Please BIS << addon management >>

[Dwarden 1125]

guys please stop flooding original topics with your useless endless MOD vs other mod(s) flame wars ...

the next time i see this ... i will issue infractions to everyone involved ...

[ryguy 10]

I couldn't agree with the OP more. The current Add-on system is a pain to beginners and was a pain to me in the beginning. BIS, if implementing a system like this, would be the very first of it's kind. And to anyone who thinks ACE is easy to install, boy is that wrong!

[sickboy 13]

Thank you all for your amazing capabilities of ACE hate.

Last night, a 13 year old boy got killed because of ACE, his dad didn't allow him to use the Six Updater, and he jumped off an appartment building.

The other day, there were tsunami's in the Japan region, researchers say it is caused by the big amount of ACE usage in Japan.

There's war brewing in the Iran area, USA government officials state that they will not accept Iran running their own customized version of ACE, and threatens with Nuclear Missile Attacks if this herecy isn't stopped immediately!

You know who the biggest issues are? The people who point at everything else as the biggest issue; perhaps you can get off your lazy asses, and accomplish something yourselves.

Perhaps one day you could point out solutions, instead of problems; though heck, that would be too productive and positive wouldn't it?

Let's take it all out on the guys that put everything on everything to deliver solutions and products. You guys, are shameless.

Edited June 27, 2010 by Sickboy

[sbsmac 0]

The biggest problem is clearly people who are unable to stay OT :-P This quote from Mr Maruk earlier in the thread seems to bear repeating sinceit got a bit lost in the ACE stuff.

You are not right in your assumption that BI is ignorant or do not understand the problem.

Anyway, thank you for the analysis, it is very good from my perspective and surprisingly close to our own overview of this problem.

You are right we did (and will be doing more) some important steps to improve the situation in A2OA.

That is really encouraging news - thanks BIS :-) Now, if you'll only add I/O capabilities to OA I'll be a very happy man...

[noubernou 77]

OP is an example of what is good in this community, which is members contributing however they can. Pretty much everything else in this thread is an example of how pathetic a lot of the "community" members really are here. You take and take and take and do not give back anything, even kind words, which cost nothing.

It is really pathetic.

Thanks BIS for giving us an awesome platform for what we do, thanks Sickboy for all the stuff you have done. Lets make sure that the people that contribute like OP are the ones encouraged, not the useless trolls that just want to bring down everyone else.

[pipscouse 10]

@Sickboy. Mate I can understand your being upset given the huge amount of time and effort that must go into ACE. I don't for one moment want to slag off it, or any other mods or modders. The exact opposite is the case. I'd just like to see accessing this stuff made easier for computer dimwits such as myself. Sorry if that comes accross as moaning.

[terox 316]

You are not right in your assumption that BI is ignorant or do not understand the problem.

Anyway, thank you for the analysis, it is very good from my perspective and surprisingly close to our own overview of this problem.

You are right we did (and will be doing more) some important steps to improve the situation in A2OA.

My apologies to both Maruk and the rest of the B.I team. I am glad to say I was very wrong with my assumption.

To the idiots that brought ACE into the discussion, thanks very much for turning my thread into a fragfest and probably killing this thread. This is about general addon/mod management nothing specific. Please take anything else to the kindergarten where it belongs.

Now can we please get this back on track and continue on with this thread to give constructive feedback and offer ideas and solutions so that when the B.I team do develop this functionalioty further they have an even bigger understanding of what we would like

Edited June 27, 2010 by Terox

[walker 0]

Hi all

Nice to see that Marek agrees this is one of the key things slowing down ArmA adoption.

I agree with Terox on the interface just a simple one to three button interface is what is wanted.

[start Download] [Pause Download] [Cancel Download]

Central repositories external to game servers for all addons exist in the community. Heck you could run some adverts during the download phase to pay for it all.

Yes initial downloads will be big but subsequent downloads of addon patches and expansions would be minimal.

