FP : DR - News & Discussion

[Guest]

taken directly from http://www.videogamer.com/xbox360/op...ew-1911-2.html

Quote:

If Codemasters is going to have a big hit on its hands with Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising the game's going to have to sell to more than just the hardcore military fans. While sales up there with Halo and Call of Duty is probably out of the question, a big multi-format project like this will need to sell millions of units to be classed as a success. With this in mind I donned my Call of Duty helmet and Halo battle armour to check out a few levels of Codies' war sim in order to find out if normal people will be able to last more than five seconds in Operation Flashpoint's brutal battlefield.

To give you the answer you probably didn't want: yes and no. Chances are that anyone groomed on the likes of Call of Duty, Halo, Resistance, Gears of War and Killzone will run up the first hill they encounter during Dragon Rising's tutorial level and be gunned down before they even get a whiff of any danger, let alone see it. This will then be repeated a few times, with a man hiding behind a small wall at the top of the hill taking you out over and over again until it becomes quite obvious that you're doing it wrong. This is not that open world Call of Duty you've dreamt of for years. This is a completely different take on the military first-person shooter, and you're going to have to learn the hard way.

Most of the time you'll be fighting against enemies that you can't even see, taking cover from tracer fire originating from a position only clearly visible through binoculars. Fire from that range isn't too accurate, but it's still dangerous to be walking about in the open. In order to move from position to position you'll need to get your squad mates to lay down suppressive fire on the enemy's location and then leg it to a new cover spot, repeating the procedure every time you move. It makes for a hugely tense experience, always knowing that your next step might be your last, but it's also not something that'll please everyone.

Part of what makes video games so enjoyable is how you can lose yourself in the experience, but in Dragon Rising you're constantly being taken out of it to take a look at the 'restart from last checkpoint' screen. It's part and parcel of the military sim experience, but that doesn't mean it's good fun and will be jarring to many gamers until they've come to terms with how the game needs to be played. Using your squad mates correctly, issuing orders to set defensive or offensive positions, and sending them to locations on the map all needs to be done if you're going to have any chance of completing a mission.

One shot to the head can be instant death, as you'd expect it to be, but you can do some running repairs to yourself and squad mates while out in the field. By equipping bandages you're able to patch up wounds to stop the bleeding, keeping you alive but not acting as a miracle health pack. There's also none of the usual 'keep out of trouble for a few moments to replenish your health' - you can hide, but you might bleed to death if you sit there doing nothing.

Back to that hill that caused so much trouble early on then. After taking out the single man ducking behind a small wall the view from the summit reveals an early warning radar - a device your squad has been tasked with destroying. It'll only take a single remote charge to blow it to smithereens, but getting there, down a steep hill that leaves you perilously open to enemy fire, isn't easy. As soon as you peek out over the peak bullets start raining in on your position, hitting the soft ground and sending dirt into your eyes, temporarily worsening your vision.

No doubt there are countless ways to tackle such a problem, but the most obvious seemed for me to lay down some fire on the enemy's position while the rest of my squad flanked them down the right of the hill. It worked, and soon enough a charge had been placed and the radar was no longer in working order. Next up came the most exciting part of the two levels on offer. An order came in to send in an air strike on an enemy-held village at the bottom of the valley on the other side of the hill. With binoculars equipped you're able to target a location and then send in a hail of howitzers. It would have been more exciting still had the work in progress Xbox 360 build actually shown the destruction as more than buildings popping out of view (presumably a glitch that won't be present in the final game), but it was fun all the same.

It was a sprint across the island to the chopper's LZ next, mopping up any enemies along the way, including a few nipping about in jeeps. Something that really needs a special mention is the audio work. With a good surround sound set-up I dare say Dragon Rising could have the most immersive audio of any FPS ever created. Jeeps growl, enemies rustle in bushes, helicopters thunder overhead, and bullets whiz past as if only millimetres from your virtual face. It really is hugely impressive and even manages to better the impressive, if somewhat glitchy open-world environment.

By the second mission - a small-scale assault starting on a beach - you'll likely feel more comfortable with the controls, but any confidence is short lived. My squad had been tasked with taking out the spotters at the top of a hill (there are lots of hills in Dragon Rising), but no sooner had one of my guys informed me of their position (issued with handy information on their compass direction and distance from you) had the three of them been shot dead. I won't lie: mission two proved too much for my simple FPS mind to take, with a later section involving a fairly heavily guarded village too tricky for my wannabe marines.

