Upcoming big game needs tester/stressers

[SirRarius 0]

Thanks for all the suggestions guys... It is really nice to have so much support and constructive critisism and no complaints.

Tanky and I have boiled the suggestions down to the following:

Redesigned squads

Five main squads each of the following

1. Squad leader. Can carry any rifle and any tube but not satchel etc.. Can call artillery and drops
   
2. Medic. Can carry assault rifle or SMG etc, but no tube or scoped weapon. Can medic (obviously!)
   
3. Engineer. Can carry assault rifle or SMG etc and satchel charges/mines, but no tube or scoped weapon. Can repair (obviously!)
   
4. Rifleman. Can carry any rifle (inc sniper), any tube, but not satchel etc.
   
5. Rifleman. Can carry any rifle (inc sniper), any tube, but not satchel etc.
   
6. Rifleman. Can carry any rifle (inc sniper), any tube, but not satchel etc.
   

Five squads, each containing one man.

1. Rescue operator/pilot. Can carry SMG, but not assault rifle or scoped weapon, nor a tube or satchels etc. Can rescue (obviously!) and can pilot any aircraft.
   

Main Mission Radius

Currently all main missions are roughly the same size (ie number of enemy). This means a piddly little village like Petrovka gets the same defenses as a huge town like Chernogorsk. We plan to make small vilages smaller with less defenders and large towns larger with more.

Wreck chopper

We are thinking about removing the wreck chopper. It was only used a little last night and we seemed to be earning vehicles faster than we could crash them. Having no wreck chopper might make pilots a little more careful too.

Repair only with repair vehicle

We are thinking about making it so engineers can only repair vehicles whn there is a repair truck nearby. This would force damaged vehicles to pull out of "hot" environments to be repaired and/or wait for the firefight to abate.

Replacing choppers

We are looking at the SFC choppers as replacement for MH53 and MH60s

We would be grateful for your views and comments on these ideas.

Rarius

[Sekra 10]

Wreck chopper

We are thinking about removing the wreck chopper. It was only used a little last night and we seemed to be earning vehicles faster than we could crash them. Having no wreck chopper might make pilots a little more careful too.

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Replacing choppers

We are looking at the SFC choppers as replacement for MH53 and MH60s

We would be grateful for your views and comments on these ideas.

Rarius

Well I do agree that in many dominations that I've played, there is enough gameplay for "cleaning up others mess" for a whole dedicated support section which whole purpose is to haul wrecks back to base and get them back online plus move a few MHQ back and forth for repair / rearm. So basically the need for the wreck lifter is so-so and this brings me to another idea about the choppers. How about converting the MH-60s to what they really can lift, like hmmwvs and "light" stuff like that.. I dont think a Knighthawk or a Blackhawk could lift a LAV-25 for example. So have the MH-60s as troop transport / light lifters only, and change the wreck chopper as a heavy lifter, probably a CH-47 Chinook or smth really big, which in theory might be able to lift such stuff..

I took the MH-53 for a spin there and even though it looked like a fun thing to fly it really needs some tweaks since it was REALLY fast and hard to stop even hehe... I mean I was doing over 300kph before I noticed I was even moving on that thing.. And yet according to specs it should only be a tad faster than a MH-60..

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

Five squads, each containing one man.

1. Rescue operator/pilot. Can carry SMG, but not assault rifle or scoped weapon, nor a tube or satchels etc. Can rescue (obviously!) and can pilot any aircraft.
   

I would suggest that each pilot be allowed to carry 1 satchel. I've been a pilot in ArmA and ArmA 2 for about 4 years. There will be plenty of times where you get shot down, your bird is intact, yet the engine is down and you cannot get friendly forces in to repair it. These cases call for blowing the aircraft in place so it is not left for enemy forces, and so it will respawn at base instead of sitting in some field, forest, or city somewhere.

[SirRarius 0]

How about converting the MH-60s to what they really can lift, like hmmwvs and "light" stuff like that.. I dont think a Knighthawk or a Blackhawk could lift a LAV-25 for example. So have the MH-60s as troop transport / light lifters only, and change the wreck chopper as a heavy lifter, probably a CH-47 Chinook or smth really big, which in theory might be able to lift such stuff..

MH-60 max lift is about 5.8t, LAV-25 weighs 12.8t, so you are right the MH-60 shouldn't be able to lift the LAV. Unfortunately the Chinook can only carry 12t, so it can't carry it either. The CH53-E can manage about 18t and is the heaviest lift Nato chopper I can find.

[Tankbuster 1733]

I would suggest that each pilot be allowed to carry 1 satchel. I've been a pilot in ArmA and ArmA 2 for about 4 years. There will be plenty of times where you get shot down, your bird is intact, yet the engine is down and you cannot get friendly forces in to repair it. These cases call for blowing the aircraft in place so it is not left for enemy forces, and so it will respawn at base instead of sitting in some field, forest, or city somewhere.

