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Miles Teg @ July 19 2002,19:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">1. Â The soldier's damage level is 600...he's like a tank.<span id='postcolor'> I thought something was weird...I blasted the hell outta that guy and he kept coming like a damn terminator... You could use this effect (not quite so high) to simulate body armour...<span id='postcolor'> Hehehe! Yeah I was thinking exactly the same thing. If it was toned down just to make it so you could take maybe 5 hits before dying it could simulate body armor. I hope someone makes a body armor soldier addon like that. That would be nice...maybe something like making Army Rangers with the "Ranger Vest" like the ones they used in Afghanistan (which did save some lives in Operation Anaconda according to one guy from the 10th Mountain Division who's vest took a round). Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  5. miles teg

    Eviscerator & colorcharger's tornado

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (vade_101 @ July 19 2002,15:06)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">BTW, We have phased out the JP233 now. We lost a few good people in the Gulf using that weapon on airfields. Its easier to throw Durandals or LGB's from a distance.<span id='postcolor'> the JP2333 was dangerous to use (requiring the pilot to fly in a strainght line at extremly low-level for the length of the runway, thus becoming extremly vulnerable to light AAA) however the reason for its phasing out was that its HB876 sub-munition was banned under the Ottawa Convention banning the use of landmines. A total of 6 Tornado GR1s were lost in action in the Gulf, 5 of which were involved in loft-medium level attacks with 1,000lb bombs, and only one tasked on a low level JP233 mission (out of 100 sorties with the weapon), which was lost some three minutes after the attack was completed. Statement on the Loss of RAF Tornado Aircraft in Combat During the Conduct of Air Operations against Iraq.<span id='postcolor'> That's very interesting info! I didn't know that. I just assumed that all of the Tornadoes were lost doing JP233 runs. That's good info. Oh and by the way...just for people who don't know, that JP233 on the G8 tornado is not a JP233 but a German MW-1 submunitions dispenser. I really hope they name it properly in an update. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  6. miles teg

    Marine fav in 1.75 is not working

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Eviscerator @ July 18 2002,23:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">well we are making a new one or at least editing one not sure whos it is originally and they want to make everything perfect, if you want a retextured version of frandsens swap the files from his aircraft with the ones from TJP's mh-60 dap and it should work pretty well<span id='postcolor'> Ok. I know the MH-60 with the MG being replaced with a minigun is going to take a bit of remodelling and config.cpp file experimenting, but I'll take your advice in swapping the textures...however I don't think the refueling probe or the radar would be textured would it? But I'll De-PBO it and give it a try. However I also need to figure out how to make the rotors compatible with 1.75. I hope I don't have to rename all the model groups or anything complex like that. Anyhow... I just hope that Ballistic helicopters are released as they are finished and not all in one huge pack or something. I guess I'm impatient because I'm trying to finish several missions before the summer is out that require them but for version 1.75. Unfortunately Frandsen's old MH-60 doesn't work well in 1.75. So I hope that work in Ballistic will concentrate on finishing up the easier helicopters. Best of luck on the projects. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  7. miles teg

    Marine fav in 1.75 is not working

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Eviscerator @ July 18 2002,20:25)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Miles i think TJP/Ballistic or whatever we are being called now are going to wait until its all finished and looking as near to perfect as can be, it may take a while but you can always be guaranteed their stuff is going to be good<span id='postcolor'> That kinda sucks. I mean I know textures take a while to do, but how hard is it to get a retextured unarmed version of Raven's blackhawk working in 1.75? Also why do all of the models have to be released at the same time? That's very frustrating for many of us looking for these addons having to wait months while some of the more difficult models are being worked on and other models are just sitting there on your hard drives waiting for all of the rest of the models to be finished. Unless they are going to be part of some big MOD with campaigns and stuff I don't see the purpose in doing that. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  8. miles teg

    Marine fav in 1.75 is not working

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vixer @ July 18 2002,18:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">No TJP now named Ballistic is fully active again check the site for news Ballistic<span id='postcolor'> They look very nice. Any idea when the MH-60 Pavehawks will be ready? Even an unarmed version would be nice at least until the armed versions are ready. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  9. miles teg

    Marine fav in 1.75 is not working

    Speaking of addons that don't work, you made that MH-60 with the refueling probe and radar right? Â I noticed that its rotor blades are messed up in Resistance. Â Any chance you could update that one or better yet make a MH-60MG version with a minigun replacing the M2 .50 cal (and putting the radar, FLIR, and refueling probe on it). Â A dark grey (actually almost black) texture would be very nice also. Â I remember the TJP crew was supposed to be making a realistic MH-60 (to update their older non-oxygen ones) but apparently they gave up on it or something. As for your FAV, perhaps try the older version with the MG-42 and see if that one works. Â It could be some issue with the MK-19 perhaps or the combination of weapons that it has on it perhaps. Â Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  10. miles teg

    Ofp needs biplanes!