After countless failures, restarts and head scratching I'm still nowhere near to being up to speed with Dragon Rising's rules of combat. Getting your head around the slow pace, the orders menu, the reliance on cover and instant death is something that a lot of people simply won't have the patience for, and that's surely a concern for Codemasters. Easier difficulty settings don't really make the game simpler in the traditional way, instead offering more assistance in the way of highlighted enemies on your compass and illuminated bullets, and a RV system shows you where you've got to go. Only time will tell if all that is enough to give arcade action gamers a real chance of success.

[Grimnirsson 0]

Interesting read, thanks. Part of the problem is that the milsim crowd is a minority compared to the 'arcade shooter' folks. I hope that DR can teach the latter a different style of play to enjoy, so we get enough players in for this game and that for a longer time. Many players mean support by the company and full servers if you are searching for a session. Otherwise the game could be short-lived no matter how good it is - simwise. Only time will tell.

Grim

[GLeek 10]

The editor uses lua scripting for the more complex things, but you can drag a bunch of soldiers and vehicles into an area on the 2D map and just start playing. Its easy to set general variables like the time of day but more tricky if you want to way point a bunch of trucks to drive in a convoy.

crappy game. proly not a sim either . move along , nothing to see here ...

[echo1 0]

The editor uses lua scripting for the more complex things, but you can drag a bunch of soldiers and vehicles into an area on the 2D map and just start playing. Its easy to set general variables like the time of day but more tricky if you want to way point a bunch of trucks to drive in a convoy.

crappy game. proly not a sim either . move along , nothing to see here ...

And you based this assesment on what is basically a description of OFP/ArmA's editor? (minus the lua scripting)

On the flipside of the fanboy scale -

All those who hate Dragon Rising, remember this: I get to play 2 great games, you only get one.

How do you know OFP DR is going to be great if you haven't played it

[Guest]

And you based this assesment on what is basically a description of OFP/ArmA's editor? (minus the lua scripting)

On the flipside of the fanboy scale -

How do you know OFP DR is going to be great if you haven't played it

Becuase its very obvious from the videos what the gameplay will be, the sameway I knew and still kow what arma 2 would feel like. Its not as realistic, but its beyond any console game by a long way.

So i do know, from my human abilities to judge evidence :)

[thesun 14]

Could you please foresee something else for us? Really, saying something like "i know how it will be, because i've seen all the videos (most of them CGI) and screenshost (a lot of CGI as well)" is really dumb. No offense.

[ricbar89 0]

Could you please foresee something else for us? Really, saying something like "i know how it will be, because i've seen all the videos (most of them CGI) and screenshost (a lot of CGI as well)" is really dumb. No offense.

Theres also plenty of gameplay videos out now, or are we not meant to judge from them either?

If not how are we ever supposed to have any idea of what any comming game is like?

[thesun 14]

Still most of the gameplay videos are mostly the same, one squad storming a village, one squad storming a hill, one squad..... sorry but have yet to see atleast a platoon sized unit and it controls. The command bar looks ok for a game where you control a squad but id'like how can you effectively control a platoon or company with it.

[ck-claw 1]

Theres also plenty of gameplay videos out now,are we not meant to judge from them either?

Not if you listen to some peeps "how dare you judge a game thats not released yet" ? :D

[hoot 0]

[...]

An area of operation is by definition an restricted area because if every soldier can do what he likes and go wherever he wants to in a mission you won't achieve anything. I thought that you guys are so much after 'realism'? Why then this fear that the game is restricting the player? If you are a soldier you are restricted to follow orders, that's your job.

Grim

Nice answer, lol. I can actually take this to explain it all! I was meaning an encircled area in the game that you cannot leave without getting punished during a mission, and i guess you knew that, so spare me this logic please!

[echo1 0]

So i do know, from my human abilities to judge evidence :)

Or to be pulled in by advertising...

Not if you listen to some peeps "how dare you judge a game thats not released yet" ?

QFT

[ricbar89 0]

Or to be pulled in by advertising...

QFT

Isnt that the whole point, they show you something you want and then you buy the game? Is it any different when OFP, ARMA and ARMAII came out? BIS showed you what they aimed to do, you liked it and ran to the shopes to buy their games.

