Update FaceTrackNoIR

[EricM 0]

PS Eye is definitely compatible, and it's a very good cam, with more emphasis on fps than other webcams which tend to sacrifice framerate for image quality. There are free PC drivers from codelaboratory.

[v4friend 10]

@V4Friend

What's the best camera for this program?

What are the most important values to change to control the speed of look?

Hi Sailindawg,

I will be very frank with you: I don't have a clue :( All I have is an old Trust Camera, that can also be used a webcam. It's really quite crappy and after 10 minutes or so, it goes to energy-saving mode...

When I test things, I can only do that for a limited period. That's where you folks come in

About the values: All settings work roughly the same: the lower the value, the quicker the reaction (except sensitivity, that only for amplifying movement). You can set smoothing down to about 5 or 10 and then play with the filter-settings.

[EmBeES 10]

Do you think it would be possible in the next update to allow us to change the buttons to toggle tracking and recenter? In ARMA it is almost impossible to play without hitting backspace every 2 minutes.

[liquidpinky 11]

Hi Sailindawg,

I will be very frank with you: I don't have a clue :( All I have is an old Trust Camera, that can also be used a webcam. It's really quite crappy and after 10 minutes or so, it goes to energy-saving mode...

When I test things, I can only do that for a limited period. That's where you folks come in

About the values: All settings work roughly the same: the lower the value, the quicker the reaction (except sensitivity, that only for amplifying movement). You can set smoothing down to about 5 or 10 and then play with the filter-settings.

Higher FPS cameras are better, it reduces input lag and stuttering.

Higher resolution means more accuracy with the movements and positioning.

So better to have both as high as possible.

[sailindawg 0]

@V4Friend

LOLZ.....thanks!! I appreciate both your honesty and appreciate what you've put together.

@Liquidpinky

thanks. I've got the camera set on a higher resolution and have been playing with gain & exposure settings within the HeadTracking API demo program to adjust the camera. I removed the official Logitech drivers and I'm just using the default Win 7 drivers. I find that I cannot adjust gain & exposure with the Logictech driver and have it hold settings as I use the FaceTracking program.

[Rough Knight 9]

Thanks for this v4Friend, I can't believe I missed this somehow. I have some tweaking to do, but got it working pretty awesome...it generally works very well for me with my Logitech quickcam pro 5000 camera.

I couldnt justify to my wife the TrackIR purchase, so this is awesome news for me.

Plus she said she will call me a nerd if she ever caught me wearing trackIR headgear : |

Thanks

Frosty

Edited July 28, 2010 by Rough Knight

[Vixente 10]

Ok, i've just got the camera this morning, a Logitech Webcam C600 (1280x720@30fps), installed it and the FreeTrackNoIR software with FaceTrackingAPI, played a bit with the demo and it looked good. Oh by the way, within the HeadTrackinDemo i was able to access Logitech camera controls, and i oriented and zoomed it to my face, improving the precission of FTNIR later. :)

I played a bit with the settings, it was running pretty good when i recorded this video: http://www.megavideo.com/?v=2WE9JQ58

Just at the end of the video FTNIR crashed (i noticed because OA went to "normal" mode). A while after that it crashed again with some runtime library or something. Anyway it runs good and smooth, a little shaky sometimes and bouncy when turning the head, but i think i'm a bit responsible of that, because this is my first time playing with head tracking software/hardware. I'm not used to it, so i need time to be accustomed to use my head well.

All in all it runs very well (W7 64 bits here), the only thing that i miss too (as some people asked for in this thread) was a reset button, to set it to 0 so the program takes the new coordinates. Because sometimes it goes crazy and deviates to the right or left, then i have to mess with FTNIR or reset the engine to fix it.

Edited July 28, 2010 by Vixente

[EmBeES 10]

Ok, i've just got the camera this morning, a Logitech Webcam C600 (1280x720@30fps), installed it and the FreeTrackNoIR software with FaceTrackingAPI, played a bit with the demo and it looked good. Oh by the way, within the HeadTrackinDemo i was able to access Logitech camera controls, and i oriented and zoomed it to my face, improving the precission of FTNIR later. :)

I played a bit with the settings, it was running pretty good when i recorded this video: http://www.megavideo.com/?v=2WE9JQ58

Just at the end of the video FTNIR crashed (i noticed because OA went to "normal" mode). A while after that it crashed again with some runtime library or something. Anyway it runs good and smooth, a little shaky sometimes and bouncy when turning the head, but i think i'm a bit responsible of that, because this is my first time playing with head tracking software/hardware. I'm not used to it, so i need time to be accustomed to use my head well.