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (peeps @ July 18 2002,14:44)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ww1 was extremely stand still, it ended up with basically 2 trenches and no mans land in between and since opf cannot do trenches it won't work all that well. (unless trenches can be done by the map creator somehow?<span id='postcolor'> As far as I know, trenches are still impossible with the OFP graphics engine...however.... our good GFX-707 has created a trench addon that works quite well actually. Well at least as long as guys don't lay down it, but that can be fixed with a [this setunit pos "up";] script in the unit's init box. I was working on a Vietnam "Tet Offensive" map using the Jungle Everon map. However I'm not sure if that addon works in Resistance. But yeah I think a WWI mod would be well worth doing. Now if only BIS could create some horse animations and of coarse horses. Oh...and also of coarse...BAYONETS!!! Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  11. miles teg

    Eviscerator & colorcharger's tornado

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (LoneSoldier @ July 18 2002,09:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Miles Teg where can i get those helicopters you just mentioned? Here are a few bugs in the tornado: 1. Cockpit lights 2. AI not using bomblets 3. Wheels can be tucked and you can still move the plane around on the runway 4. Canon sounds like a Clothes Dryer 5. Autopilot needs to work as i am not the best at landing a plane. And dont say "Who cares just learn to land it properly", because it IS a bug and it NEEDS to be adressed. If it can be fixed then why not fix it? No use having a half done plane. Good job on the plane, loved it. Also when i try to start the player in the plane it exits flashpoint and says im missing some sort of Pilot addon. where can i find this addon? Like i said, the plane kicks ass. Love it! Fuckin Love it!<span id='postcolor'> The Little Birds can be downloaded at: http://ofp.gamezone.cz/index.php?newlang=eng As for the Tornado, I have to mention that the cannon sound is VERY VERY realistic for a gattling gun like the one on the F16 aircraft. Few people outside of the military have had the pleasure (or displeasure) of hearing such an aircraft attacking ground targets with it's cannon. The A-10 has an even more annoying sound with it's massive 30mm gattling gun. I call it the "Elephant fart" sound. I've heard them many times at Ft. Hood, Texas and at Ft. Leanorwood, Missouri. However... someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think the Tornado uses a gattling type gun. If it does, then the sound is indeed accurate. If it doesn't then yeah another sound should be used... but good luck finding any good sounds of a Tornado's cannon anywhere (I think it's a Mauser auto cannon if I remember correctly). But overall I actually like the cannon sound quite a bit because it sounds like the cannons used on most fighter aircraft in real life. I wish BIS had used this sound on their A-10's and on their Vulcan Air defense tanks. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  12. miles teg

    Eviscerator & colorcharger's tornado

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Hellfish6 @ July 18 2002,04:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Not to rain on Keg's parade, but I think that Eviscerator and Col. Klink make pretty good mods too. They're definately the ruling triumvirate of the OFP modding community.<span id='postcolor'> Don't forget Adammo's Little Bird helicopters. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  13. miles teg

    Eviscerator & colorcharger's tornado

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Hellfish6 @ July 18 2002,04:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Has anyone else noticed that the Tornado flies really well? I have no problem flying it at all. When I fly any other plane, though, I almost always crash. Did you guys do something to the physics to make it more flyable?<span id='postcolor'> I agree. I don't like how they screwed Evi on his model by making him do that work for nothing, but I have to admit that their plane flies better then any other aircraft in the game I think. It's super maneuverable, responds well, and doesn't spin out of control easily like many other aircraft addons. Plus it's very fast but not too fast and the AI flys them quite low. Whatever they did, I hope Evi's RAF Tornado version emulates those flight characteristics....and puts in a proper JP.233 model as the one on the G8 addon is actually a MW-1 submunition dispenser. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD.
  14. </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Hovmand @ July 18 2002,01:25)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">There are no black hawk down mods.<span id='postcolor'> Mods no, but missions yes. If you click on the link on my signature it'll take you to my mission page where I have a Blackhawk Down mission that includes all the addons needed for the mission. However this is for 1.46. Also the outro has some factual errors that I need to fix which I was planning on doing for Version of that mission which will add the MH-60 Pavehawk and the Little Birds to it. However I only got Resistance recently and I haven't tried porting it to 1.75 yet. If the Desert Malden map doesn't work then I may have to redo it all over from scratch using the Nogovo map and the Western desert area of the Nogovo map. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  15. miles teg