Were people not allowed to judge before those games came out? I dont remember many complaints then.

And QFT? Think he's making a joke that you generally have some idea of what you're getting before a game comes out, or why else would you be interested? Something you dont seem to be agreeing with.

Edited August 14, 2009 by ricbar89

[Guest]

It is very true, the arma 2 community is a bunch of unfriendly fanboys. I've been in these forums alot, alot more than the dragon rising forums. And already i don't like coming here anymore, simply due to the stubborness of some of you.

There are about 2 arma bashers in the DR forums, but most of the guys accept its a great game and that its the true simulation. All you guys do is constantly talk shit out about what the game will be like. You change your opinions when and how it suits you.

I KNOW dragon rising will be a good game, because i am not a hypocriticle fanboy. I love both games and i understand they they EXCEL in their OWN UNIQUE ways. I don't want dragon rising as a replacement, i want it as an adition.

Yes, some of the dev's talk about crap, *16*km viewdistance yadada. You lot all do the same for arma 2, stop bitching.

Edit:

GamersGlobal:

http://www.gamersglobal.de/angeteste...-dragon-rising

“Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising seems to be a worthy sequel to the ingenious first part. It is as remorseless, hard and versatile as Bohemia Interactive’s original was then. We do hope that Codemasters will not commit the same mistakes as Bohemia did with its Armed Assault games: Including too many features without proper testing and releasing the game way to early. Considering the first two missions we played, we are pretty confident that this is not going to happen with OFP: DR. This game is not designed to attract Rambo, because as soon as you pop up your head on the wrong side of the bush you might have done your final mistake. We are going to be very careful on October 8th 2009.â€

Every preview is shaping up like this, i think its saying something. CM are not like EA where they can offord to pay people to say such things, so please, don't be so hateful. I was never hateful for arma 2, and in the same way i will not hate Dragon Rising until i have at least tried it.

Edited August 14, 2009 by Guest

[froggyluv 2130]

It is very true, the arma 2 community is a bunch of unfriendly fanboys. I've been in these forums alot, alot more than the dragon rising forums. And already i don't like coming here anymore, simply due to the stubborness of some of you.

There are about 2 arma bashers in the DR forums, but most of the guys accept its a great game and that its the true simulation. All you guys do is constantly talk shit out about what the game will be like. You change your opinions when and how it suits you.

I KNOW dragon rising will be a good game, because i am not a hypocriticle fanboy. I love both games and i understand they they EXCEL in their OWN UNIQUE ways. I don't want dragon rising as a replacement, i want it as an adition.

Yes, some of the dev's talk about crap, *16*km viewdistance yadada. You lot all do the same for arma 2, stop bitching.

.

Theres been shit talking on both forums and from I've seen ,the Arma2 thread over there is pretty much dead and buried. Most of the guys complimenting it over there were original Bi guys and some felt chased outta there. You say you love both games but i've also seen you post that you're ready to shelve Arm2 which is fine but doesn't really back your statement. I think most people here are OFP and hardcore mil-sim fans rather than the oh-so-mentioned 'fanboi', who just are somewhat protctive of the franchise name. If DR kicks ass, I'll be one of the first people here to declare it as my loyalty is to the genre, not any company. People who are long time mil-sim fans do see problems with DR living up to there previous claims and there is nothing wrong with voicing those concerns.

[echo1 0]

And QFT? Think he's making a joke that you generally have some idea of what you're getting before a game comes out, or why else would you be interested? Something you dont seem to be agreeing with.

I'm not really too sure what you are getting at here. There are some people who are saying "LOL OFP DR is going to be shit" and "LOL OFP DR is going to be amazing". Both statements are wrong for the same reason.

The comparison with ArmA II isn't accurate - I've played two BIS games before, and therefore I had a good idea of what to expect. Codemasters has never made such a game before, so I'm going to suspend judgement till I actually play the thing for myself. I've seen plenty of games that had cool videos and cool pictures and turned out to be shit, so excuse me if I'm just a little bit too cynical for taking things on face value.

It is very true, the arma 2 community is a bunch of unfriendly fanboys. I've been in these forums alot, alot more than the dragon rising forums. And already i don't like coming here anymore, simply due to the stubborness of some of you.

...