All in all it runs very well (W7 64 bits here), the only thing that i miss too (as some people asked for in this thread) was a reset button, to set it to 0 so the program takes the new coordinates. Because sometimes it goes crazy and deviates to the right or left, then i have to mess with FTNIR or reset the engine to fix it.

If you have the update installed it will make the = key reset it, but it will also make Backspace turn tracking on and off.

[Vixente 10]

Spanish keyboard here, US key "=" is not the same for me. I press the key placed left to the backspace, mine is "¡" that's the equivalent for US "=". If the program checks the character maybe it's why is not working for me. I press it and nothing happens. I press the equivalent for "=" in my keyboard (shift + 0) and nothing.

Would it be possible to let the user set up this keys?

Thanks :)

[Rough Knight 9]

The performance is pretty bad for me. CPU takes a big hit and my cam samples at between 15 and 15 FPS?

Any ideas guys.

Smoothing samples is set at 10

Neutral zone at 5

most sensitivities at 70 as per default.

Not sure why it is so laggy ingame.

Thanks gain.

Frosty

[AlarmedBread 10]

Frosty - You need to get your cam taking 25fps or more, prefer 30fps. You wouldn't beable to play a game at 15fps very well either.

My camera Microsoft lifecam cinema would only run 10fps with the lifecam software, uninstall that and I can get up to 30fps! So it works smooth. Search the web for your camera framerates and see if people have soloutions already out there to get smooth frame rates on that camera.

This is working very well for me! Awesome software.

The main thing I miss from freetrack is the curves adjustments. Those really help to fine tune and get it just right.

For example, now I have my camera either on top my monitor (above head level) It gives good movement looking down, but not up. Or on the desk (below head level) gives good movement looking up, but not down. I have to move my head all the way down to get the tracking to move my in game head at all, then it just goes all the way down. No middle ground.

For 6DOF translation, such as zooming I prefer to have a much larger dead zone than for rotation movements, that way when I look right it does not have a zoom or lean added in aswell. The indivdual curves adjustments on each axis would make this software unbeatable at any price IMO.

Thank you so much!

[EmBeES 10]

The performance is pretty bad for me. CPU takes a big hit and my cam samples at between 15 and 15 FPS?

Any ideas guys.

Smoothing samples is set at 10

Neutral zone at 5

most sensitivities at 70 as per default.

Not sure why it is so laggy ingame.

Thanks gain.

Frosty

Something to remember is that the camera needs good lighting, in my case if I don't have a lamp turned on by my monitor i get ~10fps, but with it on i get 30fps. And the CPU really spikes up when it loses tracking of your face.

[Rough Knight 9]

Thanks for the replies guys,

I found a most somewhere earlier where Maverick wound down the exposure on his camera and got better framerates. I tried that and got better results (that was over RDP).

So I hope when I get back home I can do some tweaking and get good frames. I only just found freetrack and have been using that. This is a better option in my opinion though...no headset or hat FTW!!

EDIT:

Confirmed...woot I now get 30FPS. The camera "wobbles" a bit, but at least I get much better performance in game now : )

I am struggling to find the ballance between neutralzone and responsiveness to fix the wobbling camera. I found I got better results winding "Z" sensitivity right down to inhibit the zooming. Anyone get sort of a high frequency wobble or know how to resolve it?

Thanks again

Frosty

Edited August 2, 2010 by Rough Knight

[EmBeES 10]

Thanks for the replies guys,

I found a most somewhere earlier where Maverick wound down the exposure on his camera and got better framerates. I tried that and got better results (that was over RDP).

So I hope when I get back home I can do some tweaking and get good frames. I only just found freetrack and have been using that. This is a better option in my opinion though...no headset or hat FTW!!