    Mg pack from taiwan workshop

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (SPGRules @ July 17 2002,12:46)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I have read a lot about the muzzle flash bug, what exactly is this? Â I tried entering the code as mentioned above, but since I am new to all this, I must have done something wrong, because after I reloaded the file, I got lots of error messages. Â I will still keep trying, since that is the best way to learn. I also downloade the Mk 19 from the Taiwan site, but I get an error message when I try to add the weapon in the mission editor. Â Is there another file necessary? Â The readme file doesn't say anything? I appreciate the help.<span id='postcolor'> The MK19 doesn't work unless you have their Taiwan soldier units, and those don't work cuz they require some other obscure .pbo that I couldn't find so I gave up trying to use their MK19...which is a shame because it looked really nice. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  16. miles teg

    Eviscerator & colorcharger's tornado

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vixer @ July 17 2002,11:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">yeah its made from kegs cockpit model keg makes a plane all people start making planes LOL keg makes a gun all start making a gun hehe weird  <span id='postcolor'> In that case.... Keg please make a Harley Davidson motorcycle with saddlebags! Hehehe... No doubt he's the top addon maker for OFP right now. What I like about his addons is that they are never half-assed. Like his AGS-17....I was prepared to be very disappointed but absolutely delighted to see that he indeed made it not only look like the real thing (photo-realistic quality) but actually fire like the real thing. It was just brilliant! Same with his revolver's...even the cylinder rotates on the revolvers which is just amazing (it's noticeable especially when you are reloading). I'm sure he'll surprise us with more breath taking addons. At least with Keg, even if you they're not addons you wanted, you can count on the fact that his addons will be high quality addons and that they will be fun addons. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  17. miles teg

    New feature suggestions for addons...

    Well while Suma is reading this I thought I'd take the opportunity to make two big recommendations for addon features. 1. A Bayonet system. Â This may already be possible to create by addon makers as it could have a rifle use a different type of ammo with only a point blank kill radius that is set off when you select the bayonet and press the trigger...however I'm not sure how the ammo thing would work with it. Â I would be nice if BIS implemented some type of system for a bayonet. There have been occasions when I've run right into an enemy only to realize my clip was empty. Â Â Not a good feeling. A bayonet would be good for silent kills as well. Â Maybe this is already possible as I noticed that there is a punch animation that indeed causes damage. It would be nice to see more hand-to-hand combat systems put into the game. That could serve as a starting point for future war games by BIS that might require more hand-to-hand combat (Like an U.S. Civil War simulation for example). However without making any new animations I think the bayonet would be feasible...and there already is a "punching" and a "rifle-butt attack" animation that could be capitalized on and refined into something that could be easily used by the player. 2. Â Artillery system. Â One of the chief weapon systems that OFP lacks is long range indirect fire capability. Â Yes there are scripts and stuff that can be used, but there is no way to integrate those scripts so that they would cause a artillery unit to face in the direction of the target and elevate their weapon to the required elevation. Â What would be nice and simple (well maybe not so simple programming it) would be to have a special artillery site that gave a measurement in meters when you elevated the gun as well as your heading. Â That way a forward observer could give you the coordinates of a target (or mark it on your map) and the artilleryman could adjust his artillery piece to the correct elevation/distance. Â Even better however it would be nice to have a "Forward Observer" class that could give an artilleryman the exact distance between the target and the artillery unit. Â Then of coarse...there is the trick of getting the AI to use it properly. Â Â Now I realize that this would be more then just a simple addon and that it would require some very intensive programming, but it would be VERY much appreciated if some type of working artillery system (even a simple one) could be made. Â Currently with the unofficial mortar addon for example, the shots are just made by guessing and can only be made accurately with targets that can be seen. Â For a mortar that's not too bad, but with something longer range like a Howitzer or a M109 Paladid self-propelled artillery piece, it's next to impossible to do those realistically. Â An MLRS (rocket artillery) addon is another example of where a dedicated artillery system would help immensely. Â Anyways if it's something beyond the scope of OFP/Resistance then that's cool. Â But if it's doable or if the BIS programming team has already made something like that, it sure would be nice to see that. Â I think it would make the game a much more complete warfare simulation. Â Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  18. miles teg

    New su-25s

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HHwildcard @ July 17 2002,16:04)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Right now i am Working on a new SU-25 Which Has Bomblets AA and AG Weapon and stuff<span id='postcolor'> Someone already made those but if you want to reinvent the wheel be my guest. Also I don't think many people will download a Su-25 with a U.S. weapons load unless they care nothing about realism. But if it's just something fun you want to do, go for it. No harm done. Just don't expect people to rave about it. If you're really good with config.cpp scripting your time would probably be better spent helping out someone with Oxygen who is not so good at cpp scripting. But if this is a training exercise to get familar with cpp scripting that yeah it's a good idea to try and make those to see how they work and stuff. That's my opinion anyways. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  19. miles teg