I KNOW dragon rising will be a good game, because i am not a hypocriticle fanboy. I love both games and i understand they they EXCEL in their OWN UNIQUE ways. I don't want dragon rising as a replacement, i want it as an adition.

It's funny, you didn't say anything when I chastised an OFP DR basher for his equally foundless claims. Again, you talk about how OFP DR "EXCELS" but this is my point - how do you know how? If you think it's fair to say that OFP DR is going to be a great game based on some pictures, you also have to accept the people who think it's going to be a crap game based on the pictures.

Basically, what I'm saying is that the proof of the pudding is in the eating, juding the game by pictures is just a pissing competition.

There are about 2 arma bashers in the DR forums, but most of the guys accept its a great game and that its the true simulation. All you guys do is constantly talk shit out about what the game will be like. You change your opinions when and how it suits you.

From what I've read on that forum, I think you're giving a very rose tinted version of events.

Edited August 14, 2009 by echo1

[Guest]

Theres been shit talking on both forums and from I've seen ,the Arma2 thread over there is pretty much dead and buried. Most of the guys complimenting it over there were original Bi guys and some felt chased outta there. You say you love both games but i've also seen you post that you're ready to shelve Arm2 which is fine but doesn't really back your statement. I think most people here are OFP and hardcore mil-sim fans rather than the oh-so-mentioned 'fanboi', who just are somewhat protctive of the franchise name. If DR kicks ass, I'll be one of the first people here to declare it as my loyalty is to the genre, not any company. People who are long time mil-sim fans do see problems with DR living up to there previous claims and there is nothing wrong with voicing those concerns.

I agree, but the attitude and mentality that these concerns are put across are completely wrong, on both forums. The difference is all of us Arma 2 guys are way more agressive with the whole ordeal.

Who cares if codemaster have the name, its just a bloody name. If the game is fantastic thats fine, its lived up to the name. If the game fails, fine, it will die and no one will care.

There is too much argumental crap going on. If you all hate it why did you make a thread about it in your forums? Maybe this thread should just be locked.

Its stupid.

[froggyluv 2130]

@richiespeed13 - Maybe thats true that it is more aggressive here thats hard to gauge. But just look at the poll, the large majority are waiting to try the demo, not being defiant blockheads who refuse to even check it out.

Just ignore the negativity if it bothers you at least until the game is released when things will be based on actual experience rather than press releases and promises :p

Edited August 14, 2009 by froggyluv

[Guest]

@richiespeed13 - Maybe thats true that it is more aggressive here thats hard to gauge. But just look at the poll, the large majority are waiting to try the demo, not being defiant blockheads who refuse to even check it out.

Just ignore the negativity if it bothers you at least until the game is released when things will be based on actual experience rather than press releases and promises :p

Yeah i agree, thanks :)

I made the poll btw :D

[Sennacherib 0]

I wait also the demo. I only hope that ofp:dr will be more interesting than the arma's. we have always the same stuff since ofp. only eyecandy stuff are new but the gameplay, the armies etc etc are always the same. Personally i need something fresh, with of course a little bit of the original ofp. :)

I like the vids, and i don't need the track-ir thing which is just a gadget.

[ricbar89 0]

The comparison with ArmA II isn't accurate - I've played two BIS games before, and therefore I had a good idea of what to expect. Codemasters has never made such a game before, so I'm going to suspend judgement till I actually play the thing for myself. I've seen plenty of games that had cool videos and cool pictures and turned out to be shit, so excuse me if I'm just a little bit too cynical for taking things on face value.

I'm not really too sure what you are getting at here. There are some people who are saying "LOL OFP DR is going to be shit" and "LOL OFP DR is going to be amazing". Both statements are wrong for the same reason.

The point im making is you can at least get an idea of what to expect at gameplay wise from watching...gameplay. You're right, some really hyped games have turned out to be crap, and most of the time people have started to realise how crap these games are around the time gameplay/preview/reviews start arriving on the net.

You're foggeting the whole host of previews that have said the game is great, and unlike either of us they have played the game.

So going by screens, gameplay and previews its not to unfair that richie can make at least some judgement on how the game will turn out, both realism wise and how good he can expect it to be.

[Soldier of Anarchy 10]

My biggest gripe with Codemasters was early on, where they took all the credit for OFP, saying DR, will be a series of firsts in (gaming) ,open world / sand box in a warzone, weapon realism, and other things OFP - ARMA already did long befor.