This is a good point. I wonder if we could load a satchel as weapons cargo into each heli so that the aircraft had it, rather than the pilot.

---------- Post added at 08:10 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:04 AM ----------

Reference MH60 lift capabilites. The '53 is indeed the most powerful heli we have available.

I've been talking for ages about getting rid of the wreck chopper and the wreck rebuild point and the other nights tests showed us clearly that we were winning new stuff faster than Max could crash it. :) We simply don't need them. If we do take away the wreck chopper, maybe we could have the 3 other lift choppers as '53s rather than '60s?

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

2 -53s and 2 -46s would be nice. :)

[Sekra 10]

My personal preference would be to still leave 1 chopper for a pure troop transport chopper so the need for doing the "1. were carrying the MHQ 2. oops one guy was left behind 3. we gotta drop the MHQ 4. we gotta pick that one guy up 5. pick up the MHQ again" -routine might be solved with the troops being moved with a troop transport chopper and the MHQ with a heavy lifter.. because compared to the heavy lifters the MH-60 is quite maneuverable and might be able to get into zones that are hot.. and more importantly get out also :D

[bushlurker 45]

An interesting discussion on choppers so far guys!

I personally agree with Sekra's point above - I've flown enough choppers in Domination to know exactly what he means - you end up being a "carryall" and trying to fulfill both roles you end up doing neither very well...

In my personal Dom version, I had a bigass Chinook as the principal Lifter - for wrecks and for the MHQ - it's also big enough to carry multiple teams for insertions too - if necessary... If you saw that flying around, it was always either picking up or dropping off someTHING.

A couple of AH-60's as general troop insertion platforms (to try and avoid the general use of "paradropping in" as the primary way of getting to the combat area, with the inevitable scattering of teams that that generally induces) If you saw them, they were always picking up or dropping off someONE... , plus the fourth chopper was a little unarmed MH-6 - for fast insertions (or evacs) of a single team into "hot" zones, dropping arty and sniper guys in good overwatch positions, rooftop rescues - all the "white knuckle" flying jobs basically - and unarmed, so nobody is tempted to attempt combat with it...

Essentially, the more insertions via vehicle as a coherent team the better - including paradropping - as a team - from a cunningly piloted AH-60...

A bit of a gross oversimplification, I agree, but generally - Big chopper for moving stuff, Medium choppers for moving people, and Little chopper principally either going to sidemissions, or dropping specific guys in specific places for specific jobs...

B

Edited April 21, 2010 by Bushlurker

[kMaN175 34]

MH-60 max lift is about 5.8t, LAV-25 weighs 12.8t, so you are right the MH-60 shouldn't be able to lift the LAV. Unfortunately the Chinook can only carry 12t, so it can't carry it either. The CH53-E can manage about 18t and is the heaviest lift Nato chopper I can find.

I am not sure of the technical data on choppers but I can speak from 11 years experience in the army.

UH-60 airframes could/woould not life anything other than net sling loads, ISU containers. Maybe a small jeep or something but nothing as big as a HUMMV. I do know some UH-60 pilots that I could ask.

Chinook's could life stripped HUMMV's but there is no way they could lift Bradley's or the MHQ type of vehicle.

The 53's were "death traps" for us because 9 would show up to a training event and only 2 would "crank" or work. They were a massive helo and the fastest but not known for their lifting capability. They had a bad reputation.

MH-6's could barely lift 2 pilots and 2 shooters with kit on in the summer. Winter they could lift all 4 shooters with kit.

Puma, I am not sure of it's lifting capability although I don't think it has alot. I didn't like sitting in the door of that helo because it about blew you out if your legs were hanging out.

Lynx, again couldn't lift very much in fact they couldn't even fly in Iraq in the summer because they couldn't lift anyone but the pilots.

The Mi-8's had a lift capability similar to the Chinook, I think it could lift a bit more. I know we used it a few times to move some liquor around the Iraq theartre. :O

I did have fun the other day with the MP Domination, it's amazing what a little bit of organization and a few people all jumping on the same server can do for the fun meter.

Thanks again!

Edited April 21, 2010 by kMaN_(KYA)

[Tankbuster 1733]

I think we have to accept that some artistic license is in use here. I didn't know the 53 was so unreliable in theatre, but mechanical reliability is not something we can model here, I wouldn't want to even if we could. So... we take the biggest and most powerful we have available and for now, that's the '53.

We also have to accept that without MAJOR changes to the code, we can only have 3 helos (if you don't count the wrecker, which I want to get rid of). All 3 helos will at one time or another be lifting AT THE VERY LEAST, an MHQ.

The 53 can carry most troops in game too. If we want to move 20 blokes, we can't do that with a '60.

So... this is my current thinking. All 3 lift choppers are '53. Wreck chopper is gone.

---------- Post added at 03:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:44 PM ----------

An interesting discussion on choppers so far guys!

