jollyreaper

I'm new to Flashpoint. Saw it when it first game out, thought "nice slideshow." Got a real computer recently, now the graphics run silky smooth and the only response I'm capable of making is "drool." Despite all the little niggling problems that have been mentioned here, the AI's, flight models, and so forth, when you get right down to it this is still a revolutionary game. We're talking a Wolfenstein or a Doom here, first of it's kind. The scenery is simply incredible. It does not take much effort to become lost in the game world. Lying prone on the top of a hill, looking down the other side with the binoculars, scanning the treeline for concealed enemy troops, the feeling is one of total immersion. This really got me thinking, "What kind of games are we going to see after this?" The first person shooter genre had gotten old even before Quake came out. Half-Life said "Hey, why don't we give you good graphics, gameplay, and a story?" Whoa. No One Lives Forever came along and said "You've played shooters, you've played shooters with stories, but you've never played one this in-depth!" Alice came along and said "You know? The engine is advanced enough, let's forget guns and corridors and demons and aliens, let's od something *weird.*" And it worked. So, what kind of games do you think OFP will inspire in the future, if not from BIS then from other companies? 1. Hunting Game. BIS, don't laugh at this, consider it a license to print money. Hunting games are insanely popular. Get something like this working on a console, put in all the details hunters are looking for (animal tracks, droppings, various weapons, etc) and you'll be able to sell the hell out of it. 2. Twilight 2000 sort of game. The original PC version had great concepts marred by inadequate technology. They wanted driving and infantry combat. That just wasn't going to happen with 1991 hardware. Flashpoint is everything they were dreaming about back then. So, what were the good parts of Twilight? It was set in Europe post-WWIII. You are the commander of a band of ex-NATO troops who are looking to put together a contry in what's left of Poland. An insane warlord is trying to do likewise, but he won't be very nice about it. You are basically exploring, gathering resources like vehicles, fuel, ammo, and making friends with the towns and villages around your main base. Each of your soliders has a detailed background and a comprehensive set of skills for use in-game. From the sounds of it Resistance is adding some of these concepts to the existing Flashpoint game. Would be interesting to see the concept taken further. 3. Combat sim, different era. One of the missions I played, a particular part of the island looked just like a place I'd actually been in South Carolina, Civil War battlefield. As I was scouting around with my binoculars I thought "You know, swap out my jeep for a horse, my M-16 for a cavalry carbine repeater, and make my uniform blue and this could be the civil war." Historic battle sims have almost always been boardgame conversions, moving units around on a map. Nobody has done a shooter in this era. Of course, the reload time of black powder rifles might end up annoying the hell out of people who feel the anti-tank weapons take too long as is. Still, the point is that the technology is to the point where something like this could be done and be done convincingly. 4. Even more comprehensive land combat sim (where I think BIS is probably going.) The vehicle controls are a little wonky, the AI's kind of annoying, but the point is, the OFP engine can make vehicles look *good*. The flying feeling in a helicopter is just wonderful. The way the landscape turns below, the smoke trails and explosions, it looks exactly like training footage I've seen of Apaches in Europe at the end of the Cold War. This is the direction most people are looking towards on this board, it seems. Fix everything that's wrong with OFP with particular attention paid to the AI's, add in new ideas and features that won't totally kill the framerate, tons more weapons and vehicles, bump up graphic quality, call it 2.0 and ship it. So, any thoughts?

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (HellToupee @ Oct. 03 2002,02:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Tex [uSMC] @ Oct. 03 2002,20:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Oct. 02 2002,11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Tex, did you perhaps notice the title of this topic and noticed perhaps the name of this board? I'll give you a hint: It does not include "1942" <!--emo&<span id='postcolor'> sorry, but you know I can't resist a good argument  <span id='postcolor'> JIPs a good one isnt it.<span id='postcolor'> SHUT UP ABOUT IT ALREADY!!!! Fer cripe's sake, all you have to do is just put a * when you post, we'll know what it stands for: another rant about wanting JIP. Bush doesn't talk about Saddam as much as you go on about JIP. Give it a rest!