EDIT:

Confirmed...woot I now get 30FPS. The camera "wobbles" a bit, but at least I get much better performance in game now : )

I am struggling to find the ballance between neutralzone and responsiveness to fix the wobbling camera. I found I got better results winding "Z" sensitivity right down to inhibit the zooming. Anyone get sort of a high frequency wobble or know how to resolve it?

Thanks again

Frosty

Hmm, a wobble is kind of odd. What kind of webcam and computer do you have? Like is it a laptop built in webcam or desktop mounted or etc. Also is the wobble just in the picture or in the movement in the game. What is your sensitivity in the program and what is your deadzone. I play with a deadzone of 7 and have the Z axis completely off.

[Rough Knight 9]

Hey V4Friend,

EDIT: I just noticed on SourceForge you have listed a bunch of nice features in progress.

Sorry to bother you devs...but any plans for the next release. Only thing that gets annoying about this after a while is the two interaction keys for FaceTrackNoir are keys generally bound to functions in ARMA2. Here are the problems listed (but probably not explained very well).

"=" - Accelerate [single player] if you forget to hit "-" after you have the game accelereated 2 X speed. (when in aircraft particularly this can be a subtle change). Its not so bad as if you are infantry the speed step is much more prolific.

"[backspace]" - brings up the context menu [or turns off facetracknoir] if you want to use it for comminication or the order system. You often need to hit it again to restart FaceTrackNoir after you relise it has stopped working.

Obviously the main functionality is there, and I have pretty good results after some tweaking, just havent heard if you guys are still working on the system or if in halt.

Thanks again for the great piece of work.

Thanks

Frosty

Edited August 6, 2010 by Rough Knight

[DaveP 66]

Tried it with a PS 3 Eyetoy camera and CL Drivers, fantastic performance (it's effectively a 60-120fps webcam), no jitter even on lowest smoothing samples when EWMA is enabled, and the cam only costs like £12

Although FTNIR crashes a crapload in this format

Edited August 7, 2010 by DaveP

[Nicolai 10]

two words:

Thank you

[Mark Starkiller 10]

I just bought logitech web cam for 29.9 euro and is working fantastic.

Thank you for this great software :)

[MavericK96 0]

I may have to pick up a PS3 Eyetoy, it sounds like. I still can't get this to be smooth with my VX-6000 webcam.

I have a PS3 anyway so it wouldn't be a totally absurd purchase. :cool:

[DaveP 66]

I thoroughly recommend it, your computer sounds strong enough to process it at the same time as running Arma

You need to get the CL Drivers:

http://codelaboratories.com/downloads/

Install and run the test program until you get it working (just takes some time and retakes if it doesn't work first off)

Then just run FTNOIR as usual and it should have PS Eye as the webcam choice

Edited August 9, 2010 by DaveP

[Rough Knight 9]

I killed my logitech quickcam pro 5000, so I went and bought a PS3 eye for AU$50.

Edit: Finally got my settings about right. Here they are if anyone is interested as a starting point. I get very good response and very little jitter:

Camera: PS3-Eye

smoothing:20

EWMA filtering: Enabled

Deadzone: 6

Yaw:130; Red.Factor:40

Pitch:80; Red.Factor:45

Roll:80; Red.Factor:50; Inverted

X:40; Red.Factor:70; Inverted

Y:40; Red.Factor:70

Z:10; Red.Factor:70

New settings I am using. Seems better response and playability.

My Current settings in faceTrackNoir:

Camera: PS3-Eye

smoothing:22

EWMA filtering: Enabled

Neutral Zone: 7

Yaw:90; Red.Factor:40

Pitch:90; Red.Factor:50

Roll:60; Red.Factor:50; Inverted

X:40; Red.Factor:70; Inverted

Y:40; Red.Factor:70

Z:10; Red.Factor:70

I seem to capture only around 30FPS still, but the performance ingame is much better than my logitech camera. The face definitions of FaceAPI seem very smooth.I also used the CodeLaboritories drivers as mentioned above.

Another good thing with this camera is, there are limited adjustment options which make adjustment easy...Also I used the camera in a pretty much "dark" room and the camera could still map my face via FaceAPI very well. Ie the infra-red filtering must be reasonably weak meaning you dont need heaps of light for faceapi to be able to work properly.

The only downsides to the PS3-Eye IMO are [and there may be ways around them]:

1). No ability to zoom [other than the two preset lens positions]...This is no problem for FacetrackNoir however.