I personally agree with Sekra's point above - I've flown enough choppers in Domination to know exactly what he means - you end up being a "carryall" and trying to fulfill both roles you end up doing neither very well...

B

Carryall is the nature of the beast here, I think. Certainly in the Brit forces, most kit we have ends up performing a multitude of duties.

---------- Post added at 03:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:45 PM ----------

Big chopper for moving stuff, Medium choppers for moving people, and Little chopper principally either going to sidemissions, or dropping specific guys in specific places for specific jobs...

I really can see your point, but I think I want to retain as much multirole ability for the limited airframes we have and that means having as many as possible of the most capable and IMO, that means 3 x 'H53

[bushlurker 45]

If we want to move 20 blokes

A fundamental point I keep forgetting :)... my Dom version was heavily tailored towards about 6-8 players max, double figures actual players was unheard of... different priorities apply here, of course...

B

[Tankbuster 1733]

A fundamental point I keep forgetting :)... my Dom version was heavily tailored towards about 6-8 players max, double figures actual players was unheard of... different priorities apply here, of course...

B

I'm in the same boat. Until that Monday, the most I'd EVER played Dom with is 7. It's a steep learning curve, but you blokes have thrown me a line.

*note to self. Don't mix metaphors.

[Darkhorse 1-6 16]

Don't delete the wreck bird. Change it to say a CH-46 if you use them. Then what you have to do is edit the script that refers to the helicopters, and change it from a wreck lift to: A. Lift Chopper B. Normal Chopper, that can't lift anything.

I can help ya find this if needed.

[Tankbuster 1733]

Done. Chopper 4 converted to lift chopper. Will upload a slightly newer version soon, thanks for the help, Darky. :)

Edited April 21, 2010 by Tankbuster

[kdjac 19]

This is a good point. I wonder if we could load a satchel as weapons cargo into each heli so that the aircraft had it, rather than the pilot.

I know that one :D

I use in a vehicles init

Exec vm "weaponcrate.sqf";

with a weaponcrate sqf loaded with every ACE weapon and defaults, so our jeeps and helis spawn as mobile ammo boxes. Sure it can be tailored to your needs :)

[Tankbuster 1733]

That will only work for the vehicles first spawn. If it's destroyed and recreated by the game, the init won't be processed, but I think I know how to make it work. I'll be honest though, it's not a high priority right now. I'm remaking the brand new squads that I mentioned earlier.

[SirRarius 0]

with a weaponcrate sqf loaded with every ACE weapon and defaults, so our jeeps and helis spawn as mobile ammo boxes. Sure it can be tailored to your needs :)

Wash your mouth out young man! "ACE weapons" indeed! :mad:

[kdjac 19]

Wash your mouth out young man! "ACE weapons" indeed! :mad:

once you go ACE theres no turning back :D

yeah the init part is as far i know, anything beyond goes into things i dont know like how to give a vehicle a weaponcrate and respawn script thingie at init. I just put 2 of the same vehicle one with weapons and other with repawn:o

[Tankbuster 1733]

We will go ACE, just not yet. When it's ready...... :D

[PogMoThoin 10]

Can only imagine that Ace would bring a whole new set of issues, why not add it sooner rather than later and get them ironed out.

You're going to add it anyway, I know You are :D

Edited April 21, 2010 by PogMoThoin

[Tankbuster 1733]

I will, but when the issues are ironed out. ACE2 is so complex, I'd rather add it when someone else has done the ironing. :)

[Sekra 10]

not sure about vehicles but to players at least you can have a "killed" eventhandler after which you could with a one line script add a satchel to the cargo of the chopper... and even if that eventhandler is not available for vehicles it shouldnt be too hard to make a script that spawns a satchel to the cargo each time its respawned..

[Tankbuster 1733]

Oh yeah, there's a number of ways to do it. I might add an addaction to all the pilots that they can access from the middle mouse menu. "Scuttle Aircraft" This would find the nearest helo to the pilot, then setdamage = 1 to it. This would (hopefully) have the sideeffect that the pilot wouldn't get a -1 aircraft kills on his scoresheet.

[maddogx 13]

Oh yeah, there's a number of ways to do it. I might add an addaction to all the pilots that they can access from the middle mouse menu. "Scuttle Aircraft" This would find the nearest helo to the pilot, then setdamage = 1 to it. This would (hopefully) have the sideeffect that the pilot wouldn't get a -1 aircraft kills on his scoresheet.

Or you could add the self-destruct commend to the helicopter itself, in such a way that only the pilot can activate it. Check out the addAction command description. :)

Basically you could have it call a script that runs a countdown and then simply does "setDamage 1" on the chopper.

[PogMoThoin 10]

Or you could add the self-destruct commend to the helicopter itself, in such a way that only the pilot can activate it. Check out the addAction command description. :)

Basically you could have it call a script that runs a countdown and then simply does "setDamage 1" on the chopper.

Needs the Mission Impossible tune