OOMPA LOOMPA DOOMPADEE DOO BOY HAVE WE GOT A MORON FOR YOU OOMPA LOOMPA, DOOMPADAH DEE THIS MAN IS COBALT BLUE YOU CAN SEE WHAT DO YOU GET WHEN YOU QUAFF HOLLISTIC CURES FOOLISHLY THINKING YOUR HEALTH IT SECURES NOW YOUR DAMN SKIN IS ALL BLUE YOU NEVER THOUGHT WHAT IT'D IMBUE I DON'T LIKE THE LOOK OF IT OOMPA LOOMPA DOOMPADEE DIT YOU ARE ARE A MONON AND A STUPID SHIT NOW LIKE A SMURF YOUR FACE IS ALL BLUE FUCK YOU FROM THE THE OOMPA LOOMPA DOOMPADEE DO DOOMPADEE DOO

Just wait until they add in armor units that don't float but drive underwater to cross rivers.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (rdfox @ Oct. 03 2002,19:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Actually, the US Marines, for one, give all recruits a brief bit of training on the small arms of various potential enemies, for two reasons... first, to recognize their sounds, and secondly, just in case they need to pick up weapons from the enemy. Â Don't know if other forces do that, other than special forces...<span id='postcolor'> USMC's point of view is that every marine is a rifleman. The pilots get the same basic training as the infantry. This is actually a good thing since the Marines say the job of their pilots is to support ground troops, not galavant around in the wild blue yonder likea bunch of Air Force pansies. I think integrating tactical aviation with the ground forces is a good idea. The Air Force has always been more concerned with sexy missions rather than close air support. F-16's are sexy, A-10's aren't. The only reason why the Air Force ordered the A-10 was because the Army threatened to place the order themselves. The Air Force is jealous about it's role and the Army is actually refused permission to fly armed fixed-wing aircraft. The OV-10's in Vietnam were a major bone of contention with the Air Force and the Army was forced to remove armament from them. I don't recall if the removal was before or after the war ended. Short answer: inter-service rivalries suck.

Not everyone goes for utter realism. Even fans of realism may feel the need for a Doom-esque shoot-em-up as opposed to a serious game. Why not give the servers a "non-realistic" mode where players are simply running and gunning with respawn points, weapon pickups, etc? No wait, instant action, instant gratification. Those who want the hardcore version of OFP can leave their servers in default mode. The hardcore sim freaks are the audience BIS is designing the game for but they're a smaller part of the overall market. Keep everyone happy, make more sales. Make more sales, increase the chance of an OFP3.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (denoir @ Oct. 02 2002,14:39)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Balschoiw @ Oct. 02 2002,15:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">the problem with custom made Addons is , that they are not spread that much.<span id='postcolor'> Yes, I understand what you are saying however I personally think that BIS should spend their time and money to make things that only they can do (i.e extend the script language, improve the engine etc), and not the things that the community can produce. For the addons I think it would be very good if the community could agree on a standard set of addons to be used. This is in progress and hopefully it will produce results. </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">For the upcoming patch. Any news on V1.82 ?<span id='postcolor'> V1.85 <span id='postcolor'> Still, it wouldn't be all that much effort for BIS to cull the best of the best from the unofficial add-ons. I'm sure that the authors would be tickled pink to see their names in the official credits list of OFP. Throw those add-ons into the next patch, there ya go.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Tex [uSMC] @ Oct. 02 2002,20:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Design decision, I guess. Grunts have less ammo than they would in reality also- I mean, would you go into combat with just 4 30 round magazines? I know I wouldn't. I guess because engagements in OFP are small scale and usually fairly short, I dont think BIS thought there was ever a reason to add so much machine gun ammo to a tank.<span id='postcolor'> Also provides a bit of the realism factor of needing to conserve your ammo. In real life I don't think grunts would be able to pick up enemy weapons and use them with great proficiency like they can in OFP.

