You can't Play this game Multiplayer.

[hund 0]

Don't use simple math to solve the problem Aeneas, it makes too much sense that way!

[Defunkt 431]

To summarize. If the vast majority of people didn't want mods on their servers we would have lots of servers without mods. We don't....again i'm not trying to take sides I just wanted to point out my opinion on your arguement.

I disagree, it takes time and money to run a server, those sufficiently interested in doing so will be die-hard fans of the game and are much more likely to want to play the game modded. So you have a situation where (for illustrative purposes let's just use your %'s) 95% of players want an un-modded game but only 5% of server-ops want to host an un-modded game.

[whisper 0]

@Aeneas2020 : probably some misunderstanding in my message :) I put it very badly.

I'm not against modding, etc..., quite the opposite.

But I think the relative difficulty to connect to various servers running various mods (compared to other games offering the same kind of modding) has put away many people, and this, added to other issues like performance, animations (combined with bad memories from ArmA1), is part of the cause of the loss of OFP PvP players.

And this situation could be made better by BI, not by going against mods, but in the opposite, by facilitating distribution of mods, for example from in-game.

This would solve part of the issues listed in OP (and again, only part of the reasons why I think we lost some of the original player base, but any step is good)

And about numbers, and making sense, I never said we lost 95% of OFP player base. I said I don't see anymore 95% of the PvP population I was seeing in OFP. C&H and CTF servers were numerous, back then.

[norsu 180]

I think redesigned multiplayer browser would be a good start. Right now it's impossible to tell what addons server is running before joining in. In OFP it was very easy to see if server was running WGL, FDFmod, FFUR etc. because the addon folders were displayed right under the server. Current A2 browser is a mess really. Even basic features such as listing players or adding favourites are missing.

An addon comparison dialog where you could compare what addons the server is running would be great. It would immediately inform which pbo files are outdated, different or missing and which match 100%. Since players can use different mod folders, this comparison should be targeted at pbo files.

[hund 0]

The lack of PvP is partly caused by the game not handling that kind of gameplay too well (in my opinion, at least), but another reason is that the greater games industry had a coop wave a couple of years back, and it is still going.

A redesign of the server browser would be a really cool thing. It doesn't have to be a grand download machine or anything, as long as it does the job of informing the player what the server is up to, so he can act accordingly without having to connect in vain a few hundred times.

[eggbeast 3673]

Norsu - you hit the nail squarely on the head mate

There are a few interconnected problems:

a) we don't easily know which mods to install - so we have to write down each missing pbo file at each join fail and then google them and hope they are the same versions...

I recently made a modded evolution panthera and put a mod list withthe mission launch page in the forum, but most people won't look there, they'll just try to join the server...

b) we can't see which servers are modded - in most MP games they have a modded column with a little spanner or whatever in it and you can fliter them on/off easily.

c) when you try to connect to a server it should offer you feedback on ALL the pbos you're missing not just the few you can see in the window.

d) when you try to join a server, mods could be downloaded from a separate redirected download server (as they were in call of duty united offensive) which reduces lag etc and you get temporarily disconnected from the server while downloading the mods. server hosts provide the download server space when you rent your server. Then mods are downloaded into a custom mod folder for each server (which could be a problem - i guess - some kind of comparison would be good with a dialogue asking you where you want to put them and confirming any overwrites etc) or perhaps for each mod... this would mean you could join any server, downloadthe mods and mission and then restart the game (from inside the game, not to desktop) then in you go...

how hard is this to write? probably very, given differences between windows xp/vista/7 etc

original call of duty had it sorted - look there BIS if you want easy answer, although it was pre-vista, so new folders in the mydocuments would be needed instead, but hey you d othis for the missions and custom sounds already right?

a glorious 2.0 patch could have this functionality built in and we'd all be happy for a while...

[Zipper5 74]

It's not really that hard to tell which servers are modded and which aren't simply by looking at the mission being played and the server name. Look for ACE/ACE2 or any other mod names, or the @ sign, or something similar. That indicates that addons are being used. Though I would always welcome a mod filter, as you say.