A notice to say the Download has started; if its large its going to takes a little time so go make a cup of cofee and [Read a random Wikipaedia page]

Also a button on the ArmA II main interface page that says [Get All The Addons] that links a random central repository and downloads everything.

It would be nice if the central repositories were poled on ping time to client and current out put load, with a favourite repository function off an [Advanced settings] button.

Kind Regards walker

PS Modies any chance of removing the "best addons" spam?

Thanks walker

Edited June 27, 2010 by walker

[zoog 18]

I already would be very happy for a detailed server information button where server admins can post url's to their required mods list and manuals for downloading their mods. We provide our mods via the Yoma Addonsync system and have a specific help page for players on how to download and install our required mods. It already would be nice to point people in the right direction directly in the server browser.

It's nice to hear BIS is looking into the issues, and of course an integrated mod download/synchronize tool would be very great. But for now 3rd party programs work good enough, as long as you can let the visitors know how/what and when.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Addon management will always be a difficult issue to solve. I'm sure BIS can help offer some solutions, but I still believe some effort must be made be the community who makes these addons, and the server admins who use them.

It's not that I doubt BI's capabilities, it's just that the sheer amount of mods & addons that I see servers running these days is ludacris, and surely we could attempt to cut back instead of waiting for BIS to solve all our problems.

Then again, this is coming from a guy who has given up with MP in ArmA... :(

[terox 316]

Addon management will always be a difficult issue to solve. I'm sure BIS can help offer some solutions, but I still believe some effort must be made be the community who makes these addons, and the server admins who use them.

It's not that I doubt BI's capabilities, it's just that the sheer amount of mods & addons that I see servers running these days is ludacris, and surely we could attempt to cut back instead of waiting for BIS to solve all our problems.

Then again, this is coming from a guy who has given up with MP in ArmA... :(

The problem that is being adressed here isnt whether addons should be used or not, that is down to the server admin and the individual community to decide.

The real issue is making it easier for those who dont know where to get the addons from, how to install them and how to load them.

To address your point that it is up to the server admins to put the effort in to make these available. You obviously dont understand the amount of effort that is being put into this issue.

For example take a look at the community manual in my signature file and the mp manual. Many Servers host Yoma addon sync repositories. Server admins have, are and will continue to put their best efforts in to making their addon content available. It is the client that is having difficulty finding this information, not that the information and support isnt out there.

To make this easier for the client requires intervention by BIS and an approach that assumes every client is not technically proficient. According to Maruk, B.I understand this

[celery 8]

You know who the biggest issues are? The people who point at everything else as the biggest issue; perhaps you can get off your lazy asses, and accomplish something yourselves.

Perhaps one day you could point out solutions, instead of problems; though heck, that would be too productive and positive wouldn't it?

Let's take it all out on the guys that put everything on everything to deliver solutions and products. You guys, are shameless.

Sorry to be frank, but you sound a wee bit too proud of your mod (and in the process, shameless to boot). Nothing is above criticism and it's useless to slag off community members for pointing out the solid fact that ACE is somewhat bloated made worse by the additional fact that the mod is not modular but rather a complete all-or-nothing package that discourages the community from using additional addons unless they conform or integrate to ACE.

[reconteam 19]

I have gotten adept at creating and trying to manage several mod folders, but indeed I see how this could cause problems for new players.

Perhaps BIS could occasionally point out very high quality mods and guide new people on how to install them?

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Sorry to be frank, but you sound a wee bit too proud of your mod (and in the process, shameless to boot). Nothing is above criticism and it's useless to slag off community members for pointing out the solid fact that ACE is somewhat bloated made worse by the additional fact that the mod is not modular but rather a complete all-or-nothing package that discourages the community from using additional addons unless they conform or integrate to ACE.

Celery hit the nail on the head there.

To address your point that it is up to the server admins to put the effort in to make these available. You obviously dont understand the amount of effort that is being put into this issue.