Arguing individual planes is pointless. In a wartime situation air forces do not fight in a vacuum, pilots do not engage each other in chivalrous single combat. When you are talking about a war you are talking about a military as a whole, the weapons just being the pointy tip of a spear with a very, very big shaft. Which was the better fighter, P-51 or ME-262? Doesn't matter, the US had more fighters and pilots and the luxury to train them up right before going into combat. Which is the better tank, Sherman or Tiger? In this case we know the Sherman was inferior to just about anything the Germans had. Doesn't matter, we had a lot more than the Germans and could grind them down in attrition warfare. The F-86 was the inferior of the MiG-15 and look who had the higher kill ratios. Even an inferior weapon can be used effectively with superior training and tactics. the Brewster Buffalo was a total joke in the Pacific and the US forces got rid of it as soon as they possibly could. Finland happily took the planes and put a major hurting on the Russians with them.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Kermit @ Oct. 01 2002,09:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hurrah for Looking Glass! Â Thief ties with Operation Flashpoint as the best game ever. Â Thief II wasn't quite as good as Thief Gold, but oh well. Â Do you own Thief, Jolly Reaper?<span id='postcolor'> Yup. Didn't like it as much as others did. They made what I felt were some bad design decisions that really hurt the potential of the game. As far as the concept went it was rock solid.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Audie Murphy @ Sep. 30 2002,00:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I know ever since I got resistance and a new computer and I see all that beautiful scenery with open plains and forrests, I think Civil War<span id='postcolor'> Only problem I can think of, when dealing with enemies at range I usally pop off 4 or 5 shots to take them down. I'd hate like hell to do that with a muzzleloading riffle.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (iNeo @ Sep. 30 2002,07:21)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Do they really have to sell so much? They can do their thing, realistic infantry sims, and sell good - maybe not great, but good. They would still do profit, right?<span id='postcolor'> The question is a matter of costs. BIS spent $x to make OFP. They got $x from somebody, whether it was an advance from Codemasters or some other form of funding. Flashpoint sells #y copies at $z each. I have no idea what Codemasters wholesaled the game for and I don't know if they get stuck with unsold goods like the book publishing industry. Let's assume average retail was $40 and that's a 100% markup for the retailer. $z=$20. $20 x 1 million is $20,000,000. So Codemaster's net was $20 million. From that Codemasters needs to subtract percentage for BIS, cost of publishing, etc etc etc. If Codemasters gave BIS an advance then that would be recouped from the royalty going to BIS. If it was a $200,000 advance then the first $200k BIS makes goes straight back to Codemasters. I don't remember what the percentages are for the game industry but let's guess 15%. That means $3,000,000 is coming to Codemasters. Let's say they had a million dollar advance, their budget for producing the game. That means they have $2 million to support themselves until their next contract. BIS lists 11 people in the company, rent or mortgage on their office space, utillities, equipment cost for computers, etc etc. Given that they're in Czechoslovakia the dollar may stretch a lot further. This is all just an intellectual exercise. The important questions are this: Is Bohemia making enough money to keep the doors open and are they truly happy making kickass hardcore realistic games? If the answers are yes and yes then there's no need for further discussion. For an example of how good companies have gotten royally fucked, everyone remember Looking Glass Studios? They made Thief, a few other really good games. Well, Microsoft was in a contract with them to make some games. Microsoft broke contract. Looking Glass found themselves in a cash crunch. They had games hitting the stores several months out but no immediate cashflow for bills, payroll, etc. End result, company folded. Let's just hope BIS avoids these pitfalls.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (placebo @ Sep. 28 2002,15:14)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Another story, not a friend of mine, something I read in a newsaper, guy in England meets an American woman on the net, they fall in love, exchange pics, he gets over there, not only is the pic of her like 20 years out of date, but her bosses corpse was sitting in her freezer <span id='postcolor'> Maybe he got there early and she didn't have time to finish cooking. You shouldn't be so judgemental.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (WKK Gimbal @ Aug. 08 2002,07:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">No.1 reason I NEVER e-date or do the cyberthingy, is that I'm TOTALLY PARANOID. I always imagine that whoever say they're a girl on the web, are really an old greasy man with twisted perverse thoughts. Girls do NOT use the web. Only for reading about fashion. They're ALL old disgusting geezers! Aaaaaargh! Â <span id='postcolor'> That's actually not the case but that's a pretty hard paranoid thought to shake. My least favorite paranoid thought came from a Stephen King story, one where a strange freakish pinky finger would poke up out of this guy's toilet. He had no idea where it came from only that it must be really really really long! He became unable to use a toilet through fear that the thing could poke up at any time. Try not thinking of that when you're on the bog!