I could probably go online right now and find a vanilla server in a few seconds, granted that most are playing Evolution/Domination/giant coops. I agree - that is a problem; lack of variety in maps.

What's not broken does not need to be fixed. It was almost exactly the same in OFP, yet the MP community then was incredibly active and were using all sorts of mods. I think it's simply that people are getting more and more lazy, and want more and more of that plug-'n'-play functionality. Well, I doubt you'll ever find that in BIS' games.

[whisper 0]

And adding plug'n'play functionalities would hurt the game how?

[Pain0815 10]

Get addon sync and a few servers you like to play on.

You can easy sync your mods and load them with that program, most modded servers have websites with lists of mods they used, own modpacks or yoma sync mirrors.

But you have to get active before playing, but i think its good as it is.

In other 0815 out of the box games you find hundreds of servers running one out of 10 or less maps.

Here in Arma is a amount of unlimited scenarios possible, dont forget that.

Edited April 1, 2010 by Pain0815

[SnR 1]

Alpinestars Arma Launcher will show you what @addons are used server side once you have filtered.

[galzohar 31]

People are ditching the game way before they get to the point of using launchers and synchronizers/updaters. The server browser allowing server admins to show at least 1 page rather than 5 words to players before they connect, it would be a huge step in the right direction. Right now new players don't even have a way to find out wtf is that whacky error message they're getting when they try joining a server without having at least some mediocre google and computer skills.

[UKMERC 10]

heres the thing most servers out there are ran by units/clans/communities whatever you want to call them if you see a few people on there and try to join and get booted head to the website of that unit/clan/commuinity and get the comms system they use TS3/2 vent whatever and ask this is not hard to do im only 6 months into PC gaming and i didnt find it hard because i wasnt scared in asking for help. rather than posting such a stupid post as saying YOU CANT PLAY THIS GAME IN MULITPLAYER which if he went CAN SOMEONE HELP ME IM HAVING TROUBLE FIGURING OUT THE MULTIPLAYER he would of had a lot less negative comments.

[whisper 0]

Ofc it was badly presented, etc...

But... that's does not remove the fact that things could be done better, and doing things better would not hurt the game

[galzohar 31]

Like I said, you are requiring the average gamer to have some basic google and computer skills which they simply don't have and/or don't have the patience to use just to relax playing a game, no matter what kind of game it is. Note that again I am not talking at all about what the game requires from you inside the game, but rather what it requires before you even get in.

[Aeneas2020 10]

Ofc it was badly presented, etc...

But... that's does not remove the fact that things could be done better, and doing things better would not hurt the game

Agree with ur second point mate, as i said in my original post i wasnt trying to get at you I just wanted to show how someone with an unbiased view might look at your logic. Anyway...this topic can be debated over and over but it is really up to BIS and not the community to act on anything they wish to.

[norsu 180]

Alpinestars Arma Launcher will show you what @addons are used server side once you have filtered.

I use that launcher and it's a step into right direction. Something like that just needs to be inserted into game as default. Also unfortunately even Alpinestars launcher can't display individual pbos. For example if a server is running mod folder @XYZ, how do I really know whats inside it?

BIS needs to realize that their multiplayer is and has always been full of different mods but there has never been an in-game solution to properly handle all that variety. And that is the biggest problem for new players who simply want to play the game with or without mods. Heck even I'm starting to get annoyed at the current mess and I've been playing since the first OFP demo :p.

[Richey79 10]

It's funny to see all the different viewpoints in a thread like this, and people get quite passionate about defending why their vision of A2's MP is 'right'. The following is not a rant and is meant in good humour. It's not my intention to insult something that many here value greatly and which has taken some passionate people a lot of care and attention to produce.

I really enjoyed MP when this game was released, for maybe five months. Then I gave up and decided to stick to SP.

My reasons?

So many connection errors,

Constantly crashing servers,

Constantly crashing clients,

50 different servers, all with three people playing on them,

Bots warping all over like they were teleporting rather than walking,

Constant 20 fps and stutter that got worse as the server went on,

Features randomly bugging out,

'Only me and my two friends are allowed to use the aircraft' syndrome.