For example take a look at the community manual in my signature file and the mp manual. Many Servers host Yoma addon sync repositories. Server admins have, are and will continue to put their best efforts in to making their addon content available. It is the client that is having difficulty finding this information, not that the information and support isnt out there.

I understand this, but it's not a universal solution. Many people are still discouraged by having to download gigs of addons just to play on a server, regardless of how streamlined the process may be. Maybe I'm speaking for a minority, but there are people who don't like big enhancement mods like ACE or what have you.

How does this relate to the topic at hand? If BIS does wish to implement more addon management into ArmA2, I don't think it should necessarily just direct you to (or automatically) download a huge list of addons that the server is running, but something more modular where users can pick and choose things. Yes, it's not as easy as just downloading everything, but it can be made more painless if huge mods like ACE were split into smaller modules.

[Tankbuster 1746]

You know who the biggest issues are? The people who point at everything else as the biggest issue; perhaps you can get off your lazy asses, and accomplish something yourselves.

Perhaps one day you could point out solutions, instead of problems; though heck, that would be too productive and positive wouldn't it?

Let's take it all out on the guys that put everything on everything to deliver solutions and products. You guys, are shameless.

Whoa. You have REALLY missed the point. Every nown and then, I see a post that makes me point at the screen and say out loud "You've lost the plot". I never thought I'd say it about you though.

[Lonestar 11]

Perhaps BIS could occasionally point out very high quality mods and guide new people on how to install them?

That's what they did: http://www.arma2.com/community_en.html

Never heard of it again :(

They are willing, trying... But for now things remain the same.

Let's hope it will change in the near future, Maruk's post and OA Q&A make me think so :)

Edited June 27, 2010 by Lonestar

[terox 316]

I understand this, but it's not a universal solution. Many people are still discouraged by having to download gigs of addons just to play on a server, regardless of how streamlined the process may be. Maybe I'm speaking for a minority, but there are people who don't like big enhancement mods like ACE or what have you.

You wont be able to talk communities into loading less addons, many of these communities have been around for many years and have matured with the rich content that B.I gaming brings. They have there required player base, they pay for their own server and it is entirely up to them how they run it. You could always rent your own server and do with it as you like.

There is a lack of "Vanilla" servers, which doesnt help the situation, but you have to ask the reason why.

One possible solution would be for B.I.S to run official servers, for example one on each continent, or maybe 2 per continent, one for coop and one for pvp. This way newcomers, to the game will always find a server to play on. It would also help them to monitor the gaming side of their creation and test

[Yoma 0]

I'm pretty confident BIS will indeed solve the matter.

As for Sickboy's little explosion: completely justified if you ask me.

People simply don't realise the amount of work he's doing.

(let's not discuss Ace any further here please)

I wouldn't expect BIS to have a clearcut solution from day one though. Implementing it will probably take time, trial and a well tought out strategy.

However it's clear they are working on to implement a more userfriendly situation.

For me personally Addonsync has been a nice ride with ups and downs, support of some great people. A great learning experience.

Damn I'll need to find myself another little project to tinker with :p

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Thank you all for your amazing capabilities of ACE hate.

Last night, a 13 year old boy got killed because of ACE, his dad didn't allow him to use the Six Updater, and he jumped off an appartment building.

The other day, there were tsunami's in the Japan region, researchers say it is caused by the big amount of ACE usage in Japan.

There's war brewing in the Iran area, USA government officials state that they will not accept Iran running their own customized version of ACE, and threatens with Nuclear Missile Attacks if this herecy isn't stopped immediately!

You know who the biggest issues are? The people who point at everything else as the biggest issue; perhaps you can get off your lazy asses, and accomplish something yourselves.

Perhaps one day you could point out solutions, instead of problems; though heck, that would be too productive and positive wouldn't it?

Let's take it all out on the guys that put everything on everything to deliver solutions and products. You guys, are shameless.