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (placebo @ Sep. 28 2002,12:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (billytran @ Sep. 28 2002,16:37)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I think this one will be better. Â You've got Anthony Hopkins playing Hannibal this time, and he's really good. Â Plus Edward Norton's in it and he's a great actor too.<span id='postcolor'> Have you seen Manhunter? Brian Cox does a superb job as Lecter, William L. Petersen is also fantastic as Will Graham, I suppose what I especially liked about Manhunter is that I'm a big fan of Mike Mann's work, Manhunter works so well with the pastel lighting he's so fond of <span id='postcolor'> Did you see the same movie I did? Manhunter was horrible '80's cinema at it's worst. The book was much, much better. Never saw Hannibal the movie but the change in the ending from the book sounded really stupid. The book had a creepy cool ending. The hand-chopping thing was just stupid. First, Hannibal would never put himself into a situation that he was in so little control of. Second, he wouldn't have let himself be cuffed. Third, if he was cuffed, it'd be her hand he'd chop, not his own. Self-mutilation like that would be completely beyond his character. From the sounds of it the problem with the Hannibal character is that he is best when served in small portions. In Lambs he was powerfully creepy and disturbing. Put him on screen too much and you will end up with Hannibal the self-parody, like Bella Lugosi in his final movies, nothing like the scary count he once was.