2). You can't really mount it ontop of the monitor? In the end I sat it underneath my monitor and "chocked" it up a bit FTW. This seemed to work a bit better than when I sat it on top of the monitor anyway: )

Thanks

Frosty

Edited August 30, 2010 by Rough Knight
Update post with settings.

[EmBeES 10]

Seeing some of the reviews I went ahead and ordered an eyetoy from amazon. I have the xbox live vision camera right now, and it works pretty good, but i only get about 10fps if there is not good lighting so hopefully it will help a bit.

[DaveP 66]

I killed my logitech quickcam pro 5000, so I went and bought a PS3 eye for AU$50.

Edit: Finaly got my settings about right. Here they are if anyone is interested as a starting point. I get very good response and very little jitter:

Camera: PS3-Eye

smoothing:20

EWMA filtering: Enabled

Deadzone: 6

Yaw:130; Red.Factor:40

Pitch:80; Red.Factor:45

Roll:80; Red.Factor:50; Inverted

X:40; Red.Factor:70; Inverted

Y:40; Red.Factor:70

Z:10; Red.Factor:70

I seem to capture only around 30FPS still, but the performance ingame is much better than my logitech camera. The face definitions of FaceAPI seem very smooth.I also used the CodeLaboritories drivers as mentioned above.

Another good thing with this camera is, there are limited adjustment options which make adjustment easy...Also I used the camera in a pretty much "dark" room and the camera could still map my face via FaceAPI very well. Ie the infra-red filtering must be reasonably weak meaning you dont need heaps of light for faceapi to be able to work properly.

The only downsides to the PS3-Eye IMO are [and there may be ways around them]:

1). No ability to zoom [other than the two preset lens positions]...This is no problem for FacetrackNoir however.

2). You can't really mount it ontop of the monitor? In the end I sat it underneath my monitor and "chocked" it up a bit FTW. This seemed to work a bit better anyway.

Thanks

Frosty

Nice review! A point about the IR Filtering is also, as this camera is quite often used by Freetrack hackers, there's lots of guides around about how to remove its IR filtering so that you can get even better performance in lower light (Of course they then throw a piece of film neg. over it so it Only lets in IR, but no need to go that far eh)

[EmBeES 10]

When the ps3 camera is used, what frame rate does it run at in good light? And also is it possible to choose what resolution and frame rate the camera will run at? I guess I will see tonight because my prime shipped camera ended up getting in my city early :)

Edit: Ok, my camera came in and I love it, get 30fps no matter what the light is (is faster than 30fps possible?) and keeps great tracking all the time, and I also the the FOV, i didn't even have to put something under it to tilt it like i thought i would have to.

Edited August 11, 2010 by EmBeES

[Rough Knight 9]

Hey EmBeEs,

Yeah..the camera is quite amazing for an out of the box device. It works well in most conditions. Did you use the wide-angle lens setting (large FOV) out of interest or the smaller FOV? I am still spacing up my camera a bit to centralize my face on the preview using the smaller FOV? I havent really tried the wide FOV setting.

I havent been able to get it to run at more than 30Hz in FaceTRackNoir, but I havent played too much. In the CL-Eye test software you can set the resolution and frequency. Not sure however how this translates into FaceTrackNoir as it seems to always default to 640x480 @75Hz.

The application seems to run pretty CPU intensive and I wonder if that is due to the resolution the camera runs at by default. You could try the following:

a). Open CL-Eye test

b). Set a lower resolution ie 320 x 240@60Hz and then turn off the preview in "options" but leave the CL-Eye test window open.

c). Start FaceTrackNoir and begin tracking. I wonder if FaceTrackNoir would then use the lower resolution and therefore reduce CPU loading?

******************************************************************************************************

EDIT: I tried this over RDP and seemed to be able to change settings as above. At 60Hz because it could not find my face over RDP : P....the memory usage went up to 1500mB : |....I will test this more when I get home. From what I have seen, you will probably get better performance due to running lower res if FaceAPI can work properly rather than increased frequency?...to be tested!

******************************************************************************************************

I will experiment tonight when I get home from work : P

Thanks

Frosty

Edited August 12, 2010 by Rough Knight
Resolution testing