ACE mod stopped working for me properly recently (the non-adjustable NVG problem that made NV stutter like crazy), so I reinstalled my copy of A2 and started from scratch, installing only the addons I actually like and dumping ACE.

Wow. Suddenly, the game is running about a third faster in SP.

I join one of the few vanilla servers left.

Wow.

The game runs twice as fast (actually playable as an FPS),

The server doesn't crash,

The clients don't crash,

No 'red chain of death',

A nicer atmosphere with people working together and not bossing each other about (assholes were still kicked within seconds, though),

Game suddenly back to being about fun - I didn't have the feeling of 'OMG, where's the realism gone?' that I thought I would.

I'm actually enjoying Arma2 MP again. If you're feeling tired of the constant MP bugs, crashes and feeling like you're wading through treacle, I'd recommend trying without ACE. It would be a shame, after BIS have improved performance so much over the many beta patches, to kick all those improvements out the door by worshipping a mod.

Well, one good thing has come from all the mod requirements in the MP community. At least you don't need all your addons 'keyed' (this led to getting kicked from far more servers than needing extra addons ever did).

I'm looking forward to the fortnight after OA is released when there will be players and servers playing the vanilla game (not looking forward to the return of the base-raping 'tards, though).

Likewise PR. I personally think A2 excells at PVP. It just doesn't work with several hundred scripts running in the background and more than 50 players.

That was the biggest load of BS post I ever made.

I think my copy of A2 must have had some corrupted files or something, and I simply wasn't finding well-managed servers to play on.

ACE2's performance isn't that bad on a properly set-up server and it's well worth the fps cost for what it adds. Apologies to anyone I annoyed by spouting rubbish.

I do hope an update soon fixes the NVGs, though.

Edited May 28, 2010 by Richey79

[JayRiot_ 10]

ACE2 isn't the only mod being used in MP, there are many more. The servers tend to say whether or not addons or mods are being used in their names, or through putting the @ sign somewhere in their server name or mission name. I always find there are an abundance of vanilla servers so I have no need to download mods necessarily.

Also, you have BattlEye, which may kick you due to connectivity issues you are having. That is a tough nut to crack, as I have found out. Thankfully it doesn't happen often.

Finally, you must make sure your game is patched to the latest patch, in this case it's v1.05. Otherwise you will be kicked from most games due to obvious reasons.

Do you not play games for singleplayer aspects, though? ArmA II is pretty unique in that regard.

Calling Arma's MP 'unique' is a poor attempt to hide it's massive flaws. When it works, it's amazing, but that's rare. There's no excuse for the horrible interface. This game has potential, but it's ridiculously difficult to get even a taste of that.

@OP, you're only real hope is to play with people you know instead of joining random servers. You can add me on steam if ya got it. JayRiot_

[jw custom 56]

When it works, it's amazing, but that's rare.

Thanks for informing me, i've have been playing MP since ArmA 2 demo not knowing it didn't work :rolleyes:

[metsapeikkoo 10]

Calling Arma's MP 'unique' is a poor attempt to hide it's massive flaws. When it works, it's amazing, but that's rare. There's no excuse for the horrible interface. This game has potential, but it's ridiculously difficult to get even a taste of that.

@OP, you're only real hope is to play with people you know instead of joining random servers. You can add me on steam if ya got it. JayRiot_

That's funny. I thought the MP worked. Maybe its a bug that my MP has been working for the last year or so and yours hasn't?

[JayRiot_ 10]

That's funny. I thought the MP worked. Maybe its a bug that my MP has been working for the last year or so and yours hasn't?

Context is hard to grasp, huh?

[Taxman 10]

Mine works :)

[Infam0us 10]

Mine works :)

Mine does too :butbut:

[Zipper5 74]

Same here. Not that I actually want to play it in the public scene's current state... :p

[qwertz 10]

Mine works too. And I want to play it in the public scene's current state. And I even enjoy it. :cheers:

Edited May 26, 2010 by qwertz