Now they say (on consoles), which could be right since most console games are realism/intelligence deprived.

I really don't go outa way to look at DR info , I will hold judgment on the game until it ships/demo. As long as Codie's watch what they say ,I have no problems with them.

[Grimnirsson 0]

I was meaning an encircled area in the game that you cannot leave without getting punished during a mission, and i guess you knew that, so spare me this logic please!

I know that you meant that. And my answer still stands. There's no such area in the sense that the game will punish you like other games do (you can't go further, you die, you are wounded, whatever), but punishment can happen. It's the situation that will punish you, in the same way as it would be in real life. There are enemies around the area of operation and if they see you there's the danger that you get killed. Or in the case that your order is to stop a convoy before it reaches a certain location, if you choose to walk around instead of doing your job, the commander will say that your unit failed in doing the job - because the convoy was not destroyed in time. That's what you can expect from DR in terms of punishment if you leave the area of operation. I don't really see your point, sorry. Or did I misunderstand you?

Grim

[GLeek 10]

It is very true, the arma 2 community is a bunch of unfriendly fanboys. I've been in these forums alot, alot more than the dragon rising forums. And already i don't like coming here anymore, simply due to the stubborness of some of you.

There are about 2 arma bashers in the DR forums, but most of the guys accept its a great game and that its the true simulation. All you guys do is constantly talk shit out about what the game will be like. You change your opinions when and how it suits you.

I KNOW dragon rising will be a good game, because i am not a hypocriticle fanboy. I love both games and i understand they they EXCEL in their OWN UNIQUE ways. I don't want dragon rising as a replacement, i want it as an adition.

Yes, some of the dev's talk about crap, *16*km viewdistance yadada. You lot all do the same for arma 2, stop bitching.

Edit:

GamersGlobal:

http://www.gamersglobal.de/angeteste...-dragon-rising

“Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising seems to be a worthy sequel to the ingenious first part. It is as remorseless, hard and versatile as Bohemia Interactive’s original was then. We do hope that Codemasters will not commit the same mistakes as Bohemia did with its Armed Assault games: Including too many features without proper testing and releasing the game way to early. Considering the first two missions we played, we are pretty confident that this is not going to happen with OFP: DR. This game is not designed to attract Rambo, because as soon as you pop up your head on the wrong side of the bush you might have done your final mistake. We are going to be very careful on October 8th 2009.â€

Every preview is shaping up like this, i think its saying something. CM are not like EA where they can offord to pay people to say such things, so please, don't be so hateful. I was never hateful for arma 2, and in the same way i will not hate Dragon Rising until i have at least tried it.

hey guy , the pb i have underlined is that OF:DR will not be any more than a play 'n drop game. seeing what tester said about editor, you are forced to admit the added value of game community will not be here with ofp2.

arma editor was , is, and will stay , and very high level program. very instinctive and easy to use. lua script in other hand need a scripter, even for move a trucj convoy ??? you bet... i even don't speak about poor polycount of vehicle, but i laughed when i saw the blackhawk. damn these poor console ...

anyway , thing are that . admit it . after 1 week of play (if you are not an hardcore gamer) , game will be vanished, and you will come back to arma2 ;)

[echo1 0]

The quote about the editor you posted earlier made it sound like ArmA's one. The only difference being that it uses lua as opposed to BIS' own scripting language. I'm sure that it will give an easy way to make simple missions without writing your own scripts.

Edited August 14, 2009 by echo1

[Guest]

hey guy , the pb i have underlined is that OF:DR will not be any more than a play 'n drop game. seeing what tester said about editor, you are forced to admit the added value of game community will not be here with ofp2.

arma editor was , is, and will stay , and very high level program. very instinctive and easy to use. lua script in other hand need a scripter, even for move a trucj convoy ??? you bet... i even don't speak about poor polycount of vehicle, but i laughed when i saw the blackhawk. damn these poor console ...

anyway , thing are that . admit it . after 1 week of play (if you are not an hardcore gamer) , game will be vanished, and you will come back to arma2 ;)

Nope, i think this game is a whole lot more than you guys think. You need to actually go to their forums and Listen and learn whats going on.

I find the development of the game very promising, it allready has a modding community. Also, lua scripts have been arounf or a very long time, their are countless articles of how to use them.