Conspiracy theory time! I don't claim that this is what's going on but it sure would be a slick plan if it were the case. Bush wants pretext for attacking Iraq. US-backed groups posing as seemingly genuine arms merchants arrange for Saddam to get weapons-grade material. (Saddam thinks he's buying from ex-KGB or east germans or whatever, doesn't know they're fronts for the CIA.) With the US's covert help, Saddam develops a nuclear capability. Once the US is certain he has such a capability, the CIA discovers incontrovertable evidence of such a thing, thus having a perfect pretext for going to war. "We have to attack Saddam! He has nuclear weapons. Such a madman cannot be allowed to exist." The US specifically supplied Saddam biological and chemical agents in the '80's and helped him put together his own WMD programs. Of course, that was done with the understanding that such weapons were to be used against Iranians. Realistically, though, I don't think that Bush and crew could put together something so machiavellian. Likely the whole uranium thing is a plant, just like a black man driving a nice car in Orange County, California will be "discovered" carrying illegal drugs when stopped by police. Iraq has WMD's, here's uranium shipments as proof, c'mon let's have ourselves a war, etc. "After all, this is the guy who tried to kill my dad!*" *Actual bush quote.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (DarkLight @ Sep. 29 2002,12:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Go Spud! Â Â lol oh well, i want to see more gore, like in real life. Â Wounded men scream for help, screaming when someone gets killed, more realistic wounds, etc... Might sounds a bit quacky but i'd like to see it...<span id='postcolor'> Not quacky at all, would definately add to the psych shock factor. The most gut-churning part of Aliens vs. Predator was the wimpering of the civilians when your alien or predator was closing in for the kill, made it feel like you were actually killing someone rather than dismembering a game character. Quite shocking. The soldiers freaking out when they couldn't see what they were fighting was also a very nice touch. Medal of Honor also scripted in a few beautiful moments like this. In the Normandy mission where you hear your squadmates puking in the landing craft, one of them saying hail maries, etc. While there's a certain cheesy appeal with the "Oh no! ... Six ... is down!" it really does ruin the immersion factor a bit. Be a bit cooler if you could hear the LT struggling to stay calm. "Hudson just got waxed! Keep your heads down!" You can hear how the voices right now are just pieced together, like an automated phone attendant. There are ways to string words together like that where they don't come across quite so stilted. "Aaaagh! Medic! Medic! Oh Jesus God, medic!" "Zulu One, where's our damn air support?! The Reds have us pinned down here!" "Armstrong! Fall back, you're too close!" What would be really interesting is if the enemy could panic, even surrender. Capturing prisoners could yield intel bonuses that could unlock hidden goals in subsequent missions. Shooting surrendering troops would make the enemy fight harder in subsequent missions because they know that no quarter will be offered. Touches like this would not affect the game's overhead much but would greatly increase the depth. What made the original OFP great were all the little touches that showed nuanced attention to detail. I hope they keep that sort of thing for the sequel.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (DarkLight @ Sep. 29 2002,12:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Go Spud! Â Â lol oh well, i want to see more gore, like in real life. Â Wounded men scream for help, screaming when someone gets killed, more realistic wounds, etc... Might sounds a bit quacky but i'd like to see it...<span id='postcolor'> Not quacky at all, would definately add to the psych shock factor. The most gut-churning part of Aliens vs. Predator was the wimpering of the civilians when your alien or predator was closing in for the kill, made it feel like you were actually killing someone rather than dismembering a game character. Quite shocking. The soldiers freaking out when they couldn't see what they were fighting was also a very nice touch. Medal of Honor also scripted in a few beautiful moments like this. In the Normandy mission where you hear your squadmates puking in the landing craft, one of them saying hail maries, etc. While there's a certain cheesy appeal with the "Oh no! ... Six ... is down!" it really does ruin the immersion factor a bit. Be a bit cooler if you could hear the LT struggling to stay calm. "Hudson just got waxed! Keep your heads down!" You can hear how the voices right now are just pieced together, like an automated phone attendant. There are ways to string words together like that where they don't come across quite so stilted. "Aaaagh! Medic! Medic! Oh Jesus God, medic!" "Zulu One, where's our damn air support?! The Reds have us pinned down here!" "Armstrong! Fall back, you're too close!" What would be really interesting is if the enemy could panic, even surrender. Capturing prisoners could yield intel bonuses that could unlock hidden goals in subsequent missions. Shooting surrendering troops would make the enemy fight harder in subsequent missions because they know that no quarter will be offered. Touches like this would not affect the game's overhead much but would greatly increase the depth. What made the original OFP great were all the little touches that showed nuanced attention to detail. I hope they keep that sort of thing for the sequel.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Kermit @ Sep. 29 2002,21:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Assuming that someone would totally rewrite the way the game works, Operation Flashpoint's graphics would make an excellent flight combat simulation. Â Most flight combat simulations make the ground simple, so it looks like shit when you get close to it. Â And most dogfights end up near the ground, or at least mine do. Â Operation Flashpoint is the best looking flight simulation experience I have ever had. Â If only the physics matched, there would not be a better flight combat simulation, or better game at all.<span id='postcolor'> For choppers, definately. I think you could end up running out of room if you were using jets, due to speed and all. The original Commanche was so damn cool because of the canyons, racing through 'em, popping up to fire missiles, etc. The subsequent commanches had terrible flight controls and I simply couldn't make the choopers do squat. Dunno if my machine was too slow or what. What would be pretty damn cool is making a Zone-66 conversion of OFP. In case nobody recalls that game, it came out way back in the '90's and was 360 scroller fighter game. You flew over huge maps with tons of enemies, both on the ground and in the air. You had a finite weapon load and got to land at bases to reload. You had everything from guided missiles to cluser bombs to nukes. Nothing cooler than flying a figure eight over an enemy base with 20 cluster bombs spinning out from beneath your wings. Come to think of it, I could probably spank something like that together with the mission editor. Stock up some bases with choppers and tons of fuel/repair/ammo vehicles, then scatter the enemies about. Get shot down, crawl back to base and get in another bird. The flight models would still need improvement, though. The choppers can be a bit tricky, especially when trying to land, and don't even get me started about how impossible the jets are to fly at this point. I think stealing choppers is still probably my favorite part of the game. Just about every special forces mission ended with me stealing one of their choppers, blowing up the base, and taking it home. Playing the Revenge mission where you are leading a russian squad going after civilian terrorists, I was able to kill the pilots of that special forces blackhawk that came in so I said "what the hell" and stole it, too. Gotta be pretty galling for any pilot to be chopperjacked by a commie grunt.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Nyles @ Sep. 29 2002,18:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Trust me, the major part of this community is here because of the realism and not because of the arcade gameplay, which is a good thing. If the ~100 player hardcore fanbase you mentioned would indeed be that small, OFP would have never sold itself in these high numbers. My guess is that roughly 70% of the players were attracted because of the realism-oriented gameplay in the first place, and I would even guess that half of these would like to see even more realism added to the game. Realism isn't something bad. Many players claim<span id='postcolor'> I'd be quite interested to see some hard research on the actual numbers. I'm finishing up a business degree and I'd have to say that marketing is one of the most important and also most poorly implimented aspects of any company. I've been laid off from a couple of companies now and all of them were in trouble because they didn't know who there market was or what they even wanted. From the sounds of it BIS has discovered an excellent niche that desires exactly the kind of game they want to make. A million sales is pretty good in the video game industry. At this point the only thing that can hurt BIS is stupidity in their own management. Valve is a good warning for that sort of thing, all this dicking around with third parties making expansion packs, Team Fortress conversions and no word on when Half-Life 2 is coming out? BIS, please don't pull a Valve.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (placebo @ Sep. 29 2002,14:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Opf has sold well over a million copies, in these days and especially for a first ever game by Bis that's bloody good IMO, however more could and should be sold, mainly to blame for that are Codemasters, who in America had heard of this game other than by word of mouth or stumbling across a preview/review for it?<span id='postcolor'> Over a million copies? Excellent. I know 200,000 is considered to be a good showing. My only concern was that OFP would be one of the great many games that are great but did not do well thus the company dies and we are left with EA crap. Consider my concern much abated. As for OFP, it doesn't even get much shelf-space over here so perhaps Codemasters did drop the ball. I know I had to hunt to actually find a copy and it wasn't the Game of the Year edition with Red Hammer. I guess I'll just get dinged again whenever the threepack comes out with OFP, Red Hammer, and Resistance.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ran @ Sep. 29 2002,12:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ofp developper's main goal was to provide a realistic infantry sim including combined arms warfare elements i don't see why you want to change that , developpers don't make a game for all the entire gamer communauty , ofp is for serious teamplayers and not for anybody else (i'm caricaturing and simplificating , but that's a fact) , it shouldn't change this game was not meant to provide 1 more fast paced 1 person view sucky shoot'em all , and i'm sure bis doesn't want to change that , ofp already got its communauty and it's a pretty good communauty there's no need to make an "ofp lite" for the l337 type players , they got counter strike and battlefield 1942 already ofp is OUR game , the dedicated and serious player's game<span id='postcolor'> Only reason I brought it up, at the end of the day BIS needs to make money. If they created a game just for 100 or so "true hardcore players" then BIS would shortly be out of business. If the audience they made the game for is 100-strong, so be it. The audience that they sell it to has to be bigger or else they go out of business or start making games other than Flashpoint. I don't know how big the OFP budget was for BIS. Just remember that the only see a fraction of the purchase price off of every game. It's like the music industry, buy a CD, the artist only gets $0.25 of the $17.99 you spent. In other words, BIS has to move a ton of OFP in order to get the opportunity to make an OFP2. All I was saying is that it might be a good idea to give both sides what they want, I didn't say "eviscerate OFP2 so that it will be nothing more than Doom in the woods."