    The huey's

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote ([CCCP]Stalker @ July 16 2002,11:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">It's not Hueys. It's a piece of junk with a propeller. I think this models where made during 1 hour.<span id='postcolor'> Dude? Â Do you have any idea what you are talking about? Â If you are talking about Martin's Huey, it looks damn good, and moreover, he did it WITHOUT OXYGEN! Â I beg of you to try doing that. Â He used the blackhawk model and painstakingly modified it into a Huey without adding or subtracting any vertices. Â If you have ever tried doing a non-Oxygen mod you would realize how incredibly difficult it is to make a realistic looking addon in this way. Â It's extremely hard and takes weeks if not months of work. Â So before you go slamming someone's hard work, please try looking at what what went into that hard work before you judge it so quickly. Sure Evi's choppers will probably be better...but they'll also be done in Oxygen. Â But regardless Martin's Huey's stand as a landmark accomplishment. Â From my email correspondense with Martin he seems like a really nice guy who's always answered my emails to him concerning his Huey's. I hate seeing someone bad mouth him like that and call what I feel is an excellent addon, a "piece of junk with a propeller." His Huey's look very good in my opinion. Their only drawback are those inherent to addons not being made with Oxygen such as distant textures turning back into the blackhawk. But at most distances it looks extremely realistic, the passengers sit realistically inside (like with their feet dangling outside the door) and they're very well textured inside and outside. If only that man had Oxygen, who knows what he could do with it! Â I'm sure he'd do some really amazing stuff! Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  20. miles teg

    Mossberg 500

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (rambozo @ July 16 2002,18:57)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Yeah thats the problem we are having with the shotgun. We still have to figure out what we wanna do about the firing effect.<span id='postcolor'> How about the reloads for it? I hope you don't just get 8 rounds and that's it. If that's all that's possible then oh well, but if there is any way to carry more ammo, that would be very very nice to be able to carry plenty of shells. Otherwise I hope he's carrying a pistol as a backup weapon. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  21. miles teg

    Mg pack from taiwan workshop

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (dsawan @ July 16 2002,16:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hi. I noticed that the pack is not on the Taiwan Workshop site. I tried to download but file is not found on site. Perhaps there is something wrong and they took it down. Douglas<span id='postcolor'> I just checked the link posted at the beginning of this thread, and the U.S. MG pack is clear as day up at the top of the page. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  22. miles teg

    Smith & wesson revolvers addon v1.0

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (D.murphy man @ July 16 2002,13:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">yyyeeee hhhaaaa!!! partna now all we need is some cow boys and indians and mayby some buffalo and a wild west map yyee haa ride it cow boy!!!<span id='postcolor'> Uh I don't think they used .357 magnums in the wild west. LOL! But some old western style Colt revolvers would be pretty nice. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  23. miles teg

    Mg pack from taiwan workshop

    Aren't those their old M249's and T74's just renamed? The old ones were non-Oxygen made but looked identical. However they suffered from LOD problems where they would revert to PK's (especially the T-74 otherwise known as the M240 or FNMag) Are these new ones made in Oxygen or just the old ones rehashed? Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  24. miles teg

    About east weapons...do you know that ?

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote ([CCCP]Stalker @ July 16 2002,12:59)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What link ? AK107 is downloadeble but Vintorez (silenced rifle) no. We're still creatin it (i'm also taking in the Kavkaz Crisis mod )<span id='postcolor'> Are these weapons "OFP: Resistance" compatible or do they have the muzzle flash bug in Resistance? If so I hope that you will make versions for OFP:Resistance. Also the scope looks a bit small and long, not like the usual 2x-4x sites that I see mounted on Ak-74's or AK-47's. Still it doesn't look too bad. Good work! Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
  25. miles teg

    Eviscerator & colorcharger's tornado

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (dkraver @ July 16 2002,09:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Is the real life MW-1 submunition dispenser capable of only firing one bomblet at the time?? i thought that they shot all of them at once or maybe over 3 to 4 shots, but not they only triggered 1 at a time.<span id='postcolor'> No the addon fires multiple bomblets. But you have to hold the mousebutton or trigger down. In other words in the addon it fires off the bomblets like a machine gun. Not as realistic as the real life dispenser, but it's a lot funner to fire it that way you don't use it all up in one pass and you can attack several times if you miss the target the first time or if your submunitions didn't destroy everything. Chris G. aka-Miles Teg<GD>
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