Sickboy, I was LMAO half-way through the over-use of ACE in the Pacific part & then I was rolling on the floor laughing for the rest of the paragraph. :D

To all you playa-haters: No shit that he should be proud about ACE 2, those of you that haven't tried ACE and hate it - you're ignorant; those of you who have - you show obvious envy.

My first game in the series was Armed Assault & ACE 1 was the Holy Grail there, ever since you guys kept up a brilliant job at pushing the limits of imaginable. :icon_smile:

I'll end the /ot/ discussion here, since as we know even after the publications and thorough studies of "On the origins of species" the religious still refused to accept that they were descended from a monkey. :D

[Zipper5 74]

guys please stop flooding original topics with your useless endless MOD vs other mod(s) flame wars ...

the next time i see this ... i will issue infractions to everyone involved ...

Just thought I'd remind y'all. Seems it was overlooked.

Courtesy of an "ignorant, envious playa-hater". ;)

[Iroquois Pliskin 0]

Zipper, in fact ACE2 is not off-topic here. ACE is delivered through SixUpdater - let's discuss that, then.

All of the configuration profiles are stored locally I would imagine when you update/add mods in the browser GUI. Download speeds were at my ISP's max most of the time, so 3.4gb of mods downloaded in 5 to 7 minutes was perfectly acceptable.

Edited June 27, 2010 by Iroquois Pliskin

[gossamersolid 155]

I don't like sixUpdater. I've tried to use it a few times before (people wanted ACE2 on the server at one point) and I found it to be slow and it often lied to me which version it was at.

I do like Yoma's Addon Sync though :) That's one nicely designed program, hats off to Yoma. Yoma's Addon Sync reminds me a lot of OFPWatch (did he design that as well?)

[celery 8]

As for Sickboy's little explosion: completely justified if you ask me.

People simply don't realise the amount of work he's doing.

(let's not discuss Ace any further here please)

An addon maker's effort is realised but that doesn't make his work immune to criticism. It's not like it's a personal attack against the maker, and one should never be oversensitive about that.

To all you playa-haters: No shit that he should be proud about ACE 2, those of you that haven't tried ACE and hate it - you're ignorant; those of you who have - you show obvious envy.

My first game in the series was Armed Assault & ACE 1 was the Holy Grail there, ever since you guys kept up a brilliant job at pushing the limits of imaginable. :icon_smile:

I'll end the /ot/ discussion here, since as we know even after the publications and thorough studies of "On the origins of species" the religious still refused to accept that they were descended from a monkey. :D

You clearly fail to realize that some people just don't like the features that ACE brings, or the way they are brought. I play in a pvp tournament that uses a custom version of ACE and it's chock full of annoyances such as setting up configs in order to use earplugs and your guy falling over after a 1 km jog because he was packing a 9 kg(!!!) satchel - compare it to real soldiers who have 15 km speed marches carrying 35-40 kg of stuff. I just don't see the point in adding dozens of features mimicking realism when they're not realistic to begin with. The tournament is a prime example of having ACE for ACE's sake, since it only serves to make gameplay cumbersome.

[W0lle 1050]

Zipper, in fact ACE2 is not off-topic here. ACE is delivered through SixUpdater - let's discuss that, then.

It is off-topic.

My eyes might be not the best anymore but to me the thread title says "Please BIS << addon management >>

And neither ACE2 nor the Six-Updater have anything to do with BIS at all.

[CarlGustaffa 4]

I think ACE needs to be mentioned here as a prime example of what you would not let be handled by an auto update system, and that users should be allowed to state the sizes to be auto handled. Nobody wants to download that amount of data in order to join a server. I'll just mention that I am an ACE (core) fan, and gaiming without it makes Arma look like any other shooter out there. If ACE has split community in two, that means 50% likes what it does (including the "negatives"). That's all I have to add about the ACE issue, at least in this thread.