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Nyles @ Sep. 29 2002,11:55)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The problem is still that all major leagues feature these "doom'esque" missions only. It doesn't really matter if I manage to setup a server with realistic missions only, because I have to return to the other kind of gameplay sooner or later when the clan I'm in, has to fight another clan in the ESL for example. As long as a bunch of known level designers doesn't change their attitude towards more realistic maps, and these maps slowly are accepted even in the major leagues, the whole realism project is very likely to be damned. People are simply too used to the G36E...sad but true.<span id='postcolor'> Hmm. Why can't you form realistic clans and inform the others that the home field is realistic? "If you want to play us you have to give up the twinkfest." Will they just not play you?

I did it the dumb way a few times before I hit upon that hill solution. Load my guys in the truck, drive up the hill, set them around to draw the patrols, carried myself and three laws down to the right area for shooting down at them. Called in the tanks, drew away the enemy armor, called in the choppers, plugged the two AAA wagons and put the final rocket in the SCUD. The choppers were eventually shot down but not before killing some Russians. Crawled back up the mountain with bullets hitting to either side, end of mission. I do agree that the mission should have been balls to the wall. The problem, of course, is that not everyone has a ghz+ machine. The insane battle in the single player missions, that's gigantic but also a major processor hog. BIS would have been nuts to make the last mission in the game too massive for most people to play. I suppose if someone here wants to rectify that they can always crank up the editor and build a mission that would cripple a 1.5ghz machine. Realistically, this mission would have involved every tank and aircraft NATO had. They probably wouldn't have been able to bring in more than the current force they had but the aircraft could have flown the attack from whichever islands they were based on, the A-10's most assuredly. Hell, what about B-52's for carpet bombing? But something like that would have seriously murdered player computers.

alt+"minus key" type "ENDMISSION" Yeah, just played through that mission myself. Loaded up two soldiers in the jeep, went crashing over to the tank base, stole a tank, went tooling around the island blowing shit up, heading to the port at the tip of the island. Waited there for a half hour in accellerated game time, never showed, was told he escaped. My only guess is that he's not leaving from the obvious port. The island defenses are just strong enough that I really don't feel like exploring and trying to figure this one out on my own.